ok I am a simpleton, but banks...
Discussion
BarCap didnt get a direct financial injection from our treasury. They did however use the BoE facility to keep themselves going as did every other bank, this will have been repaid including the agreed fee for the facility.
As everybody else has said it's going to be a fun time for winky if RBS etc who did get money havent paid it all back before posting profits
As everybody else has said it's going to be a fun time for winky if RBS etc who did get money havent paid it all back before posting profits
chippy17 said:
now that some of them are posting profits, will they be giving these back to the UK coffers?
I am also frankly astonished that they are still giving out bonuses
but look I have no idea how these things work but I don't get it
Not if the government doesn't own a stake.I am also frankly astonished that they are still giving out bonuses
but look I have no idea how these things work but I don't get it
They're contractually obliged to.
Obviously.
Edited by Parrot of Doom on Monday 3rd August 13:05
AndrewW-G said:
BarCap didnt get a direct financial injection from our treasury. They did however use the BoE facility to keep themselves going as did every other bank, this will have been repaid including the agreed fee for the facility.
As everybody else has said it's going to be a fun time for winky if RBS etc who did get money havent paid it all back before posting profits
did Barlcays though, and if yes, is BarCap not part of Barclays?As everybody else has said it's going to be a fun time for winky if RBS etc who did get money havent paid it all back before posting profits
Couple of thoughts about the recent bank results.
1. So the idea that part of the cause of the credit crunch was the incentivisation of bank staff encouraged them to take excessive risk has been dismissed?
2. The profits seem to have largely come from the banks trading activities as opposed to the more traditional borrowing/lending activities. Does this trading really do much good to the economy at large? If I make a profitable trade hasn’t the other party in the trade had a bad deal?
If the banks are trading on their own account to make profits aren’t the in effect acting as hedge funds? If that’s true why do the deserver state support which isn’t offered to poor hedgies when they get the numbers muddled.
1. So the idea that part of the cause of the credit crunch was the incentivisation of bank staff encouraged them to take excessive risk has been dismissed?
2. The profits seem to have largely come from the banks trading activities as opposed to the more traditional borrowing/lending activities. Does this trading really do much good to the economy at large? If I make a profitable trade hasn’t the other party in the trade had a bad deal?
If the banks are trading on their own account to make profits aren’t the in effect acting as hedge funds? If that’s true why do the deserver state support which isn’t offered to poor hedgies when they get the numbers muddled.
Barclays doesn't owe the taxpayer one penny.
It's (and I hate to admit it because I hate the chunts) a very well run organisation which makes clever decisions and good profits.
The people there are entitled to be paid well - they've earned it.
This whole jealousy thing is getting on my tits.
Soovy said:
Barclays doesn't owe the taxpayer one penny.
It's (and I hate to admit it because I hate the chunts) a very well run organisation which makes clever decisions and good profits.
The people there are entitled to be paid well - they've earned it.
This whole jealousy thing is getting on my tits.
Would Barclays have survived if the government had said "These are commercial organisations and we won't bail out any of them"? It's (and I hate to admit it because I hate the chunts) a very well run organisation which makes clever decisions and good profits.
The people there are entitled to be paid well - they've earned it.
This whole jealousy thing is getting on my tits.
Do you think the bonus system used by major banks encouraged their traders to take excessive risks?
Saying any criticism of the banking system is just jealousy is an overly simplistic defence.
Edited by Fittster on Monday 3rd August 14:14
Banks like Barclays and HSBC making profits is a very good for business as that profit can be used to invest or offset against current business loans giving a much needed injection of cash into business. The right way to do it. I wonder if Alistair Darling has been in touch to ask how they did it yet.
Fittster said:
Soovy said:
Barclays doesn't owe the taxpayer one penny.
It's (and I hate to admit it because I hate the chunts) a very well run organisation which makes clever decisions and good profits.
The people there are entitled to be paid well - they've earned it.
This whole jealousy thing is getting on my tits.
Would Barclays have survived if the government had said "These are commercial organisations and we won't bail out any of them"? It's (and I hate to admit it because I hate the chunts) a very well run organisation which makes clever decisions and good profits.
The people there are entitled to be paid well - they've earned it.
This whole jealousy thing is getting on my tits.
Do you think the bonus system used by major banks encouraged their traders to take excessive risks?
Saying any criticism of the banking system is just jealousy is an overly simplistic defence.
Edited by Fittster on Monday 3rd August 14:14
I take no delight in defending them, I worked for BarCap for five years and I did it for the money, not love.
I hate the chunts, but to moan that they're making a profit is churlish.
I assume you have a pension? If so, you should be cheering, as most of the major pension funds have large shareholdings in Barclays. Or perhaps you'd rather that Barclays gave all its profit to the taxman rather than your nest egg??
The banks in this country are relatively well run in general and have their fingers in many different pies. Some are better than others, such as Barclays. Barclays did not take any hand-out money and IIRC took some Middle Eastern money instead - though this was an investment not hand-out. But even then, lets not get hung-up on the whole hand-out thing. Some banks needed some assistance to maintain their reserves and boost their support. With the markets taking a very dim view of what had happened and the huge risks that were potentially being run, this risked a run on the banks and contrary to popular belief they do not have vaults full of billions of pounds, just in case Mrs Smith wants her money back (and the other millions of people).....
The money boost was to help out in this unusual time and as a result we the tax payer took an investment in the banks. As they return to normal and when the economy gets going again, the government is quids in. They will make a fair old chunk of change from the risk and hopefully they will repay some of the debt that they owe, which they probably wont to be honest.
As far as I can see, the banks made money before and they will make money again. Most decided to write off a load of bad debt (hence massive losses previously) but the fundamental business is there to make money. We all need banks and they skim money of each and every one of us. In general, its the banks who will be the last to make a loss - because we need to trust them, and without profits they fail.
So as far as I am concerned - BRING THE PROFITS ON. Its good for the banks. Its good for the economy. Its good for the employees. Its good for our pension funds (though not so good yet). WE NEED MORE PROFITS FROM MORE COMPANIES. And if a few people make a few million quid in bonuses on the way, so what? Good for them. Better for the economy as a whole.
The money boost was to help out in this unusual time and as a result we the tax payer took an investment in the banks. As they return to normal and when the economy gets going again, the government is quids in. They will make a fair old chunk of change from the risk and hopefully they will repay some of the debt that they owe, which they probably wont to be honest.
As far as I can see, the banks made money before and they will make money again. Most decided to write off a load of bad debt (hence massive losses previously) but the fundamental business is there to make money. We all need banks and they skim money of each and every one of us. In general, its the banks who will be the last to make a loss - because we need to trust them, and without profits they fail.
So as far as I am concerned - BRING THE PROFITS ON. Its good for the banks. Its good for the economy. Its good for the employees. Its good for our pension funds (though not so good yet). WE NEED MORE PROFITS FROM MORE COMPANIES. And if a few people make a few million quid in bonuses on the way, so what? Good for them. Better for the economy as a whole.
As said, Barclays and HSBC didn't get bailed out. They just used cash from the fiscal stimulus package which they will repay with interest.
As long as they don't default on those payments then they are a profitable business and as such they can pay who they like, what they like. The only people who would potentially have a problem with this will be the shareholders.
RBS and Lloyds/HBOS will be the ones to watch.
As long as they don't default on those payments then they are a profitable business and as such they can pay who they like, what they like. The only people who would potentially have a problem with this will be the shareholders.
RBS and Lloyds/HBOS will be the ones to watch.
Soovy said:
Barclays doesn't owe the taxpayer one penny.
It's (and I hate to admit it because I hate the chunts) a very well run organisation which makes clever decisions and good profits.
The people there are entitled to be paid well - they've earned it.
This whole jealousy thing is getting on my tits.
it is not jealousy, far from it, I was just wondering, assuming they had borrowed (which turns out was a wrong assumption, how the paying back thing is going to workIt's (and I hate to admit it because I hate the chunts) a very well run organisation which makes clever decisions and good profits.
The people there are entitled to be paid well - they've earned it.
This whole jealousy thing is getting on my tits.
the more banks who post profits the happier I will be
Adrian W said:
Hank Potts (Barclays wealth I think) said on LBC last week that RBS and Lloyds will announce record profits this week.
I think you may have misheardhttp://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/ind...
Royal Bank of Scotland is set to disclose worse than expected results on Friday, in a week when Britain’s banks will set the tone for economic confidence for the rest of the year. ...As a result, it may only just break even for the six months to June 30 — a far worse outcome than analysts had foreseen, with Credit Suisse expecting a £1.5 billion pre-tax profit, while Exane BNP Paribas had pencilled in a £3 billion gain.
chippy17 said:
the more banks who post profits the happier I will be
Bit of a double edged sword IMHO, profits good as that helps the economy (give it 48 hours and winky will be trying to claim its all down to him!) but the profits have to come from somewhere and that somewhere at least part of the time is us, increased charges and intrest rate cuts that havent been passed on being just a couple of examples (over simplified examples at that)AndrewW-G said:
chippy17 said:
the more banks who post profits the happier I will be
Bit of a double edged sword IMHO, profits good as that helps the economy (give it 48 hours and winky will be trying to claim its all down to him!) but the profits have to come from somewhere and that somewhere at least part of the time is us, increased charges and intrest rate cuts that havent been passed on being just a couple of examples (over simplified examples at that)Investment Banks like BarCap have ZERO to do with what you pay for your overdraft.
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