What is wrong with coppers
Discussion
I thought I might explain my position. I have had lots of dealings with the police over the years, mainly because of my work. They have all been unsatisfactory. I am middle class professional/management as are my friends. None of them has a good word to say either and some of them have an even lower opinion than I do. This is the reality of public opinion about the police today. Why has this come about?
1) The sort of people mainly attracted to the police must have a chip on both shoulders, they need the badge so they can have some authority in life. Once they have that authority they want everyone to know about it so go round rubbing it in at every opportunity. A pity the authorities can't do some thorough personality profiling and employ normal well balanced people. It is very telling that a lot of coppers are masons, that is right up the street of what they are like.
2) Under this government the police have been given far too much power which they then misuse and abuse. Look at stop and search and terrorism legislation, both of these are massively misused by the police. But there are many more new powers that they also abuse. The police should not have these powers over us and any new government should remove them.
3) Also under this government the police have been politicised. Now they are after us for are thoughts. Legal protest is not allowed. Political correctness has run amok. And the police are loving every minute of it. We are sleepwalking into a police state and the police, who should be our servants, have become our enemies.
1) The sort of people mainly attracted to the police must have a chip on both shoulders, they need the badge so they can have some authority in life. Once they have that authority they want everyone to know about it so go round rubbing it in at every opportunity. A pity the authorities can't do some thorough personality profiling and employ normal well balanced people. It is very telling that a lot of coppers are masons, that is right up the street of what they are like.
2) Under this government the police have been given far too much power which they then misuse and abuse. Look at stop and search and terrorism legislation, both of these are massively misused by the police. But there are many more new powers that they also abuse. The police should not have these powers over us and any new government should remove them.
3) Also under this government the police have been politicised. Now they are after us for are thoughts. Legal protest is not allowed. Political correctness has run amok. And the police are loving every minute of it. We are sleepwalking into a police state and the police, who should be our servants, have become our enemies.
Guam said:
Bing o said:
Duke of Rothesay said:
chip on both shoulders
Ironic post of the day award goes to.....
It doesn't just apply to the Police, either. There are other jobs where being in authority very often (not always) rubs off on the person involved - human nature is such that it's very difficult to prevent it.
Become a copper, and you spend a high proportion of your life exercising authority over others and dealing with criminal scum. It doesn't take long before you begin to assume that you have the right to exercise your authority all the time and that everyone is criminal scum.
I've encountered similar traits amongst teachers and prison officers.
I think part of the reason for the chip on the shoulder is that when they encounter someone who isn't of lower status/authority than themselves, is more intelligent and probably earns three times their salary as a result, they have difficulty dealing with it.
It's just a sociological/psychological fact of life, and there's not much anyone can do about it.
I think that in all walks of life you get a
holes, not just the Police. I have had no problems with any Officers I have come in contact with as I treat them with a bit of respect as I do with anyone else. If I get pulled over because my car is a bit out of place with the surroundings or I am pressing on then I am glad because they are looking out for potential criminals.
Most people (and I include Police Officers
) are normal, decent and hard working.
holes, not just the Police. I have had no problems with any Officers I have come in contact with as I treat them with a bit of respect as I do with anyone else. If I get pulled over because my car is a bit out of place with the surroundings or I am pressing on then I am glad because they are looking out for potential criminals.Most people (and I include Police Officers
) are normal, decent and hard working.Bing o said:
Duke of Rothesay said:
chip on both shoulders
Ironic post of the day award goes to.....My family and friends have all had disappointing results in how problems they had were dealt with.....my son was the victim of a vicious car jacking, my uncle died from a heart attack following the sixth burglary on his property where the police appeared totally disinterested. Despite all this I'm mature enough to realise that, in general, they do a thankless and difficult job
Duke of Rothesay said:
I thought I might explain my position. I have had lots of dealings with the police over the years, mainly because of my work. They have all been unsatisfactory. I am middle class professional/management as are my friends. None of them has a good word to say either and some of them have an even lower opinion than I do. This is the reality of public opinion about the police today.
Horses for courses really isn't it? In my case I treat them with respect as do most, (but not all), of my friends and as a result we've been treated well and sent on our way quickly with a thank you. There have been one or two times when we've been treated like idiots but as someone's already said you get bad apples in every profession and we don't hold it against all of the police.Life's too short, and I like think I'm mature enough to rise over that. But then some people will always think "the man" is after them.
My feelings regarding the Police are mixed.
Also, they have changed as I have become older.
As a young man, I felt persecuted by the police whilst driving.
In hindsight, my driving and general attitude probably deserved it. (However, what stays with me was their absolute distaste at encountering someone younger, far more intelligent and better looking than them
).
The feeling of being discriminated against, for whatever reasons, always leaves a sour taste that is hard to lose and tarnishes one's opinion of a whole organisation (in this case, the police), irrespective of the rights and wrongs of the actions; the only healer being old time herself. This is why I feel some empathy for those who feel the police are politicised and intent on persecuting certain sectors of society. Once ingrained, the feeling of persecution is not easily diminished.
As I have aged (and swapped to boring vehicles) my meetings with the police have come from the other end of the spectrum; needing their service. To be honest, despite the woeful level of assistance, I have often felt sorry for the front line offiers concerned. They are treated like robots, not allowed to divert from the official line or proceedure. I have yet to encounter a Policeman under these circumstances to be anything other than polite and helpful.
Anyway, I think it is wrong to blame the foot soldiers. Ultimately, policemen and women, are on the whole just normal folk. Expecting supreme cognitive, sherlock-esque powers of deduction is therefore ridiculous. I don't know anybody who chose joining the police over a proffessional career, for instance.
An ex's old man was/is a Chief Super; the most liberal, wet lettuce type of man I have ever known. The sort who thinks that criminals are victims of circumstance and that being stupid is a reasonable excuse for ending up on the wrong side of the law. We all know the type.
The top of the constabulary is like any business or organisation; i.e. the bottom reflects the top.
An older wiser friend of mine once mused that "you end up with the business you deserve" when discussing the problems of entrepeneurship.
The same can be said of the police.
Reform of the top will filter to the bottom; this is the only way.
Until that time, we should really lay off our Police officers. They are just normal men and women, on the whole, doing the best they can given the restrictions.
I for one would most certainly not want to walk in their shoes.
(although I liked the look of being part of that "London Police anti-capitalist bashing squad"
)
Also, they have changed as I have become older.
As a young man, I felt persecuted by the police whilst driving.
In hindsight, my driving and general attitude probably deserved it. (However, what stays with me was their absolute distaste at encountering someone younger, far more intelligent and better looking than them
).The feeling of being discriminated against, for whatever reasons, always leaves a sour taste that is hard to lose and tarnishes one's opinion of a whole organisation (in this case, the police), irrespective of the rights and wrongs of the actions; the only healer being old time herself. This is why I feel some empathy for those who feel the police are politicised and intent on persecuting certain sectors of society. Once ingrained, the feeling of persecution is not easily diminished.
As I have aged (and swapped to boring vehicles) my meetings with the police have come from the other end of the spectrum; needing their service. To be honest, despite the woeful level of assistance, I have often felt sorry for the front line offiers concerned. They are treated like robots, not allowed to divert from the official line or proceedure. I have yet to encounter a Policeman under these circumstances to be anything other than polite and helpful.
Anyway, I think it is wrong to blame the foot soldiers. Ultimately, policemen and women, are on the whole just normal folk. Expecting supreme cognitive, sherlock-esque powers of deduction is therefore ridiculous. I don't know anybody who chose joining the police over a proffessional career, for instance.
An ex's old man was/is a Chief Super; the most liberal, wet lettuce type of man I have ever known. The sort who thinks that criminals are victims of circumstance and that being stupid is a reasonable excuse for ending up on the wrong side of the law. We all know the type.
The top of the constabulary is like any business or organisation; i.e. the bottom reflects the top.
An older wiser friend of mine once mused that "you end up with the business you deserve" when discussing the problems of entrepeneurship.
The same can be said of the police.
Reform of the top will filter to the bottom; this is the only way.
Until that time, we should really lay off our Police officers. They are just normal men and women, on the whole, doing the best they can given the restrictions.
I for one would most certainly not want to walk in their shoes.
(although I liked the look of being part of that "London Police anti-capitalist bashing squad"
)Only ever had one BiB in 20 years that has been anything other than civil & courteous - even when I'm receiving a bking - and he just seemed to be having an 'off' day.
With the ever increasing paperwork BiB have to do (when they should be out chasing criminals), I'm not surprised they're unhappy, and I'm not surprised a lot of the public are unhappy with the status quo either. We seem to be paying more and more for the services and we're getting less and less 'real' officers, so that the government can claim 'more officers on the streets' when they actually mean 'more poorly-trained, part-time, cheap labour' on the streets.
king - and he just seemed to be having an 'off' day.With the ever increasing paperwork BiB have to do (when they should be out chasing criminals), I'm not surprised they're unhappy, and I'm not surprised a lot of the public are unhappy with the status quo either. We seem to be paying more and more for the services and we're getting less and less 'real' officers, so that the government can claim 'more officers on the streets' when they actually mean 'more poorly-trained, part-time, cheap labour' on the streets.
Invisible man said:
Bing o said:
Duke of Rothesay said:
chip on both shoulders
Ironic post of the day award goes to.....My family and friends have all had disappointing results in how problems they had were dealt with.....my son was the victim of a vicious car jacking, my uncle died from a heart attack following the sixth burglary on his property where the police appeared totally disinterested. Despite all this I'm mature enough to realise that, in general, they do a thankless and difficult job
As for the OP's post, well he is right in some of what he says for small number of police and the poster who said others in authority seems to suffer likewise. The real problem is that it would appear to be a cultural thing, and whilst few suffer from it right now, it seems as though it is spreading. I think it is a combination of the individuals that are selected to become BIB, some training issues, the political natuire of the job (and many others nowadays, particularly public sector), the "PC world we live in" (read forced upon us), FAR too much new legislation that is onerous on individuals (who wrongly BLAME BIB for it, but are right to feel oppressed by it's enforcement), and far far too much "compo culture" from all involved , (I mean BIB and MOPs).
I have thankfully had preceious little direct involvement with BIB all my life, most of it more recently (burglaries in the area). But the "service" I have seen has been nothing more than pitiful, (Chief INspector agreed with me!) and the actual officers I have had to deal with have I am afraid appeared to be near incompetent. Now, I am sure they have passed all their tests and done all the courses, but they just seemed "green" beyond belief and it was pretty much a waste of all our time even calling them. Just my limited experience, but one which I suspect is noted by many others.
I dont know what the answer is. I think the managers in the Police Forces need to step back a bit and maybe tackle the culture a bit. (I'd say NHS need to do likewise also). I have 4 senior police officers who live in my street, not "managers" as such, Inspector level. They all complain of "apathy" amongst many of their colleagues, both junior and senior and serious resourcing issues. It appears all the new officers promised have not filtered down to the front line and with a finite resource, so much is needed for the Friday / Sat night pxxsheads, the rest of us get a raw deal.
There is no easy answer, society itself is also to blame, but maybe our police need to refocus on "what the PUBLIC WANT" not what the managers / ministers want?
About 3 years ago, I saw two BIB walk up my street. Being nosey I went out as they walked back out (cul de sac) and asked them "what's wrong? " BIB were early 20's, one them answered me really agressively "what makes you think there is something wrong...!?" (A "nothing sir, how are you today" would have sufficed. I repleied, "well I've lived and worked here for 10 years and I've never seen even one policeman walk up the street, never mind two!" His colleague interrupted and said they were on on "routine patrol" and they went on their way....
It seems the routine is once every 13 years as they have not been seen since!
Sheets Tabuer said:
Council officials.
Horrible bitter little people with chips the size of Everest.
Agree absolutely.Horrible bitter little people with chips the size of Everest.
It has crossed my mind on more than a few occasions to wonder at who would want to work for a council. It is an institute for those who aspire to nothing. To work for a council is a self admission that you seek nothing in life other than the mundane, the dull and the slow.
The police, I understand, some do it for the passion, the desire to change, some for the opportunities and some for the power ... but a council? Why?
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