What Industries have politicians killed off ?

What Industries have politicians killed off ?

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Discussion

elster

Original Poster:

17,517 posts

216 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
quotequote all
So what industries can you think of that politicians have taxed to buggery or squashed to insignificance?

Also what are ones for the future?

Film Industry

To come:
Aviation

Eric Mc

122,699 posts

271 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
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The aviation in dustry was killed off in 1965. Some will say that the seeds for its demise were sown as far back as 1957.

The Hypno-Toad

12,630 posts

211 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
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Eric Mc said:
The aviation in dustry was killed off in 1965. Some will say that the seeds for its demise were sown as far back as 1957.
+1. Three little letters and a number. TSR2

AndrewW-G

11,968 posts

223 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
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Shipping - labour with unions 1970's

Eric Mc

122,699 posts

271 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
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To be honest, many industries in the UK were already pretty sick - with poor labour practices and lack of investment by their management. This meant that, by the 1970s, they were in no position to compete effectively against similar industries in other countries.

greygoose

8,585 posts

201 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
quotequote all
elster said:
So what industries can you think of that politicians have taxed to buggery or squashed to insignificance?
The pensions "industry".

FourWheelDrift

89,426 posts

290 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
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The Hypno-Toad said:
Eric Mc said:
The aviation in dustry was killed off in 1965. Some will say that the seeds for its demise were sown as far back as 1957.
+1. Three little letters and a number. TSR2
Wilson also killed off the much improved Valiant B mk2 and the Supersonic version of the harrier. It was lucky they allowed the subsonic version to be produced.

Eric Mc

122,699 posts

271 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
quotequote all
FourWheelDrift said:
The Hypno-Toad said:
Eric Mc said:
The aviation in dustry was killed off in 1965. Some will say that the seeds for its demise were sown as far back as 1957.
+1. Three little letters and a number. TSR2
Wilson also killed off the much improved Valiant B mk2 and the Supersonic version of the harrier. It was lucky they allowed the subsonic version to be produced.
There was no "supersonic version of the Harrier". There was a proposed supersonic VTOL aircraft called the P1154 which was a proper combat aircraft using technology based on the VTOL system developed using the P1127 and Kestrel. When the P1154 was cancelled, it was decided instead to fully develop the Kestrel into a proper operational aircraft, which became the Harrier.

FourWheelDrift

89,426 posts

290 months

Saturday 27th June 2009
quotequote all
You know exactly what I meant besides you have no idea if the supersonic vstol aircraft wouldnt have been called a Harrier instead of the subsonic plane that was made in its place.

groak

3,254 posts

185 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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Coalmining. Killed by Thatchler.

thinfourth2

32,414 posts

210 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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groak said:
Coalmining. Killed by Thatchler.
No she put it out of it's misery, the unions are the ones who put the industry on life support

Baby Huey

4,881 posts

205 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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thinfourth2 said:
groak said:
Coalmining. Killed by Thatchler.
No she put it out of it's misery, the unions are the ones who put the industry on life support
In your opinion. Shipbuilding went the same under Maggie too.

The Hypno-Toad

12,630 posts

211 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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FourWheelDrift said:
The Hypno-Toad said:
Eric Mc said:
The aviation in dustry was killed off in 1965. Some will say that the seeds for its demise were sown as far back as 1957.
+1. Three little letters and a number. TSR2
Wilson also killed off the much improved Valiant B mk2 and the Supersonic version of the harrier. It was lucky they allowed the subsonic version to be produced.
The list is actually far longer than even that;

1.) Giving all our research data on supersonic flight to the Americans at the end of the war including our data on the all flying tail.

2.) Cancelling development of the SR177 jet/rocket fighter. This would have been ideal as a point defence fighter for the Germans and they very keen on it but Duncan Sandys white paper cancelled the project and the Germans eventually bought Starfighters instead. And how many of those were sold round the world in the end?

3.) Cancelling the Fairy Delta project. Okay the information gathered was probably helpful towards Concorde and we did have the Lightning but 1132mph in level flight? In 1956? And just remind me again, how many Mirage IIIs (which seemed remarkably similar to the Delta) did the French sell?

4.) The Gnat Mk2 light fighter. How many Skyhawks & F5s did the Americans sell to developing nations?

5.) TSR2. nuff said. It was about 5000 Phantoms wasn't it?

6.) The P1154 Supersonic VSTOL

7.) The HS681 transport aircraft.

Not all of them would have been world beaters but some of them might have been.

Looking back down the years it is funny that the TSR was cancelled in favour of a much delayed and inferior American product that we then had to cancel in order to buy an even more inferior one. And its a remarkable coinciedence that at this time Lockheed was chucking massive bribes around German & Japanese politicans in order for them not only to purchase the Starfighter but to ignore its some times fatal flaws. We had a Labour government at the time the aircraft was cancelled but they wouldn't have taken any bribes would they? I mean c'mon, Labour politicans? Whiter than white.

The Minister of Defence at the time of the cancellation it would later transpire was a member of a secret organisation which help promotes American interests around the world. Denis Healey is so far the only British politican, past or present, who admits to being a memember of The Bilderburg Group. But this did not have any bearing on the cancellation of the TSR2 & the ripping up of a multi billion contract with the Aussies who went on to buy American F111s instead and you would be a fool and a communist to think so.

Okay eric, I know Mountbatten and his lust for Aircraft Carriers had a lot to do with it but this has always struck me as smelling of yesterdays fish. One day the truth will out.




Dr Jekyll

23,820 posts

267 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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Miles M52 anybody?

Also sabotaging attempts to sell the Lightning to the Luftwaffe. They bought the Starfighter instead, then when the German navy wanted the Buccaneer they were told they had to buy Starfighters because the Luftwaffe already had them.

Scrapping Britain's answer to the 707 (V1000 was it?) because 'nobody needs transatlantic jets and BOAC won't buy the 707 honest' then buying 707s for BOAC as soon as it was too late to revive the program.

Eric Mc

122,699 posts

271 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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Not to mention Duncan Sandys' White Paper of 1957 - which more or less sealed the fate of so many of these projects.

The aviation industry were not always helpful to their own cause - with too many projects at times and some very old fashioned construction methods (although there was innovation as well). They also lacked marketing skills and production capability - so that when a design was successful (like the Viscount or the Canberra) the manufacturer really found it difficult to deliver finished aircraft on time.

Dunk76

4,350 posts

220 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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One of the biggest travesties of all is actually the Chieftain Main Battle Tank's powerplant. Political meddling of the highest order, and finished the Chieftain and subsequent Challengers as export propositions. The Chieftain eventually came good from Mk.5 onwards, but by then it was too late.

However, there have been some success stories;

CVR(t) series AFVs.
Westland Lynx
Harrier

Ummm, ummm.... errr...

Eric Mc

122,699 posts

271 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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BAe Hawk.
EE Canberra.
Vickers Viscount
De Havilland Dove
Hawker Siddeley HS748

GreenV8S

30,421 posts

290 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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The Hypno-Toad said:
Looking back down the years it is funny that the TSR was cancelled in favour of a much delayed and inferior American product that we then had to cancel in order to buy an even more inferior one.
They didn't just cancel the TSR2 though, did they? They insisted all parts and tools were physically destroyed, the designs and research notes were destroyed, to make sure that no subsequent government could ever bring it back to life. There was no way that was a financial decision, that was malicious.

cymtriks

4,561 posts

251 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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It's very hard to say that politicians actually killed off any industry. In most cases politicians only become invloved when an industry is either dying anyway or treading carefully through international politics.

I'd gues that they had a hand in not saving or helping (or backstabing) :

Farming
Cars
Aviation

They have however absolutely certainly killed off a lot of value and respect for:

Parliament
Education
Law

s2art

18,942 posts

259 months

Sunday 28th June 2009
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Black Arrow and Black Knight need to be mentioned too.