replacement heating oil tank location

[AW10]

We’re looking at a small house in Scotland that basically fully occupies its plot save for a small courtyard outside the front door. That courtyard is about 2m deep and 3m wide. Two sides are formed by the house walls and the other two by low boundary walls. At one end is the oil tank.



The current 600 litre tank is single skin steel, probably 25 years old. It’s showing signs of corrosion and is probably nearing the end of its service life. My understanding is building regs have changed and a standard oil tank can not be put in the same place as it’s too close to the window, the house wall and the boundary.

I have read about fire rated tanks but am struggling to find clarity about how close they can be to a window.

Is there a scenario where we would not be allowed to install any sort of replacement tank and be forced to change to electric heating? It’s not like an air pump is a viable option as space to locate it is equally constrained.

[smokey mow]

AW10 said:

Is there a scenario where we would not be allowed to install any sort of replacement tank and be forced to change to electric heating? It’s not like an air pump is a viable option as space to locate it is equally constrained.

No. There’s always the option to change the front window to a fixed shut 60EI fire rated window so this then provides the necessary fire protection to the oil tank.

[AW10]

Unexpected answer but thank you! That window is the only window for that room so potentially creates ventilation issues and would mean no lovely trickle vent.

[.:ian:.]

oftec said:

If it is impossible to comply with the separation distances, then a fire protection barrier (with a minimum 30 minutes fire rating) should be provided. The separation distance required between the tank and the fire barrier should be a minimal 300mm unless a greater distance is specified by the tank manufacturer. It is possible to site a fuel storage tank inside a garage or out-house; however, they need to be self-contained within a 60-minute fire rated chamber

Not sure what a 30 min fire rated barrier would consist of.

The guys that replaced my old steel tank were not concerned about the proximity of the shed as it was replacing an installation like for like. Not sure if that is legitimate or not

https://www.oftec.org/consumers/off-gas-grid-guide...

[Fallingup]

You'll only have a problem when it goes on fire and your insurance company refuses to pay out because it wasn't positioned safely.

[smokey mow]

AW10 said:

Unexpected answer but thank you! That window is the only window for that room so potentially creates ventilation issues and would mean no lovely trickle vent.

The fire protection only needs to extend 300mm higher and wider than the oil tank so you may still be able to have the right hand casement or a fanlight as openable for ventilation.

Edited by smokey mow on Sunday 23 February 18:37

[clockworks]

I was looking at replacing my failing oil tank last year. Although I did have room to legally fit a "normal" tank in the middle of the front or rear gardens, it would've been a proper eyesore. A fire-rated tank could've gone where the plastic one was, but the cost was prohibitive.

For around the same price, I switched to a heatpump. No regrets.

[skeeterm5]

At our last house we had an old tank replaced with a new one and it was too close to the window to pass the regs. The fitters installed a normal double bunded tank but then built a small fire screen between it and the window.

It looked sort of like a fence panel but was fire rated for long enough to pass the regs, as a recall it was far cheaper than a fire rated tank.

[quote=clockworks]

For around the same price, I switched to a heatpump. No regrets.[/]

For interest we are also in Scotland and have just had a heat pump removed and replaced with oil because it simply didn’t work in our house/location. If you do consider this route my advice would be to properly research it.

Edited by skeeterm5 on Monday 24th February 08:10

[DonkeyApple]

AW10 said:

We’re looking at a small house in Scotland that basically fully occupies its plot save for a small courtyard outside the front door. That courtyard is about 2m deep and 3m wide. Two sides are formed by the house walls and the other two by low boundary walls. At one end is the oil tank.



The current 600 litre tank is single skin steel, probably 25 years old. It’s showing signs of corrosion and is probably nearing the end of its service life. My understanding is building regs have changed and a standard oil tank can not be put in the same place as it’s too close to the window, the house wall and the boundary.

I have read about fire rated tanks but am struggling to find clarity about how close they can be to a window.

Is there a scenario where we would not be allowed to install any sort of replacement tank and be forced to change to electric heating? It’s not like an air pump is a viable option as space to locate it is equally constrained.

Isn't there a chance that ashp is actually the better option for the property? If it's not particularly large and the roof is properly insulated then would it not be worth just checking that leccy isn't better than oil? Leccy has a terrible PR in places like Scotland because of the large number of poorly insulted properties that were fitted with cheap electric heating systems but that doesn't absolutely mean that leccy isn't the right option if done correctly?

[Lotobear]

DonkeyApple said:

AW10 said:

We’re looking at a small house in Scotland that basically fully occupies its plot save for a small courtyard outside the front door. That courtyard is about 2m deep and 3m wide. Two sides are formed by the house walls and the other two by low boundary walls. At one end is the oil tank.



The current 600 litre tank is single skin steel, probably 25 years old. It’s showing signs of corrosion and is probably nearing the end of its service life. My understanding is building regs have changed and a standard oil tank can not be put in the same place as it’s too close to the window, the house wall and the boundary.

I have read about fire rated tanks but am struggling to find clarity about how close they can be to a window.

Is there a scenario where we would not be allowed to install any sort of replacement tank and be forced to change to electric heating? It’s not like an air pump is a viable option as space to locate it is equally constrained.

Isn't there a chance that ashp is actually the better option for the property? If it's not particularly large and the roof is properly insulated then would it not be worth just checking that leccy isn't better than oil? Leccy has a terrible PR in places like Scotland because of the large number of poorly insulted properties that were fitted with cheap electric heating systems but that doesn't absolutely mean that leccy isn't the right option if done correctly?

....oil will be far, far, cheaper than an ASHP or even gas regardless of how well the property is insulated.

[DonkeyApple]

Lotobear said:

....oil will be far, far, cheaper than an ASHP or even gas regardless of how well the property is insulated.

Is that so? I've no experience of oil other than a large tank that powered a communal heating system for my first flat and where every local minicab driver just took as much as they wanted. But I'd always been of the impression that oil sat as a last resort for when gas wasn't feasible and that it was a dearer means of heating a home?

[.:ian:.]

DonkeyApple said:

Lotobear said:

....oil will be far, far, cheaper than an ASHP or even gas regardless of how well the property is insulated.

Is that so? I've no experience of oil other than a large tank that powered a communal heating system for my first flat and where every local minicab driver just took as much as they wanted. But I'd always been of the impression that oil sat as a last resort for when gas wasn't feasible and that it was a dearer means of heating a home?

At the moment oil is about 60p/L which is about 6p/KWH in raw energy terms.

[Lotobear]

DonkeyApple said:

Lotobear said:

....oil will be far, far, cheaper than an ASHP or even gas regardless of how well the property is insulated.

Is that so? I've no experience of oil other than a large tank that powered a communal heating system for my first flat and where every local minicab driver just took as much as they wanted. But I'd always been of the impression that oil sat as a last resort for when gas wasn't feasible and that it was a dearer means of heating a home?

Always has been IME and has the added benefit of no standing charge and being able to watch the price and bunker up when it's low.

We heated our last house on oil for 28 years - a big old draughty place on a hill top with only moderate insulation. Recently moved to a brand new much smaller house with an ASHP and B rated EPC (highly insulated/air tight). I'd say it's probably about the same to heat as our old one but without the added convenience of 'on-off' control.

I expect it would be super cheap to run if I disconnected the ASHP and struck on an outside oil boiler and tank in it's place

[eltawater]

I've found that any cost benefits of oil for heating are balanced out by the electricity costs of the hob and oven.

[clockworks]

Lotobear said:

....oil will be far, far, cheaper than an ASHP or even gas regardless of how well the property is insulated.

That's simply not the case - as long as the heatpump installation is designed and installed properly.

There are some occupancy patterns that do better with short blasts of heating - holiday homes, second homes that sit empty, nobody at home all day.
For a house that needs to be kept relatively warm most of the time, heat is heat. The cost per kWH of heat is slightly more expensive on a standard tariff than oil, but cheaper if you get on a suitable tariff.

I'm in a 1960's 4 bed detached bungalow, EPC E. We were using 900 litres of oil per year, and only heating occupied rooms.
We are now keeping the whole house warm 24/7 with a heatpump, and the numbers suggest it'll cost less than £700 a year.
Worst day so far, 29kWH, best day 9kWH. £6 a day worst case on Octopus Intelligent Go.

My average unit cost is less than 20p, so 6p per kWH of heat - better than gas.

[Lotobear]

clockworks said:

Lotobear said:

....oil will be far, far, cheaper than an ASHP or even gas regardless of how well the property is insulated.

That's simply not the case - as long as the heatpump installation is designed and installed properly.

There are some occupancy patterns that do better with short blasts of heating - holiday homes, second homes that sit empty, nobody at home all day.
For a house that needs to be kept relatively warm most of the time, heat is heat. The cost per kWH of heat is slightly more expensive on a standard tariff than oil, but cheaper if you get on a suitable tariff.

I'm in a 1960's 4 bed detached bungalow, EPC E. We were using 900 litres of oil per year, and only heating occupied rooms.
We are now keeping the whole house warm 24/7 with a heatpump, and the numbers suggest it'll cost less than £700 a year.
Worst day so far, 29kWH, best day 9kWH. £6 a day worst case on Octopus Intelligent Go.

My average unit cost is less than 20p, so 6p per kWH of heat - better than gas.

My personal experience of running both, as posted earlier, very much confirms to me that it is the case (FWIW we are on the Octopus Cosy tariff).

Even taking into account that our old house was an E, and much larger as well as being subject to severe exposure (on the top of a hill in Cumbria, and solid walled), and our new one is B and significantly smaller and in a sheltered location our overall energy bills are projected to be more than our old oil fired house. We never run the upstairs heating in our new house either.

That is setting aside the fact that an ASHP system is inflexible compared to an on off conventional system - we have got used to it and it's not as bad as we feared it would be cost wise but there is absolutley no doubt it is more expensive than our old ( and that disregards the capital outlay)

You can't ignore the fact that heat pumps use electricty and that is the most expensive form of energy. If I binned it and plugged in an oil fired boiler we would save a fortune with the EPC we have.

[skeeterm5]

clockworks said:

That's simply not the case - as long as the heatpump installation is designed and installed properly.

There are some occupancy patterns that do better with short blasts of heating - holiday homes, second homes that sit empty, nobody at home all day.
For a house that needs to be kept relatively warm most of the time, heat is heat. The cost per kWH of heat is slightly more expensive on a standard tariff than oil, but cheaper if you get on a suitable tariff.

I'm in a 1960's 4 bed detached bungalow, EPC E. We were using 900 litres of oil per year, and only heating occupied rooms.
We are now keeping the whole house warm 24/7 with a heatpump, and the numbers suggest it'll cost less than £700 a year.
Worst day so far, 29kWH, best day 9kWH. £6 a day worst case on Octopus Intelligent Go.

My average unit cost is less than 20p, so 6p per kWH of heat - better than gas.

Without wishing to derail the thread, for every “it works” I am sure you can find “no it doesn’t”.

Your experience is absolutely not my experience of ASHP which was hellish expensive to run, unresponsive to rapid temperature fluctuations and struggled with any temperatures below -5c despite being rated to -20c.

As posted earlier, we have just replaced our ASHP with oil and it has been transformational in terms of indoor comfort and cost.