electric heating?
Discussion
We have an 800sq ft terrace which only has an electricity supply. I'm trying to work out how best to heat it. This isn't necessarily just about the cheapest option as I shall need some remote access and controllability. It's not occupied all the time so we need background heat through the winter and the ability to crank it up for when we use it.
Currently heating is slightly random. We have a couple of very old storage heaters that were already there on a e7 tariff, a wifi electric oil towel rail, a small oil radiator and 2 woodburners.
Initially I thought I'd remove the storage heaters and replace with new wifi electric radiators, rointe or the like. These clearly are not the cheapest option but allow us the control we would like. I see we can get new HHR storage heaters some of which have remote control or we could go the whole hog and look at ASHP but this will mean plumbing the whole house for CH which is perhaps more than we had planned just yet.
This winter we are spending about £3 a day which includes a couple of weekends use a month. Now we may be able to reduce that through trial and error with background heat levels but this has the rad stats set at 14 degrees when we aren't there for 10 hours a day, evenings and mornings. When we are there it covers eveything, showers, cooking heating etc.
We aren't actually using a e7 tariff currently.
Next door have GCH so the supply is there but would be a more major undertaking and cost.
What do others do who only have electric options for power and heating?
Currently heating is slightly random. We have a couple of very old storage heaters that were already there on a e7 tariff, a wifi electric oil towel rail, a small oil radiator and 2 woodburners.
Initially I thought I'd remove the storage heaters and replace with new wifi electric radiators, rointe or the like. These clearly are not the cheapest option but allow us the control we would like. I see we can get new HHR storage heaters some of which have remote control or we could go the whole hog and look at ASHP but this will mean plumbing the whole house for CH which is perhaps more than we had planned just yet.
This winter we are spending about £3 a day which includes a couple of weekends use a month. Now we may be able to reduce that through trial and error with background heat levels but this has the rad stats set at 14 degrees when we aren't there for 10 hours a day, evenings and mornings. When we are there it covers eveything, showers, cooking heating etc.
We aren't actually using a e7 tariff currently.
Next door have GCH so the supply is there but would be a more major undertaking and cost.
What do others do who only have electric options for power and heating?
DKL said:
We have an 800sq ft terrace which only has an electricity supply. I'm trying to work out how best to heat it. This isn't necessarily just about the cheapest option as I shall need some remote access and controllability. It's not occupied all the time so we need background heat through the winter and the ability to crank it up for when we use it.
Currently heating is slightly random. We have a couple of very old storage heaters that were already there on a e7 tariff, a wifi electric oil towel rail, a small oil radiator and 2 woodburners.
Initially I thought I'd remove the storage heaters and replace with new wifi electric radiators, rointe or the like. These clearly are not the cheapest option but allow us the control we would like. I see we can get new HHR storage heaters some of which have remote control or we could go the whole hog and look at ASHP but this will mean plumbing the whole house for CH which is perhaps more than we had planned just yet.
This winter we are spending about £3 a day which includes a couple of weekends use a month. Now we may be able to reduce that through trial and error with background heat levels but this has the rad stats set at 14 degrees when we aren't there for 10 hours a day, evenings and mornings. When we are there it covers eveything, showers, cooking heating etc.
We aren't actually using a e7 tariff currently.
Next door have GCH so the supply is there but would be a more major undertaking and cost.
What do others do who only have electric options for power and heating?
How well insulated is the property, this can make a big difference to the viability of heating via electricity, and also if E7 is worthwhile.Currently heating is slightly random. We have a couple of very old storage heaters that were already there on a e7 tariff, a wifi electric oil towel rail, a small oil radiator and 2 woodburners.
Initially I thought I'd remove the storage heaters and replace with new wifi electric radiators, rointe or the like. These clearly are not the cheapest option but allow us the control we would like. I see we can get new HHR storage heaters some of which have remote control or we could go the whole hog and look at ASHP but this will mean plumbing the whole house for CH which is perhaps more than we had planned just yet.
This winter we are spending about £3 a day which includes a couple of weekends use a month. Now we may be able to reduce that through trial and error with background heat levels but this has the rad stats set at 14 degrees when we aren't there for 10 hours a day, evenings and mornings. When we are there it covers eveything, showers, cooking heating etc.
We aren't actually using a e7 tariff currently.
Next door have GCH so the supply is there but would be a more major undertaking and cost.
What do others do who only have electric options for power and heating?
I have a 800sq ft flat, that is heated via electricity - straightforward direct heaters with timers, its actually rented out and so I am not sure of the exact costs, but its reasonable.
£3 per day is approx 10Kwh ? or is that also including the standing charge (approx 50p?) and so about 7Kwh?
If you could insulate, and move to overnight charging of remotely controlled storage heaters this would be cheaper, but not sure how effective this would be in keeping the place warm into the evening
£3 is everything, standing charge, power and VAT.
Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
DKL said:
£3 is everything, standing charge, power and VAT.
Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
At that level of usage, I would not have thought that it would be worth the expense of installing GCH, the money would be better spent on insulation, more efficient storage heaters etc. You can get ones that are remotely controllable over the Internet,Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
RoadToad84 said:
I live in a poorly insulated 2up,2down end terrace that has electric heaters. I ditched the storage heaters for WiFi panel heaters. But rarely use them as they cost approx £8/hour to run them all. Have them set at 12 degrees, and use a multi fuel stove for the heavy lifting.
£8 hour! that's nearly 27kw, it must be warm in your house. £8 a day maybe?One woodburner is really good, the other a little small.
Burrow01 said:
At that level of usage, I would not have thought that it would be worth the expense of installing GCH, the money would be better spent on insulation, more efficient storage heaters etc. You can get ones that are remotely controllable over the Internet,
That's the conclusion we are coming to, so we are back to which type of heater, panel or storage.DKL said:
That's the conclusion we are coming to, so we are back to which type of heater, panel or storage.
If you only need minimum heat most of the time, when you are not there, it would probably be easiest / cheapest to get Internet accessible panel heaters, leave them on a low temp most of the time (not sure where you are, but its been 10 deg C in the Midlands today, and so if you left them on 10-15 deg they would not actually be on a lot of the time.You can then remotely boost them before you travel there, depending on the insulation level of the house, this might take a day or so to get up to temp.
One option before you do anything might be to get some portable oil filled radiators and connect them via a Wi-Fi switch - I have some of these that have a built in power consumption meter, and you would then be able to see how much energy you would use to keep the house at a minimum temp. You see these radiators on Facebook Marketplace etc all the time, and so would not be too expensive to try it out
Resistive electric heaters are all essentially 100% efficient - so don’t get too wrapped up on manufacturers sometimes spurious claims about how much energy they might save you over your existing storage heaters - apart from
the ability to just control them more conveniently.
economy 7 tarrifs are pretty poor value if you are not careful, because the daytime rate is more expensive than the standard flat rate. You need to consume something like 80% of your total usage off-peak for the maths to work.
finally,
be wary of running portable heaters on cheapo smart-plugs, because the internal construction is pretty flimsy and not really designed for heavy loads over many hours.
the ability to just control them more conveniently.
economy 7 tarrifs are pretty poor value if you are not careful, because the daytime rate is more expensive than the standard flat rate. You need to consume something like 80% of your total usage off-peak for the maths to work.
finally,
be wary of running portable heaters on cheapo smart-plugs, because the internal construction is pretty flimsy and not really designed for heavy loads over many hours.
DKL said:
£3 is everything, standing charge, power and VAT.
Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
That's so cheap I can't see why you would want to change it , or how you do it .Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
Leave well alone I would say
cliffords said:
DKL said:
£3 is everything, standing charge, power and VAT.
Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
That's so cheap I can't see why you would want to change it , or how you do it .Insulation - poor I'd imagine. There is some in the roof space but it wouldn't hurt with more still. Walls are solid so pros and cons there. We are mid terrace and the 2 either side are occupied all year.
I'd have thought that storage heaters used on min output would last most of the day. I'd need to be able to increase this remotely so would choose the appropriate unit.
Leave well alone I would say
I think I need to check occupancy use against the rest of the time and look at how the costs would vary on a E7 tariff and do some maths.
r3g said:
I'd be getting the gas pipe outside your door connected up pronto. Every electrically heated property I've lived in has been biblically expensive to heat. GCH is pocket change in comparison.
I see your point but installation/connection costs, plumbing and general redecoration would be quite substantial. It would buy quite a lot of electricity.I might ask all the same.
Edited by DKL on Wednesday 24th January 20:37
As others have said off peak storage heating is only worth it if you're spanking the low tariff quite hard and running the heaters without the tariff is bonkers. If faced with electric only I'd be tempted to go UFH and at least make it a feature and a mildly more efficient method but appreciate it's no small task to fit particularly if not planning any works as such. But then if doing floors etc heat pump wet system becomes viable..
But yeah like the other guy said and even speaking as a spark if gas connection is an option...
But yeah like the other guy said and even speaking as a spark if gas connection is an option...
If you are staying electric go for infra red panels, they are surprisingly good and most can be remotely controlled via WiFi.
I our place in Devon we have elec oil filled (Rointe), elec panels (Mylek) and infra red (Klarstein Wonderwall). This means I can compare them as I have different systems in different rooms. Infrared takes a slight change of mindset in that you don’t necessarily notice warmth in the air, but overall it’s the best
But. Gas will be a lot cheaper. Our 3 bed barn conversion costs over £20 per day to heat in the winter.
I our place in Devon we have elec oil filled (Rointe), elec panels (Mylek) and infra red (Klarstein Wonderwall). This means I can compare them as I have different systems in different rooms. Infrared takes a slight change of mindset in that you don’t necessarily notice warmth in the air, but overall it’s the best
But. Gas will be a lot cheaper. Our 3 bed barn conversion costs over £20 per day to heat in the winter.
Edited by blueg33 on Wednesday 24th January 20:55
blueg33 said:
If you are staying electric go for infra red panels, they are surprisingly good and most can be remotely controlled via WiFi.
I our place in Devon we have elec oil filled (Rointe), elec panels (Mylek) and infra red (Klarstein Wonderwall). This means I can compare them as I have different systems in different rooms. Infrared takes a slight change of mindset in that you don’t necessarily notice warmth in the air, but overall it’s the best
But. Gas will be a lot cheaper. Our 3 bed barn conversion costs over £20 per day to heat in the winter.
Best in what way? I can't say IR had really crossed my mindI our place in Devon we have elec oil filled (Rointe), elec panels (Mylek) and infra red (Klarstein Wonderwall). This means I can compare them as I have different systems in different rooms. Infrared takes a slight change of mindset in that you don’t necessarily notice warmth in the air, but overall it’s the best
But. Gas will be a lot cheaper. Our 3 bed barn conversion costs over £20 per day to heat in the winter.
It's such a shame electricity is so expensive.
There are lots of easily accessible devices that work in different ways . It's silent ,fume free and generally instant .
Given the push to get us to use it for our cars , it's a real shame it costs so much in a domestic heating setting.
Just to add, we have been trying out a IR device in our conservatory, originally it was outside in a pub. I got it from a skip, literally.
It's very effective, heats the room extremely quickly. It's hard to explain it does not really heat the room instantly it stops it feeling cold instantly.
Downside is at today's rates is £1 per hour , whereas if my electricity supplier thought it was an electric car it would be 35p for an hour. Madness.
There are lots of easily accessible devices that work in different ways . It's silent ,fume free and generally instant .
Given the push to get us to use it for our cars , it's a real shame it costs so much in a domestic heating setting.
Just to add, we have been trying out a IR device in our conservatory, originally it was outside in a pub. I got it from a skip, literally.
It's very effective, heats the room extremely quickly. It's hard to explain it does not really heat the room instantly it stops it feeling cold instantly.
Downside is at today's rates is £1 per hour , whereas if my electricity supplier thought it was an electric car it would be 35p for an hour. Madness.
Edited by cliffords on Thursday 25th January 07:56
DKL said:
I see your point but installation/connection costs, plumbing and general redecoration would be quite substantial. It would buy quite a lot of electricity.
I might ask all the same.
if you are using an average 8Kwh per day in energy to heat the house, changing to gas will save about £1.50 per day if gas is a third of the price of electricity. There will be the additional standing charge for the gas supply, and so this will reduce the savings to about £1.30 per day. I might ask all the same.
Edited by DKL on Wednesday 24th January 20:37
200
Total saving is approx £450 per year. However to install gas, even with a small boiler would be approx £2000 + the work to install the pipes, radiators, redecorate etc, so maybe another 2-3k ? so a 8-10 year payback.
ASHP install is approx 20k I think
For your 15% usage, I would stick with electricity, unless you are thinking of using it more in the future. Any option for a solar installation? even in the winter, with a battery, this might cover all the power you use during the day. Cost would be approx 12K I think
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