Plan for prisoners to work 40-hour week
Discussion
Very interesting.
Can it work?
I think if businesses can save themselves a significant sum of money by using prisoners then they'd be onto a winner....at the expense of employees out of prison though.
Can it work?
I think if businesses can save themselves a significant sum of money by using prisoners then they'd be onto a winner....at the expense of employees out of prison though.
The FT said:
Hundreds of millions of pounds in revenues could be raised by the government to help victim support groups, and even fund the cost of running prisons, as part of its plans to make prisoners work 40-hour weeks.
Ken Clarke, the justice minister, will tell the Tory party conference on Tuesday that he wants the private sector to help government create “meaningful employment” for inmates by expanding prison industries, reviving a policy of John Major’s Conservative government in the 1990s.
“We need to instil in our jails a regime of hard work,” Mr Clarke will tell delegates. “Most prisoners lead a life of enforced, bored idleness, where getting out of bed is optional … We will make it easier for prison governors to bring more private companies into their jails to create well-run businesses, employing prisoners in regular, nine-to-five jobs.”
The initiative chimes with the government’s determination to get people working again as it begins a radical overhaul of the welfare state. On Monday, George Osborne, chancellor, promised that no family will reap more by living on benefits than the average family gets from going out to work, as he promised a “new welfare state where it always pays to work”.
Mr Clarke says he wants the private sector to help develop jobs that could be done from within prisons such as data processing and wants to see prisoners putting in 40-hour weeks. In return they will earn more, but most of this money will be siphoned off to fund victim support groups and also the prison system.
One government source said the initiative could raise hundreds of millions in revenue although the danger is that businesses could turn to prisoners as a cheaper source of labour, lessening opportunities for those on the outside.
But to make prisoners’ working full-time a reality the government will need huge support from businesses: currently only about 20 firms are involved in these initiatives employing a few hundred people against a total prison population of 85,000 inmates.
The government is in theory allowed to recoup some earnings from prisoners working outside prisons to provide money for victims, although the legislation was never implemented. The government will need to extend the legislation to include earnings from prisoners inside jail, while the coalition is also exploring piloting a large-scale working prison.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/d772fe00-d000-11df-bb9e-00144feab49a.htmlKen Clarke, the justice minister, will tell the Tory party conference on Tuesday that he wants the private sector to help government create “meaningful employment” for inmates by expanding prison industries, reviving a policy of John Major’s Conservative government in the 1990s.
“We need to instil in our jails a regime of hard work,” Mr Clarke will tell delegates. “Most prisoners lead a life of enforced, bored idleness, where getting out of bed is optional … We will make it easier for prison governors to bring more private companies into their jails to create well-run businesses, employing prisoners in regular, nine-to-five jobs.”
The initiative chimes with the government’s determination to get people working again as it begins a radical overhaul of the welfare state. On Monday, George Osborne, chancellor, promised that no family will reap more by living on benefits than the average family gets from going out to work, as he promised a “new welfare state where it always pays to work”.
Mr Clarke says he wants the private sector to help develop jobs that could be done from within prisons such as data processing and wants to see prisoners putting in 40-hour weeks. In return they will earn more, but most of this money will be siphoned off to fund victim support groups and also the prison system.
One government source said the initiative could raise hundreds of millions in revenue although the danger is that businesses could turn to prisoners as a cheaper source of labour, lessening opportunities for those on the outside.
But to make prisoners’ working full-time a reality the government will need huge support from businesses: currently only about 20 firms are involved in these initiatives employing a few hundred people against a total prison population of 85,000 inmates.
The government is in theory allowed to recoup some earnings from prisoners working outside prisons to provide money for victims, although the legislation was never implemented. The government will need to extend the legislation to include earnings from prisoners inside jail, while the coalition is also exploring piloting a large-scale working prison.
Edited by Victor McDade on Tuesday 5th October 00:04
Starting to wonder if the Conservatives have been browsing my posts on PH in the last couple of years. They could subtly confirm this suspicion by announcing chav-fuelled power stations as an early April Fool's joke...
KANEIT said:
Couldn't the work involve making cheap simple components that we currently outsource to China for example, therefore not threatening our existing workforce ?
Like the idea!Edited by ShadownINja on Tuesday 5th October 00:21
dudleybloke said:
its a good idea as a lot of prisoners have never worked 40 hours in their life! 
you can bet some liberal ponce will say its unfair though.
More likley to be the Unions. I would have then all sweeping the streets, painting over Graffiti doing things in run down areas to make a differance to the lives of people. I would also make them wear bright lime green clothes whilst outside doing this work. I have always said that prison should be about payback, laying in bed or working out at the Gym is not payback.you can bet some liberal ponce will say its unfair though.
This is already done to a cetrtain extent. In HMP Ford there are several "workshops" that make things sold to the outside world. One "job" involves glueing a small square of bubble wrap into the bottom of a strawberry punnet. The inmates are paid 40p per 1,000 (credited to their account) and very broing work it is too.
Ford is a category D prison so the risk of inmates kicking off is low. Replicating this in higher category prisons would be fraught with danager...
Ford is a category D prison so the risk of inmates kicking off is low. Replicating this in higher category prisons would be fraught with danager...
spaximus said:
dudleybloke said:
its a good idea as a lot of prisoners have never worked 40 hours in their life!
you can bet some liberal ponce will say its unfair though.
More likley to be the Unions. I would have then all sweeping the streets, painting over Graffiti doing things in run down areas to make a differance to the lives of people. I would also make them wear bright lime green clothes whilst outside doing this work. I have always said that prison should be about payback, laying in bed or working out at the Gym is not payback.you can bet some liberal ponce will say its unfair though.
I know it serves the community better if they clear up urban decay in s
tty areas but it's looking a bit overgrown where I ride my bike and I think something ought to be done about it. Fittster said:
Stupid idea.
Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
There's LOADS of low paid work available that would benefit society, but which does not currently get done by anyone either because there is no cash to pay someone to do it or no-one wants such s
t jobs. Several people have already mentioned examples - remedying grafiti, clearing public parks of dog st, fabricating very low cost parts (ie, the chinese type jobs that this country otherwise could not compete with) etc etc.I've never understood the socialist mentality that says "lets import a million eastern europeans to do these jobs that no one here wants to do" when we have tens of thousands in prison who could do them!
Fittster said:
Stupid idea.
Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
I'm generally against it, but saying that there isn't much low paid, low skilled work around is a bit wrong. We have thousands of immigrants here on the cheap picking strawberries and packing boxes of biscuits.Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
The prison work population could be used to substitute some of the future crop of cheap immigrants.
Two birds with one stone as far as the Tories are concerned.
andymadmak said:
Fittster said:
Stupid idea.
Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
There's LOADS of low paid work available that would benefit society, but which does not currently get done by anyone either because there is no cash to pay someone to do it or no-one wants such s
t jobs. Several people have already mentioned examples - remedying grafiti, clearing public parks of dog st, fabricating very low cost parts (ie, the chinese type jobs that this country otherwise could not compete with) etc etc.I've never understood the socialist mentality that says "lets import a million eastern europeans to do these jobs that no one here wants to do" when we have tens of thousands in prison who could do them!
andymadmak said:
Fittster said:
Stupid idea.
Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
Where will the work come from? From low paid workers on the outside who will lose their jobs to the cheaper lags. There isn't a lot of low paid, unskilled work about, giving it to criminals is crazy.
There's LOADS of low paid work available that would benefit society, but which does not currently get done by anyone either because there is no cash to pay someone to do it or no-one wants such s
t jobs. Several people have already mentioned examples - remedying grafiti, clearing public parks of dog st, fabricating very low cost parts (ie, the chinese type jobs that this country otherwise could not compete with) etc etc.I've never understood the socialist mentality that says "lets import a million eastern europeans to do these jobs that no one here wants to do" when we have tens of thousands in prison who could do them!
t to pick-up. That's a a brilliant idea that won't put the general public at risk.
It's interesting, but I don't see manufacturing as an option - too much investment needed, and as a manufacturer myself I would worry about the quality issues, most manufacturing relies on people being able to spot problems or manipulate or move something precisely and carefully - a prisoner may not worry about losing his "job" if there are too many mistakes, something that could cost a small business it's customers.
Simple assembly, repackaging, enevelope stuffing and alike is easy to do and data processing/cleaning would be low cost to implement.
Nice idea, but I guess there would have to be some significant tax breaks to make it interesting enough for private industry, or develop some sort of social enterprise that could run them as outsourcing/temping agencies.
Simple assembly, repackaging, enevelope stuffing and alike is easy to do and data processing/cleaning would be low cost to implement.
Nice idea, but I guess there would have to be some significant tax breaks to make it interesting enough for private industry, or develop some sort of social enterprise that could run them as outsourcing/temping agencies.
Edited by Windsorphil on Tuesday 5th October 09:08
BoRED S2upid said:
Against their human rights to force them to work? Or some such BS. Ofcourse they should be made to work, at least 40 hours a week, for no money, afterall they are getting fed and have a roof over their head!
By all means pay them - then give the money directly to the victims of their crimes.After all, we have to pay into a 'victim surcharge' pot for something as trivial as a speeding ticket, so why not make the 'real' criminals do the same?
Only more so.
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