Mate has just told me the bailiffs are coming...
Discussion
One of my closest friends has just told me that bailiffs are due at his house Tuesday and he's at court again a week Monday for another debt. I knew he had money issues about a year ago but nothing like this!
One debt is a loan for a car from about 5 years ago and there is at least one credit card debt. This isn't him being reckless with money as such, it was an ex-partner that went to town with his money. He doesn't have much of value (apart from his home) and owns his own business and so has a van and tools.
He's offered to make reduced minimum payments but they have all been rejected. He's telling me all this as he doesn't know what to do and to be honest nor do I.
I've told him to go back to the CAB as soon as. He's got money coming in as he is working but he isn't making enough to keep everyone happy. He has a child and the thought of Bailiffs coming around and clearing the house out just before Christmas is not really a nice one.
Is there a logical course of action, other than CAB? I have money I can give him to keep the most urgent debts satisfied but he needs a long-term plan.
One debt is a loan for a car from about 5 years ago and there is at least one credit card debt. This isn't him being reckless with money as such, it was an ex-partner that went to town with his money. He doesn't have much of value (apart from his home) and owns his own business and so has a van and tools.
He's offered to make reduced minimum payments but they have all been rejected. He's telling me all this as he doesn't know what to do and to be honest nor do I.
I've told him to go back to the CAB as soon as. He's got money coming in as he is working but he isn't making enough to keep everyone happy. He has a child and the thought of Bailiffs coming around and clearing the house out just before Christmas is not really a nice one.
Is there a logical course of action, other than CAB? I have money I can give him to keep the most urgent debts satisfied but he needs a long-term plan.
Edited by zollburgers on Monday 14th December 22:37
Well he said "in court again" so I assume so. I told him not let them in and make sure the place is secure but he said they are coming round with the police and have told him they can force entry. I've given him enough now to keep them happy for a bit, and it was a fair amount. He said he's about 10k in debt, half of that is his mortgage payments but they are not pressing for it yet.
would this work as a stop-gap solution until after christmas??
Take the christmas presents etc over to your house so that the tags can not be used to proove ownership. Then write up a peice of paper saying you are buying all the items in his house (make a list) for something silly like £20 then write out an agreement to rent the use of all those items for 10p a week. The Police will most probably call you for clarification but he can sell all his items for whatever price he wants. Once you own them, end of story...
You would need to bear in mind something for his car also, as they will seize this if it still belongs to him and putting it into your name would throw up insurance complications.
With this in mind, more than likely he will end up being told that they do not have enough value in the house to seize and so will have to go away and speak to the company which hired them.
The thing is...if he owes 10K, no amount of items in his house will pay that off (unless he is secretly stashing gold in his underpants) so, will get his house gutted just before xmas, then still owe money...
In relation to the above I have no idea if they would then decide to go after the house...but then if its morgaged that is not his either so until the morgage company go for the house (which as you said they are not at the moment) he is pretty much safe from that also.
Take the christmas presents etc over to your house so that the tags can not be used to proove ownership. Then write up a peice of paper saying you are buying all the items in his house (make a list) for something silly like £20 then write out an agreement to rent the use of all those items for 10p a week. The Police will most probably call you for clarification but he can sell all his items for whatever price he wants. Once you own them, end of story...
You would need to bear in mind something for his car also, as they will seize this if it still belongs to him and putting it into your name would throw up insurance complications.
With this in mind, more than likely he will end up being told that they do not have enough value in the house to seize and so will have to go away and speak to the company which hired them.
The thing is...if he owes 10K, no amount of items in his house will pay that off (unless he is secretly stashing gold in his underpants) so, will get his house gutted just before xmas, then still owe money...
In relation to the above I have no idea if they would then decide to go after the house...but then if its morgaged that is not his either so until the morgage company go for the house (which as you said they are not at the moment) he is pretty much safe from that also.
musclecarmad said:
hmm,
a guy owes me a debt that he has pissed off from and I know that he's your friend etc but he owes the money - if you try to help too much you could get dragged into this and tangled up in it.
i'd let him sort out his own probs and pay his debts himself.
Sorry to be harsh but he owes people money and should pay up rather than try to scam a way out of it. If he borrowed money for a car for himself or his ex then he should pay it.
can he take a loan against the house
can he sell the house
can he borrow more on a cc
what I will say is this:
DON'T HELP HIM OUT WITH CASH AS IN MY EXPERIENCE HE WON'T ADMIT TO ALL THE DEBT HE OWES AND HE WILL KEEP COMING BACK TO YOU FOR MORE.
+1 lending cash to a friend is a possible minefield.a guy owes me a debt that he has pissed off from and I know that he's your friend etc but he owes the money - if you try to help too much you could get dragged into this and tangled up in it.
i'd let him sort out his own probs and pay his debts himself.
Sorry to be harsh but he owes people money and should pay up rather than try to scam a way out of it. If he borrowed money for a car for himself or his ex then he should pay it.
can he take a loan against the house
can he sell the house
can he borrow more on a cc
what I will say is this:
DON'T HELP HIM OUT WITH CASH AS IN MY EXPERIENCE HE WON'T ADMIT TO ALL THE DEBT HE OWES AND HE WILL KEEP COMING BACK TO YOU FOR MORE.
I went there once, helped with about 3k. The problem is the debt to you comes way way down the list. I learnt a valuable lesson and although I got my money back (only after 2 years of grief) I have never spoken to the person since.
ymwoods said:
would this work as a stop-gap solution until after christmas??
Take the christmas presents etc over to your house so that the tags can not be used to proove ownership. Then write up a peice of paper saying you are buying all the items in his house (make a list) for something silly like £20 then write out an agreement to rent the use of all those items for 10p a week. The Police will most probably call you for clarification but he can sell all his items for whatever price he wants. Once you own them, end of story...
You would need to bear in mind something for his car also, as they will seize this if it still belongs to him and putting it into your name would throw up insurance complications.
With this in mind, more than likely he will end up being told that they do not have enough value in the house to seize and so will have to go away and speak to the company which hired them.
The thing is...if he owes 10K, no amount of items in his house will pay that off (unless he is secretly stashing gold in his underpants) so, will get his house gutted just before xmas, then still owe money...
In relation to the above I have no idea if they would then decide to go after the house...but then if its morgaged that is not his either so until the morgage company go for the house (which as you said they are not at the moment) he is pretty much safe from that also.
No, it won't work.Take the christmas presents etc over to your house so that the tags can not be used to proove ownership. Then write up a peice of paper saying you are buying all the items in his house (make a list) for something silly like £20 then write out an agreement to rent the use of all those items for 10p a week. The Police will most probably call you for clarification but he can sell all his items for whatever price he wants. Once you own them, end of story...
You would need to bear in mind something for his car also, as they will seize this if it still belongs to him and putting it into your name would throw up insurance complications.
With this in mind, more than likely he will end up being told that they do not have enough value in the house to seize and so will have to go away and speak to the company which hired them.
The thing is...if he owes 10K, no amount of items in his house will pay that off (unless he is secretly stashing gold in his underpants) so, will get his house gutted just before xmas, then still owe money...
In relation to the above I have no idea if they would then decide to go after the house...but then if its morgaged that is not his either so until the morgage company go for the house (which as you said they are not at the moment) he is pretty much safe from that also.
What a nightmare!
I can't help thinking his creditors are being bloody stupid going down this path. If he's talking to them and making offers of payment, as long as they're reasonably confident 1) He's being truthful about his income/expenses 2) making a reasonable offer they should take it. There's a hundreds of thousands of people out there at the moment that are in a similar boat. [EDIT] Now I think about it, if he's being doing that since day 1, I'm surprised they were able to secure a CCJ.....
I'm not just saying that from a moral point of view ether! Your friend can go into court reasonably confident. Make sure he bloody goes and doesn't do it via a form/letter! There's no guarantee, but if he takes the offers he made his creditors, proof of his income and the court agrees he's been reasonable and tried to do the decent thing they'll brutalise the creditor. Seen it happen a few times in my old job (working for a creditor). It will also help if he's had a major change in his life I.E. Redundancy, sickness, or as I think I read a partner/co-income provider pissing off. Creditors can't just demand their money these days irrespective of their customer’s circumstances. If they're just hounding people and ignoring reasonable offers the court with come down on them with great vengeance and furious anger.
As for lending mates money when they're in Dire Straights, well you know they're up s
t creek, or they wouldn't be begging you for money and yeah you're gonna be the last one to get paid because you're not gonna take their house or let their kids starve - that's what friends are for, if you can't survive without it, say sorry you can't help, if you can, consider it good karma and getting paid back a bonus.
I can't help thinking his creditors are being bloody stupid going down this path. If he's talking to them and making offers of payment, as long as they're reasonably confident 1) He's being truthful about his income/expenses 2) making a reasonable offer they should take it. There's a hundreds of thousands of people out there at the moment that are in a similar boat. [EDIT] Now I think about it, if he's being doing that since day 1, I'm surprised they were able to secure a CCJ.....
I'm not just saying that from a moral point of view ether! Your friend can go into court reasonably confident. Make sure he bloody goes and doesn't do it via a form/letter! There's no guarantee, but if he takes the offers he made his creditors, proof of his income and the court agrees he's been reasonable and tried to do the decent thing they'll brutalise the creditor. Seen it happen a few times in my old job (working for a creditor). It will also help if he's had a major change in his life I.E. Redundancy, sickness, or as I think I read a partner/co-income provider pissing off. Creditors can't just demand their money these days irrespective of their customer’s circumstances. If they're just hounding people and ignoring reasonable offers the court with come down on them with great vengeance and furious anger.
As for lending mates money when they're in Dire Straights, well you know they're up s
t creek, or they wouldn't be begging you for money and yeah you're gonna be the last one to get paid because you're not gonna take their house or let their kids starve - that's what friends are for, if you can't survive without it, say sorry you can't help, if you can, consider it good karma and getting paid back a bonus.Edited by P-Jay on Tuesday 15th December 19:16
zollburgers said:
Well he said "in court again" so I assume so. I told him not let them in and make sure the place is secure but he said they are coming round with the police and have told him they can force entry. I've given him enough now to keep them happy for a bit, and it was a fair amount. He said he's about 10k in debt, half of that is his mortgage payments but they are not pressing for it yet.
What the bailiffs can and can't do depends on what kind of bailiffs they are. I may be wrong but I believe only court bailiffs can force entry on the first visit. Ordinary bailiffs cannot break in without first gaining "walking possession" of your goods. To gain walking possession you have to have let them in previously, and you have to have signed something to agree that they can take the goods. Letting them in can consist of having left a door or window open to enable them to gain entry without breaking in. They will use all kinds of threatening language, such as "the police will be in attendance" but this is a red herring, the police only get involved if there's a disturbance. So the upshot is, if they're ordinary bailiffs, don't let them in and they can do nothing. If they're court bailiffs, he could be in trouble.Thanks for the suggestions etc.
The bailifs are now satisfied but he has been given until the end of Jan to pay 5k owing on the mortgage otherwise he's out....they will talk and offer an interest only mortgage and a reduced fee every month but want half of it paid first before they will entertain anything.
He said he has been to the CAB but from what he's told me it seems he's not been managing the situation at all. I live about 200 miles away but I'm back that way this week so will talk to him and then I should know exactly what is going on.
I've given him 2k to satisfy the immediate debts and can live without that but an additional 2.5k I cannot stretch to.
He's not trying to write off the debts by the way and yes he's been very silly and he knows it. At the time the money was spent his business was doing very well and he could afford things. The car and everything else were demanded by his ex and now she's long gone and the business has really dried up.
The bailifs are now satisfied but he has been given until the end of Jan to pay 5k owing on the mortgage otherwise he's out....they will talk and offer an interest only mortgage and a reduced fee every month but want half of it paid first before they will entertain anything.
He said he has been to the CAB but from what he's told me it seems he's not been managing the situation at all. I live about 200 miles away but I'm back that way this week so will talk to him and then I should know exactly what is going on.
I've given him 2k to satisfy the immediate debts and can live without that but an additional 2.5k I cannot stretch to.
He's not trying to write off the debts by the way and yes he's been very silly and he knows it. At the time the money was spent his business was doing very well and he could afford things. The car and everything else were demanded by his ex and now she's long gone and the business has really dried up.
andye30m3 said:
Am I correct in thinking they won't take his van or tools as this would further restrict his ability to earn and therefore payback any other debts?
They can take them unless they're owned by the company and not him personally. They can't touch anything owned by the company which is a separate legal entity in the laws eyes.zollburgers said:
Thanks for the suggestions etc.
The bailifs are now satisfied but he has been given until the end of Jan to pay 5k owing on the mortgage otherwise he's out....they will talk and offer an interest only mortgage and a reduced fee every month but want half of it paid first before they will entertain anything.
He said he has been to the CAB but from what he's told me it seems he's not been managing the situation at all. I live about 200 miles away but I'm back that way this week so will talk to him and then I should know exactly what is going on.
I've given him 2k to satisfy the immediate debts and can live without that but an additional 2.5k I cannot stretch to.
He's not trying to write off the debts by the way and yes he's been very silly and he knows it. At the time the money was spent his business was doing very well and he could afford things. The car and everything else were demanded by his ex and now she's long gone and the business has really dried up.
Sorry - what you mean was your Friend could afford finance not afford the things he wanted to buy. I admire your generosity / loyalty to your friend though.The bailifs are now satisfied but he has been given until the end of Jan to pay 5k owing on the mortgage otherwise he's out....they will talk and offer an interest only mortgage and a reduced fee every month but want half of it paid first before they will entertain anything.
He said he has been to the CAB but from what he's told me it seems he's not been managing the situation at all. I live about 200 miles away but I'm back that way this week so will talk to him and then I should know exactly what is going on.
I've given him 2k to satisfy the immediate debts and can live without that but an additional 2.5k I cannot stretch to.
He's not trying to write off the debts by the way and yes he's been very silly and he knows it. At the time the money was spent his business was doing very well and he could afford things. The car and everything else were demanded by his ex and now she's long gone and the business has really dried up.
zollburgers said:
Thanks for the suggestions etc.
The bailifs are now satisfied but he has been given until the end of Jan to pay 5k owing on the mortgage otherwise he's out....they will talk and offer an interest only mortgage and a reduced fee every month but want half of it paid first before they will entertain anything.
He said he has been to the CAB but from what he's told me it seems he's not been managing the situation at all. I live about 200 miles away but I'm back that way this week so will talk to him and then I should know exactly what is going on.
I've given him 2k to satisfy the immediate debts and can live without that but an additional 2.5k I cannot stretch to.
He's not trying to write off the debts by the way and yes he's been very silly and he knows it. At the time the money was spent his business was doing very well and he could afford things. The car and everything else were demanded by his ex and now she's long gone and the business has really dried up.
If your mate's mortgage company has issued possession proceedings and he wants to keep the house then he needs to get some proper advice quickly. The county courts normally have free duty advisors in attendance on possession days who will assist but your mate will need to contact his nearest court to find their details and get to see someone well in advance of the matter getting to court.The bailifs are now satisfied but he has been given until the end of Jan to pay 5k owing on the mortgage otherwise he's out....they will talk and offer an interest only mortgage and a reduced fee every month but want half of it paid first before they will entertain anything.
He said he has been to the CAB but from what he's told me it seems he's not been managing the situation at all. I live about 200 miles away but I'm back that way this week so will talk to him and then I should know exactly what is going on.
I've given him 2k to satisfy the immediate debts and can live without that but an additional 2.5k I cannot stretch to.
He's not trying to write off the debts by the way and yes he's been very silly and he knows it. At the time the money was spent his business was doing very well and he could afford things. The car and everything else were demanded by his ex and now she's long gone and the business has really dried up.
Just because the mortgage company sets out the terms it wants to deal with doesn't mean they can evict because those terms aren't complied with, however your mate needs to get a very clear and honest view of his finances and make proposals that are realistic for him and more importantly that a court will find reasonable in the circumstances.
Edited by Andy_GSA on Wednesday 16th December 00:03
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