War mongering West

[Lannister902]

As I sit and watch the news on America/Israel pushing for a war with Iran, it got my thinking if modern day ( the self proclaimed 'democratic West) are the most blood thirsty killing machine in the history of empires?

I just wonder how this empire will be remembered in the dot) distant future in books/history lessons around the world. From what I can see, it'll be VERY badly...

[Mr Penguin]

Taking your argument at face value, how much do you know about history?

[Iamnotkloot]

Um? Where to start..,,.

[BikeBikeBIke]

Lannister902 said:

As I sit and watch the news on America/Israel pushing for a war with Iran, it got my thinking if modern day ( the self proclaimed 'democratic West) are the most blood thirsty killing machine in the history of empires?

I just wonder how this empire will be remembered in the dot) distant future in books/history lessons around the world. From what I can see, it'll be VERY badly...

Tricky one, because there's a pretty good case that regime change in Iran would bring a great deal of peace. So you have a war for the greater good.

But of course, if the West can use that logic then why can't China and Russia?

So put me down as a "don't know".

[Countdown]

BikeBikeBIke said:

Tricky one, because there's a pretty good case that regime change in Iran would bring a great deal of peace. So you have a war for the greater good.

The war isn't for the "Greater Good". It's purely for Israel and the US's good. Actually thousands of Shia getting slaughtered will cheer up the Sunni fundamentalists as well.

I've said it before - the US is perfectly happy for despotic regimes to stay in place, regardless of how many people they kill, as long as they do what the US wants.

[FredericRobinson]

Lannister902 said:

As I sit and watch the news on America/Israel pushing for a war with Iran, it got my thinking if modern day ( the self proclaimed 'democratic West) are the most blood thirsty killing machine in the history of empires?

I just wonder how this empire will be remembered in the dot) distant future in books/history lessons around the world. From what I can see, it'll be VERY badly...

There’s plenty to criticise, but they’re no where near the most blood thirsty killing machine of the last 100 years, never mind history

[JuanCarlosFandango]

It mostly depends on who gets to write the history books. Most powers/empires/hegemons do some good stuff and some bad stuff.

[BikeBikeBIke]

Countdown said:

The war isn't for the "Greater Good". It's purely for Israel and the US's good.

Bullst. The Houtis were literally trying to blockade Europe by firing missiles at ships and Iran were behind that.

As we know from the WhatsApps that when America took action they nearly didn't becaise it would benefit Europe and Vance hates that.

So regeme change in Iran is definately for the greater good, and certainly a good thing for Europe. (If it works which is debatable.)

[franki68]

Countdown said:

The war isn't for the "Greater Good". It's purely for Israel and the US's good. Actually thousands of Shia getting slaughtered will cheer up the Sunni fundamentalists as well.

I've said it before - the US is perfectly happy for despotic regimes to stay in place, regardless of how many people they kill, as long as they do what the US wants.

I think Yemen , Syria , and Lebanon would all disagree with your first sentence.

[John145]

Lannister902 said:

As I sit and watch the news on America/Israel pushing for a war with Iran, it got my thinking if modern day ( the self proclaimed 'democratic West) are the most blood thirsty killing machine in the history of empires?

I just wonder how this empire will be remembered in the dot) distant future in books/history lessons around the world. From what I can see, it'll be VERY badly...

How do people get to adulthood so ignorant of history?

How many people were killed by authoritarian regimes between 1900 and today? Millions and millions. Whether it was orchestrated famine, world wars, holocaust... And somehow we think that Trump and Israel are suddenly comparable to these atrocities. Beggars belief!

[Wills2]

The middle east does seem to have issues with democracy, but I guess that's their culture but it would help if they stopped putting Islamic terrorists in charge, Iran's regime is appalling and has been for 50 years the world would be a better place if they were removed but that's not our issue to solve.

If everything was going great in the country but the regime was still acting as does outside its borders, then I doubt there would be many fingers raised internally make of that what you will....

[Gargamel]

Lannister902 said:

As I sit and watch the news on America/Israel pushing for a war with Iran, it got my thinking if modern day ( the self proclaimed 'democratic West) are the most blood thirsty killing machine in the history of empires?

I just wonder how this empire will be remembered in the dot) distant future in books/history lessons around the world. From what I can see, it'll be VERY badly...

Wait until you hear about Joesef Stalin or another guy called Mao Zedong.

[John145]

Wills2 said:

The middle east does seem to have issues with democracy, but I guess that's their culture but it would help if they stopped putting Islamic terrorists in charge, Iran's regime is appalling and has been for 50 years the world would be a better place if they were removed but that's not our issue to solve.

If everything was going great in the country but the regime was still acting as does outside its borders, then I doubt there would be many fingers raised internally make of that what you will....

When there is a democratic will being smashed down by the weight of automatic weapon fire, we as a democratic nation have a duty to respond. The fact our nations military is a joke that we can’t do anything is the only excuse for our impotence.

[otolith]

Wills2 said:

The middle east does seem to have issues with democracy, but I guess that's their culture but it would help if they stopped putting Islamic terrorists in charge, Iran's regime is appalling and has been for 50 years the world would be a better place if they were removed but that's not our issue to solve.

If everything was going great in the country but the regime was still acting as does outside its borders, then I doubt there would be many fingers raised internally make of that what you will....

Umm.

There was a democracy in Iran. We and the Americans deliberately undermined it because it nationalised its oil.

[swisstoni]

Iamnotkloot said:

Um? Where to start..,,.

Indeed. Can't really imbue someone with a clue about history with a post on a forum.

[Getragdogleg]

Gargamel said:

Wait until you hear about Joesef Stalin or another guy called Mao Zedong.

Mao "wasn't too bad on balance".

[grumbledoak]

The US is ruthless and murderous, and it's military bases span the world. But for direct and intentional deaths of civilians it isn't the same league as the Bolsheviks

[W12GT]

BikeBikeBIke said:

Lannister902 said:

As I sit and watch the news on America/Israel pushing for a war with Iran, it got my thinking if modern day ( the self proclaimed 'democratic West) are the most blood thirsty killing machine in the history of empires?

I just wonder how this empire will be remembered in the dot) distant future in books/history lessons around the world. From what I can see, it'll be VERY badly...

Tricky one, because there's a pretty good case that regime change in Iran would bring a great deal of peace. So you have a war for the greater good.

But of course, if the West can use that logic then why can't China and Russia?

So put me down as a "don't know".

I think you need to add USA and Israel to your list, more so that China!

[Earthdweller]

Lannister902 said:

As I sit and watch the news on America/Israel pushing for a war with Iran, it got my thinking if modern day ( the self proclaimed 'democratic West) are the most blood thirsty killing machine in the history of empires?

I just wonder how this empire will be remembered in the dot) distant future in books/history lessons around the world. From what I can see, it'll be VERY badly...

Perhaps just look at the siege of Beizers in 1209 when the crusaders under the command of the Pope laid besiege to the city. On taking the city they massacred the entire population ..: some 20k people .. hacked to death men, women and children and put to the sword "kill them all" went the cry "God will know his own"

That's just one incident from the crusades ...

and there's so many more from the hordes of Ghengis Khan to the Berber invasion of Iberia

Or in more recent times the partition of India in 1947 where it's estimated upto 2 million were slaughtered

So no I don't think the modern west comes anywhere close, sorrry

[Huzzah]

Gengis Khan killed 10s of millions, some estimates as high as 43 million, wiping out an est 10% of the worlds population at the time.

Such was the devastation much arable land returned to forest. Doing his bit for carbon capture.

Edited by Huzzah on Friday 20th February 13:56