Labour to scrap childcare vouchers

[oldbanger]

the Department for Children, Schools and Families in London confirmed to Scotland on Sunday that the £500 million saved by taxing the vouchers, worth up to £900 a year to a typical family, will be spent providing ten hours' free care to 250,000 of the poorest children in England and Wales. ...

The Prime Minister last week announced that the tax break would be removed from 2011, but only for new parents, so those already receiving them should not be hit. Nevertheless, it withdraws a £55 weekly tax-free boost.

The government argues it is an unfair subsidy, as a third of the relief goes to higher-rate taxpayers, to whom it can be worth £1,195 a year.

But without it, others argue, childcare is painfully expensive. According to Children in Scotland, the price of a nursery place for a child under two years old has soared by 12 per cent over the last year to £158, and £148 per week for a child over two years old, pushing the average nursery bill for a full-time place to £8,216.

http://business.scotsman.com/6983/Battle-looms-ove...

(I'm obviously living in the wrong area, as I have to pay just shy of £48 per day for a 2 year old!)

Edited by oldbanger on Tuesday 6th October 18:00

[thinfourth2]

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

[elster]

thinfourth2 said:

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

Don't have kids then.

If you can't afford, don't breed.

[s2art]

elster said:

thinfourth2 said:

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

Don't have kids then.

If you can't afford, don't breed.

A tad harsh. If we were not taxed so much in the first place there wouldnt be the need for the vouchers.

[oldbanger]

The thing is this isn't the childcare tax credits, which only really apply to single parents. This is the salary sacrifice scheme whereby your employer can pay up to £55 of your weekly salary directly to a registered childcare facility (or supply you with vouchers to that amount) and you don't pay tax and NI on that sum. Being scrapped partly because higher rate taxpayers save more money on the scheme.

[poo at Paul's]

elster said:

thinfourth2 said:

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

Don't have kids then.

If you can't afford, don't breed.

So that would then merely discourage some working parents to have kids but let the non working soash monkeys breed like rabbits. God help the future of the UK if all we have to keep us in retirement is non working council scum.

[elster]

poo at Paul's said:

elster said:

thinfourth2 said:

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

Don't have kids then.

If you can't afford, don't breed.

So that would then merely discourage some working parents to have kids but let the non working soash monkeys breed like rabbits. God help the future of the UK if all we have to keep us in retirement is non working council scum.

Why would it?

If no one gets anything for their kids.

[Olf]

Just a reminder to people that as long as you're on the electronic system these vouchers can be saved 'indefinitely' so store up the max now even if you don't need it for a while.

[Soir]

Our son starts full time nursery in december.

So does this mean we can start to get them now but they will stop in April 2014, so we can use the tax benefit for the next 5 years so long as we sort it now?

[Olf]

Soir said:

Our son starts full time nursery in december.

So does this mean we can start to get them now but they will stop in April 2014, so we can use the tax benefit for the next 5 years so long as we sort it now?

Yep - as long as you're on the electronic system. Means sacrificing the salary now obviously.

This is the other bit I was talking about.

"28. Can I accumulate vouchers if I am not paying for childcare at the moment?
Electronic vouchers may be accumulated indefinitely and may be used to pay for childcare at any point in the future. Paper vouchers are valid for one year."

http://www.childcarevouchers.co.uk/Parents/HelpAnd...

[Parrot of Doom]

thinfourth2 said:

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

Years ago, people didn't get any benefits. They still went to work, leaving the kids with the parents/neighbours/friends for the duration.

[s2art]

Parrot of Doom said:

thinfourth2 said:

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

Years ago, people didn't get any benefits. They still went to work, leaving the kids with the parents/neighbours/friends for the duration.

But their tax load (stealth taxes included) was probably lower.

[cymtriks]

Good.

I'd like to spend the money I earn on my family in a manner and at a time that suits my family.

I do not want it taken off me "for my own good" to bail out people who contribute nothing, after a load of middle men have taken their cut, and then be given whatever is left and be expected to be oh so grateful.

In the past, and still today in most countries on Earth, there were no benefits for having more children than you can afford, people paid for their own families. All this redistribution of wealth in family benefits does is discourage the productive families (via tax) and encourage more and bigger families that don't pay their way (via benefits).

It is quite shocking just how far this has gone. Our income tax does not even cover the benefit bill, in fact it is billions short. It's time to stop.

[plasticpig]

s2art said:

Parrot of Doom said:

thinfourth2 said:

Ah yes lets make it more difficult and expensive for people TO GO TO fkING WORK YOU fkING HALF BRAINS WON'T YOU fkING REST UNTIL EVERYONE IS fkING UNEMPLOYED

JESUS fkING CHRIST GORDON WERE YOU TRAUMATIZED BY DADDY GOING TO WORK OR SOMETHING WHAT THE fk HAVING YOU GOT AGAINST PEOPLE THAT DO THIS WHOLE WORKING THING YOU fkING MORONS

Years ago, people didn't get any benefits. They still went to work, leaving the kids with the parents/neighbours/friends for the duration.

But their tax load (stealth taxes included) was probably lower.

I very much doubt they were. In the 70's basic rate income tax varied between 30-35% and the wealthy were taxed up to 83%. Until the late 80's higher rates were up at 60% and the basic rate move slowly downward from 30% to 25%.

[ascayman]

cymtriks said:

Good.

I'd like to spend the money I earn on my family in a manner and at a time that suits my family.

I do not want it taken off me "for my own good" to bail out people who contribute nothing, after a load of middle men have taken their cut, and then be given whatever is left and be expected to be oh so grateful.

In the past, and still today in most countries on Earth, there were no benefits for having more children than you can afford, people paid for their own families. All this redistribution of wealth in family benefits does is discourage the productive families (via tax) and encourage more and bigger families that don't pay their way (via benefits).

It is quite shocking just how far this has gone. Our income tax does not even cover the benefit bill, in fact it is billions short. It's time to stop.

this is a benefit being taken away from working people. people that contribute to society, people that we need to help get us out of this recession. People that are already being taxed to through the eye-balls.

amasing short-termism being shown by the government and some on here.

[SGirl]

oldbanger said:

the Department for Children, Schools and Families in London confirmed to Scotland on Sunday that the £500 million saved by taxing the vouchers, worth up to £900 a year to a typical family, will be spent providing ten hours' free care to 250,000 of the poorest children in England and Wales. ...

But why? Surely most of the parents of the "poorest children" aren't in work anyway, so why do they need external childcare at all?

This is just another leftie intervention because higher-rate taxpayers save more out of it than "honest hardworking families". Can't have all those rich barstewards going around not paying their fair share now, can we?

[die fahrt]

Shirley the Labour manifesto is irrelevant anyway?

[Gargamel]

Years ago a chap could expect to have

MIRA - Tax relief on Mortage Interest payments
Married Couples Allowance - IRRC around an additional £1750 of untaxed income
Child Tax allowance - a further £1750 for the first child

So if you were a 40% tax payer - then nearly £1400 less tax - without included MIRA


What I object to is the vast bureaucracy behind it all - why tax me one rate and then hand back a small amount, via some useless call centre.

[AndyAudi]

Gargamel said:

What I object to is the vast bureaucracy behind it all - why tax me one rate and then hand back a small amount, via some useless call centre.

I believe it is because not everyone entitled to getting some back actually claims it, so it saves them more money.
(Can't remember the figure I read on "Pension Tax Credit", but it was quite shocking how much they had budgeted to save, due to those entitled to it just not claiming it.)

ETA - 2 Billion saved per annum by 1 in 4 of those entitled not claiming it.

Edited by AndyAudi on Wednesday 7th October 12:05

[plasticpig]

Gargamel said:

Years ago a chap could expect to have

MIRA - Tax relief on Mortage Interest payments
Married Couples Allowance - IRRC around an additional £1750 of untaxed income
Child Tax allowance - a further £1750 for the first child

So if you were a 40% tax payer - then nearly £1400 less tax - without included MIRA


What I object to is the vast bureaucracy behind it all - why tax me one rate and then hand back a small amount, via some useless call centre.

Quite happy to see MIRA abolished and the Married Couples Allowance (although this still exits for the elderly). I really see no reason why people should be taxed less if they are married or own a house or for that matter have children.