Obama to suspend habeas corpus?
Discussion
According this this Obama is looking to lock people up based on possible future crimes!
He talks about replacing Guantanamo with his own detention without trial, a system he calls "Indefinite Preventative Detention" through which people who are believed to be likely to commit a crime at some point in the future can be locked up forever without charge, trial, jury or appeal.
Scary stuff.
He talks about replacing Guantanamo with his own detention without trial, a system he calls "Indefinite Preventative Detention" through which people who are believed to be likely to commit a crime at some point in the future can be locked up forever without charge, trial, jury or appeal.
Scary stuff.
theaxe said:
He talks about replacing Guantanamo with his own detention without trial, a system he calls "Indefinite Preventative Detention" through which people who are believed to be likely to commit a crime at some point in the future can be locked up forever without charge, trial, jury or appeal.
Trouble is that he's backed himself into a corner.He is publically committed to closing Gitmo, is trying desperately to sell SuperMax prisons on US soil as the answer, which the average Yank is having nothing of. They don't want these guys on US soil under any circumstances. Once they are in the US, they have rights, and there will be an army of lawyers willing to represent them.
So Obi is casting around for a solution that satisfies everyone.
theaxe said:
He talks about replacing Guantanamo with his own detention without trial, a system he calls "Indefinite Preventative Detention" through which people who are believed to be likely to commit a crime at some point in the future can be locked up forever without charge, trial, jury or appeal.
There's nothing like a good old re-branding exercise. They'll probably just change the sign over the door.
MSNBC can be fun. Joe Scarboro is ok and Keith Olbermann is enjoyable if you treat his show purely as light entertainment rather than a fact based newsy type show. (Ben Afflecks piss take of him on SNL last year was the funniest thing Ive seen on TV for ages). Chris Mathews is sincere although biased and it was fun to watch him eulogise in an almost homo erotic way about Obama during the election. But Rachel Maddow I cannot stand. There is something about her Lezzer headgirl type smugness that really sticks in my craw. She had to be slapped down gently a couple of times during the election campaign by the excellent old fox Pat Buchanan.
There is an important issue here. There are people in Gitmo who the security services know are terrorists. They cant be tried because either the evidence doesn't exist or it's "tainted" But what to do with them? It's clearly wrong to hold anyone indefinitely without a trial but releasing them stateside is also a pretty unpalateable prospect. It's a difficult issue and one for which there is no easy solution.
There is an important issue here. There are people in Gitmo who the security services know are terrorists. They cant be tried because either the evidence doesn't exist or it's "tainted" But what to do with them? It's clearly wrong to hold anyone indefinitely without a trial but releasing them stateside is also a pretty unpalateable prospect. It's a difficult issue and one for which there is no easy solution.
TVR Moneypit said:
If Labour win the next General Election, (that is of course, if they give us one), and they win, (which I believe that they will), then expect such places in the UK within a few years.
You seriously think Labour will win the next election? 
You're in a tiny minority mate. Labour have a good chance of being reduced to a tiny core of MP's at the election. Paddy Power will give you 10/1 against a labour majority at the next election. They are only offering 2/5 on a Tory majority. Even Labour politicians believe they will lose. Even Gordon Brown knows they will lose, he admitted it at PMQ's last week!
TVR Moneypit said:
unrepentant said:
TVR Moneypit said:
If Labour win the next General Election, (that is of course, if they give us one), and they win, (which I believe that they will), then expect such places in the UK within a few years.
You seriously think Labour will win the next election? You're in a tiny minority mate. Labour have a good chance of being reduced to a tiny core of MP's at the election. Paddy Power will give you 10/1 against a labour majority at the next election. They are only offering 2/5 on a Tory majority. Even Labour politicians believe they will lose. Even Gordon Brown knows they will lose, he admitted it at PMQ's last week!
But two things stand out to me......#
1; I don't trust Labour not to con, lie, cheat or steal their way to election victory.
2; I don't believe that by and large, the British populas is intellegent enough to dissmiss them to political wilderness.
3, We British ove an underdog (remember eddie the eagle?)
4, many will feel sorry for gordon when his mates try and stitch him up. (this will be another few votes)
Like I said, I pray that they wont win. I pray that they wont even come close. However, I fear that they will win. Thats the differance.
ypauly-TVR Moneypit said:
1; I don't trust Labour not to con, lie, cheat or steal their way to election victory.
2; I don't believe that by and large, the British populas is intellegent enough to dissmiss them to political wilderness.
3, We British ove an underdog (remember eddie the eagle?)
4, many will feel sorry for gordon when his mates try and stitch him up. (this will be another few votes)
1. Labour don't have the support of the people that have the power to make that happen in the first place.2; I don't believe that by and large, the British populas is intellegent enough to dissmiss them to political wilderness.
3, We British ove an underdog (remember eddie the eagle?)
4, many will feel sorry for gordon when his mates try and stitch him up. (this will be another few votes)
2. They British electorate may have an average IQ of 100, but they still understand the uncertainties around them, if they still have a house and a job. They will vote according to how wealthy they feel.
3. We may love an underdog, but not when its stolen your pension, your job, your livelihood, your home, your future, your childrens future and anything else worth living for.
4. Don't be stupid. The only reason Brown got the job was bullying and intimidation. Feel sorry for the guy? He's more unpopular than Michael Foot for heavens sake!
Edited by tinman0 on Monday 25th May 19:23
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