military space plane takes off!
Discussion
holy crap whats this baby for - looks fab. moonraker here we come!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8601172.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8601172.stm
From the link
"The military vehicle is unpiloted and will carry out the first autonomous re-entry and landing in the history of the US space programme."
Didn't Apollo get that distinction? Or is the difference a splash down and a runway?
Edit, back to the days of dynasoar (sp?)
Edit 2 A, this will do.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-20_Dyna-Soar
"The military vehicle is unpiloted and will carry out the first autonomous re-entry and landing in the history of the US space programme."
Didn't Apollo get that distinction? Or is the difference a splash down and a runway?
Edit, back to the days of dynasoar (sp?)
Edit 2 A, this will do.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-20_Dyna-Soar
Edited by jmorgan on Friday 23 April 08:03
Edited by jmorgan on Friday 23 April 08:06
Don said:
Run by the US Air Force. Hmmm.
Since the dawn of the US Manned Space Program in 1958, the USAF have been champing at the bit to have the capability to put their own people in orbit. They were very upset that manned spaceflight was taken away from them and handed to the then new NASA.All through the 1960s they tried to run their own separate programmes, initially with the X-20 Dyna Soar spaceplane and then with the Gemini based Manned Orbiting Laboratory (MOL). Both programmes were cancelled.
The one thing the USAF never liked was the idea of having to be fished out of the ocean by the Navy, so they have always hankered after a glider based land landing. Dyna Soar was obviously designed to land on a runway. Even the version of the Gemini capsule planned for the MOL project would have featured an unfurlable para wing (a Rogallo Wing) and a set of retractable landing skids.
The soon to be retired Space Shuttle only received sufficient funding through the support of the Department of Defense and the actual performance capability of the Shuttle was mainly set for its proposed military missions. NASA wanted a Shuttle that was about 2/3 the size of the final design and would have prepared a true lifting body rather than a fully winged craft. It was the USAF who wanted a better glide capability built into the Shuttle and a higher cargo capacity.
After the Challenger accident, the DoD lost faith in the Shuttle and returned to using unmaned expendable launchers.
However, it seems the dream of having their own space plane has never gone away.
NASA had to drop the X-37 project in 2004 - presumably becuase it was putting its efforts into the now cancelled Constellation/Orion system. However, the X-37 was then transferred to the DoD so it looks like, finally, the US military will eventually become the only American organisation capable of putting humans into space.
Edited by Eric Mc on Friday 23 April 08:37
Edwards has never had any capacity to launch Shuttles. It has only ever been used to recover Shuttles.
The USAF did build its own dedicated military launch facility for the Shuttle at Vandenberg Air Force Base, California. It was planned to launch Shuttles from Vandenberg into polar orbits, which are the best orbits for spy satellites. A brand new launch pad - much better than NASA's refurbished Saturn pads at Cape Canaveral, was built specially for these Shuttle launches. The first Vandenberg launch was scheduled for mid 1986. Following the Challenger disaster, all planned launches from Vandenberg were cancelled and the specially built (and extremely expensive) Shuttle facilities have never been used.
Between 1982 and the end of 1985, the US DoD did fly a number of top secret Shuttle missions out of Cape Canaveral.
The USAF did build its own dedicated military launch facility for the Shuttle at Vandenberg Air Force Base, California. It was planned to launch Shuttles from Vandenberg into polar orbits, which are the best orbits for spy satellites. A brand new launch pad - much better than NASA's refurbished Saturn pads at Cape Canaveral, was built specially for these Shuttle launches. The first Vandenberg launch was scheduled for mid 1986. Following the Challenger disaster, all planned launches from Vandenberg were cancelled and the specially built (and extremely expensive) Shuttle facilities have never been used.
Between 1982 and the end of 1985, the US DoD did fly a number of top secret Shuttle missions out of Cape Canaveral.
Edited by Eric Mc on Friday 23 April 09:39
loltolhurst said:
so what would it be used for? is it better at spying than a satallite? would it deliver missiles? is it just to attack the russian space station and anyone who tries to put a big laser in space?!
The X-37 is not full size. In effect, the real Space Plane would become a direct replacement for the current Shuttle. It would have a cargo bay like the Shuttle and would be used to deploy military cargoes into earth orbit - such as spy satellites or military communication satellites.It would be fully automatic so would not NEED to be manned - being completely capable of re-entering and gliding to a landing wiothout anyone on board.
However, if necessary, a manned version could also be built to put personnel into earth orbit - presumably to link up with some future space station.
It will be interesting to see what type of large booster would be used to launch the full sized vehicle into space - and what type of configuration would be used. In other words, would they use the current Shuttle layout (an orbiter mounted piggy-back on the booster) or with the orbiter sitting atop the booster.
Edited by Eric Mc on Friday 23 April 10:10
loltolhurst said:
so what would it be used for? is it better at spying than a satallite? would it deliver missiles? is it just to attack the russian space station and anyone who tries to put a big laser in space?!
In this context, the correct technical term is "big fricking laser". according to Dr Evil
Guam said:
Eric Mc said:
Edwards has never had any capacity to launch Shuttles. It has only ever been used to recover Shuttles.
The USAF did build its own dedicated military launch facility for the Shuttle at Vandenberg Air Force Base, California. It was planned to launch Shuttles from Vandenberg into polar orbits, which are the best orbits for spy satellites. A brand new launch pad - much better than NASA's refurbished Saturn pads at Cape Canaveral, was built specially for these Shuttle launches. The first Vandenberg launch was scheduled for mid 1986. Following the Challenger disaster, all planned launches from Vandenberg were cancelled and the specially built (and extremely expensive) Shuttle facilities have never been used.
Between 1982 and the end of 1985, the US DoD did fly a number of top secret Shuttle missions out of Cape Canaveral.
Yeah it was back then I had the conversations with those guys I mentioned, was never sure what the final outcome was thanks for that Eric The USAF did build its own dedicated military launch facility for the Shuttle at Vandenberg Air Force Base, California. It was planned to launch Shuttles from Vandenberg into polar orbits, which are the best orbits for spy satellites. A brand new launch pad - much better than NASA's refurbished Saturn pads at Cape Canaveral, was built specially for these Shuttle launches. The first Vandenberg launch was scheduled for mid 1986. Following the Challenger disaster, all planned launches from Vandenberg were cancelled and the specially built (and extremely expensive) Shuttle facilities have never been used.
Between 1982 and the end of 1985, the US DoD did fly a number of top secret Shuttle missions out of Cape Canaveral.
Edited by Eric Mc on Friday 23 April 09:39
cheers
Tom
The X-15 was built for a specific job - which it carried out for ten years.
Much data from the X-15 programme was incorporated in the Shuttle and will be used in any other spaceplane projects - if they ever materiialise.
For basic pure spaceflight, spaceplanes are NOT the best option at all. Too much of the weight and performance of the spacecraft is compromised in order to achieve the ability to glide back to land. In other words, space faring capability and practicality is sacrificed ffor the dubious benefit of arriving with a bit of dignity.
Military needs are that they want full control mof the vehicle as it re-enters and they would like to guide the vehicle to an accurate landing in a secure location. That is not normally a requirement ffor a civilian space craft.
Much data from the X-15 programme was incorporated in the Shuttle and will be used in any other spaceplane projects - if they ever materiialise.
For basic pure spaceflight, spaceplanes are NOT the best option at all. Too much of the weight and performance of the spacecraft is compromised in order to achieve the ability to glide back to land. In other words, space faring capability and practicality is sacrificed ffor the dubious benefit of arriving with a bit of dignity.
Military needs are that they want full control mof the vehicle as it re-enters and they would like to guide the vehicle to an accurate landing in a secure location. That is not normally a requirement ffor a civilian space craft.
Just an update.
It appears that the X-37 is visible (just) as it passes over the Southern UK. It is not very bright and very low down in the sky. The next visible pass will be tonight at 21:44:47. It will be very low down in the sky near the southern horizon and will be quite dim - nothing like as bright as the Space Station or even the Shuttle.
It appears that the X-37 is visible (just) as it passes over the Southern UK. It is not very bright and very low down in the sky. The next visible pass will be tonight at 21:44:47. It will be very low down in the sky near the southern horizon and will be quite dim - nothing like as bright as the Space Station or even the Shuttle.
Eric Mc said:
Just an update.
It appears that the X-37 is visible (just) as it passes over the Southern UK. It is not very bright and very low down in the sky. The next visible pass will be tonight at 21:44:47. It will be very low down in the sky near the southern horizon and will be quite dim - nothing like as bright as the Space Station or even the Shuttle.
Thanks Eric.It appears that the X-37 is visible (just) as it passes over the Southern UK. It is not very bright and very low down in the sky. The next visible pass will be tonight at 21:44:47. It will be very low down in the sky near the southern horizon and will be quite dim - nothing like as bright as the Space Station or even the Shuttle.
Just to be sure is that time BST or GMT (UT)?
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