Asda Equal Pay Claim
Discussion
Couldn't see a thread on this but has been discussed in the past.
Employment Tribunal has ruled that Retail work and Warehouse work is of equal value exposing Asda to £1.2 billion claim.
https://www.cityam.com/asda-equal-pay-dispute-adva...
The slight flaw in this ruling is that it is complete nonsense as Warehouse work is usually hard and often with unsociable hours, but that has never stopped such rulings before.
Employment Tribunal has ruled that Retail work and Warehouse work is of equal value exposing Asda to £1.2 billion claim.
https://www.cityam.com/asda-equal-pay-dispute-adva...
The slight flaw in this ruling is that it is complete nonsense as Warehouse work is usually hard and often with unsociable hours, but that has never stopped such rulings before.
I suppose the next stage in the process will deliver some sanity in this nonsense case. Asda, I assume, will argue that distribution centre (DC) jobs involve unsociable hours, low temperatures, a degree of physical danger (forklift trucks for example). a long commute to work and perhaps some other stuff too. It may be that it's easier to recruit checkout staff than DC workers. And so on.
With £1 billion or more reportedly at stake, I image Asda will be engaging some very, very good lawyers (if they haven't already) as the case moves into the serious phase.
With £1 billion or more reportedly at stake, I image Asda will be engaging some very, very good lawyers (if they haven't already) as the case moves into the serious phase.
The starting point for this is ridiculous. Wages are not determined by nebulous concepts of value ,but by the difficulty of recruitment of sufficient staff for the role. Which almost certainly explains why warehouse staff are paid more than shop staff.
How can an employer recruit staff for unpopular roles if they are not allowed to pay more than for those with lots of applicants?
How can an employer recruit staff for unpopular roles if they are not allowed to pay more than for those with lots of applicants?
In my teens I worked in a cash and carry at weekends to earn some money. Someone at a supermarket checkout would scan a pack of beans or maybe a 4 can multipack of beans. At the C&C I would have to lift a tray of 30 beans, scan it and place in onto another trolley. Same with 6-8 packs of poly wrapped 2 litre drinks which would cut into your hands when being scanned. When we were quiet, we were lugging pallets of bulk stock around using hand pump trucks compared to someone getting a small pack of stock from a cage.
Every time I go in to a C&C I still admire those working there.
Every time I go in to a C&C I still admire those working there.
mac96 said:
The starting point for this is ridiculous. Wages are not determined by nebulous concepts of value ,but by the difficulty of recruitment of sufficient staff for the role. Which almost certainly explains why warehouse staff are paid more than shop staff.
How can an employer recruit staff for unpopular roles if they are not allowed to pay more than for those with lots of applicants?
Well the issue is more that there was historically gender pay discrimination if you go back far enough. Hence why there was an equal pay act. How can an employer recruit staff for unpopular roles if they are not allowed to pay more than for those with lots of applicants?
The issue becomes when work that is very different suddenly starts to be considered of "equal value", when it is a nonsense. We had it with bin men and dinner ladies and now we are having it with Retail work and Warehouse work. If they are the same why is the employer having to pay more to recruit?, answer because they are not.
Are the female workers in the warehouse paid the same as the male warehouse workers?
Are the female retail workers paid the same as the male retail workers?
If so, I struggle to see how they justify the claim using sex discrimination as part of the argument.
There are comparators in each role of both sexes surely?
This reminds me of the equality drive for pensions equality when the female complainants got their equality, they had their retirement age pushed back 5 years to match that of their male comparators.....
Waits for Asda to ring fence the current pay rate of the warehouse workers until the retail workers catch up.......
Are the female retail workers paid the same as the male retail workers?
If so, I struggle to see how they justify the claim using sex discrimination as part of the argument.
There are comparators in each role of both sexes surely?
This reminds me of the equality drive for pensions equality when the female complainants got their equality, they had their retirement age pushed back 5 years to match that of their male comparators.....
Waits for Asda to ring fence the current pay rate of the warehouse workers until the retail workers catch up.......
Rushjob said:
Waits for Asda to ring fence the current pay rate of the warehouse workers until the retail workers catch up.......
If the supermarkets could simply pay warehouse workers less they would already be doing so. This case seemed to correspond to a drive for far more self scan checkouts so do not be surprised if they are shedding as many workers on the Retail side they can.
JagLover said:
Warehouse work is usually hard and often with unsociable hours, but that has never stopped such rulings before.
In a Warehouse, if people are doing things by hand then surely things have gone wrong. Driving a forklift isn't a particularly physical job.I'd agree that people rolling stuff around on pallets and in cages are doing hard physical work, though I'd also say the same pallets and cages get wheeled about inside shops by the folk stacking shelves.
"unsociable hours" - dunno if they still do this now, but for the time period these folk are claiming, night shift was a thing in shops, for shelf stacking.
What about warehouse work is heavier than moving the same goods around inside a shop?
Cold said:
Sounds like Asda should be scheduling some of the checkout workers to start doing shifts in the warehouse.
If they did, what would they be paid?--> https://www.asda.jobs/jobs/warehouse-colleague-in-...
asda said:
Job Reference Code: R-048919
Employment Type: Full time
Contract Type: Permanent
Shift Pattern: Work Shift: Afternoons
Hours per Week: 40
Pay Rate: £15.41
Category: Distribution/Transportation, Warehouse
Closing Date: 15 February 2025
Warehouse Colleague
Warehouse and Logistics
About the Role
Our operation runs 24 hours per day, 7 days per week, with that brings a wide variety of shift patterns – if you're looking for flexible working to fit around your lifestyle, then look no further! We'll work with you on your shifts, but late and weekend working is a requirement of the role and we may need to be flexible with your work pattern.
Our stores are packed with thousands of products, from clothes and household items, through to tinned foods, frozen goods and chilled produce, and without our warehouse teams they wouldn't be on the shelves for our customers! Our warehouse teams pick and organise the right products to make sure they all get to the right stores at the right time. It's a vital part of our supply chain and it makes for fast-moving, busy and varied work.
you'll be responsible for:
Picking stock either by store or by product type and pulling together deliveries for stores
Using all our equipment (don't worry, we'll fully train you on how to use it safely and effectively).
If you're looking for the chance to pursue a career in logistics Please note you will need to pass functional Maths and English skills test to be eligible unless exempt from prior learning.
About You
You'll be naturally friendly and want to get stuck in, working with your team to deliver great results.
You'll have an enthusiastic approach to learning new skills. You'll deliver high standards, working accurately and efficiently. You care about delivering goods to stores ‘on time in full' as ensuring stores have the right stock at the right time means our products are always available for our customers.
Your Benefits
Alongside a competitive salary, you'll get lots of other great benefits too, including 10% off your Asda shopping, incentive schemes, a pension scheme, and discounts across a range of services and activities, from airport parking to theme parks and cinemas.
--> https://www.asda.jobs/jobs/section-leader-in-rugby...Employment Type: Full time
Contract Type: Permanent
Shift Pattern: Work Shift: Afternoons
Hours per Week: 40
Pay Rate: £15.41
Category: Distribution/Transportation, Warehouse
Closing Date: 15 February 2025
Warehouse Colleague
Warehouse and Logistics
About the Role
Our operation runs 24 hours per day, 7 days per week, with that brings a wide variety of shift patterns – if you're looking for flexible working to fit around your lifestyle, then look no further! We'll work with you on your shifts, but late and weekend working is a requirement of the role and we may need to be flexible with your work pattern.
Our stores are packed with thousands of products, from clothes and household items, through to tinned foods, frozen goods and chilled produce, and without our warehouse teams they wouldn't be on the shelves for our customers! Our warehouse teams pick and organise the right products to make sure they all get to the right stores at the right time. It's a vital part of our supply chain and it makes for fast-moving, busy and varied work.
you'll be responsible for:
Picking stock either by store or by product type and pulling together deliveries for stores
Using all our equipment (don't worry, we'll fully train you on how to use it safely and effectively).
If you're looking for the chance to pursue a career in logistics Please note you will need to pass functional Maths and English skills test to be eligible unless exempt from prior learning.
About You
You'll be naturally friendly and want to get stuck in, working with your team to deliver great results.
You'll have an enthusiastic approach to learning new skills. You'll deliver high standards, working accurately and efficiently. You care about delivering goods to stores ‘on time in full' as ensuring stores have the right stock at the right time means our products are always available for our customers.
Your Benefits
Alongside a competitive salary, you'll get lots of other great benefits too, including 10% off your Asda shopping, incentive schemes, a pension scheme, and discounts across a range of services and activities, from airport parking to theme parks and cinemas.
asda said:
Job Reference Code: R-048448
Employment Type: Full time
Contract Type: Permanent
Shift Pattern: Work Shift: Days
Hours per Week: 36
Pay Rate: £13.04
Category: Retail Hourly Colleagues, Store Management
Closing Date: 11 February 2025
Section Leader
Store
About the Role
To be employed in this role you must be over the age of 18.
Our operation runs 24 hours per day, 7 days per week, with that brings a wide variety of shift patterns – if you're looking for flexible working to fit around your lifestyle, then look no further! We'll work with you on your shifts, but late and weekend working is a requirement of the role and we may need to be flexible with your work pattern.
There's a role for everyone in retail - including leadership. As a Section Leader, you'll be the first point of contact for your team. You'll assist with training colleagues and keeping them fully informed by communicating messages in team ‘huddles'. You'll make sure colleagues are available to maintain product availability and meet the expectations of our customers through careful planning of overtime and holidays, ensuring colleagues are in the right place at the right time.
We'll help you to train in different areas and continually develop your skills, so if you're looking for a chance to develop in retail, this could be the role for you!
About You
You'll be naturally friendly and want to get stuck in, working with your team to deliver great results.
You'll have an enthusiastic approach to learning new skills across different departments, and be a strong coach, mentor and motivator for your team. You'll be a role model to the colleagues around you, ensuring customers have a great shopping experience.
Your Benefits
Alongside a competitive salary, you'll get lots of other great benefits too, including 10% off your Asda shopping, incentive schemes, a pension scheme, and discounts across a range of services and activities, from airport parking to theme parks and cinemas.
Employment Type: Full time
Contract Type: Permanent
Shift Pattern: Work Shift: Days
Hours per Week: 36
Pay Rate: £13.04
Category: Retail Hourly Colleagues, Store Management
Closing Date: 11 February 2025
Section Leader
Store
About the Role
To be employed in this role you must be over the age of 18.
Our operation runs 24 hours per day, 7 days per week, with that brings a wide variety of shift patterns – if you're looking for flexible working to fit around your lifestyle, then look no further! We'll work with you on your shifts, but late and weekend working is a requirement of the role and we may need to be flexible with your work pattern.
There's a role for everyone in retail - including leadership. As a Section Leader, you'll be the first point of contact for your team. You'll assist with training colleagues and keeping them fully informed by communicating messages in team ‘huddles'. You'll make sure colleagues are available to maintain product availability and meet the expectations of our customers through careful planning of overtime and holidays, ensuring colleagues are in the right place at the right time.
We'll help you to train in different areas and continually develop your skills, so if you're looking for a chance to develop in retail, this could be the role for you!
About You
You'll be naturally friendly and want to get stuck in, working with your team to deliver great results.
You'll have an enthusiastic approach to learning new skills across different departments, and be a strong coach, mentor and motivator for your team. You'll be a role model to the colleagues around you, ensuring customers have a great shopping experience.
Your Benefits
Alongside a competitive salary, you'll get lots of other great benefits too, including 10% off your Asda shopping, incentive schemes, a pension scheme, and discounts across a range of services and activities, from airport parking to theme parks and cinemas.
Edited by CraigyMc on Tuesday 4th February 12:21
JagLover said:
Couldn't see a thread on this but has been discussed in the past.
Employment Tribunal has ruled that Retail work and Warehouse work is of equal value exposing Asda to £1.2 billion claim.
https://www.cityam.com/asda-equal-pay-dispute-adva...
The slight flaw in this ruling is that it is complete nonsense as Warehouse work is usually hard and often with unsociable hours, but that has never stopped such rulings before.
Equal value does not in itself mean equal effort.Employment Tribunal has ruled that Retail work and Warehouse work is of equal value exposing Asda to £1.2 billion claim.
https://www.cityam.com/asda-equal-pay-dispute-adva...
The slight flaw in this ruling is that it is complete nonsense as Warehouse work is usually hard and often with unsociable hours, but that has never stopped such rulings before.
Rushjob said:
Are the female workers in the warehouse paid the same as the male warehouse workers?
Are the female retail workers paid the same as the male retail workers?
If so, I struggle to see how they justify the claim using sex discrimination as part of the argument.
There are comparators in each role of both sexes surely?
This reminds me of the equality drive for pensions equality when the female complainants got their equality, they had their retirement age pushed back 5 years to match that of their male comparators.....
Waits for Asda to ring fence the current pay rate of the warehouse workers until the retail workers catch up.......
Yes they were, and there were both genders doing both jobs. The argument (IIRC) was that more women chose the retail jobs.Are the female retail workers paid the same as the male retail workers?
If so, I struggle to see how they justify the claim using sex discrimination as part of the argument.
There are comparators in each role of both sexes surely?
This reminds me of the equality drive for pensions equality when the female complainants got their equality, they had their retirement age pushed back 5 years to match that of their male comparators.....
Waits for Asda to ring fence the current pay rate of the warehouse workers until the retail workers catch up.......
Working in a warehouse is significantly harder, and is generally further to travel (as there are fewer of them).
There is a reason it pays more, because fewer people want to do it. If a woman in a retail store feels hard done by apply for a job in the warehouse. My wife did it back in the 90's and it was hard work, often inside freezers at -20.
A forklift driver in the warehouse is paid more than a forklift driver at the store. Both are doing a similar job and have the same level of qualification. So I can see the argument there.
But 95% of the forklift drivers at stores are male. So we can’t use that as an example. There is a reason most of the store forklift drivers are male. It’s because it’s harder physical work than sitting on a checkout.
Asda won’t stagnate warehouse wages. The drivers and the warehouse staff are heavily unionised and will strike if they don’t get a rise. So they have no choice but to fight it.
But 95% of the forklift drivers at stores are male. So we can’t use that as an example. There is a reason most of the store forklift drivers are male. It’s because it’s harder physical work than sitting on a checkout.
Asda won’t stagnate warehouse wages. The drivers and the warehouse staff are heavily unionised and will strike if they don’t get a rise. So they have no choice but to fight it.
CraigyMc said:
In a Warehouse, if people are doing things by hand then surely things have gone wrong. Driving a forklift isn't a particularly physical job.
I'd agree that people rolling stuff around on pallets and in cages are doing hard physical work, though I'd also say the same pallets and cages get wheeled about inside shops by the folk stacking shelves.
"unsociable hours" - dunno if they still do this now, but for the time period these folk are claiming, night shift was a thing in shops, for shelf stacking.
What about warehouse work is heavier than moving the same goods around inside a shop?
How do you explain why fewer people wanting to do the warehouse work? I'd agree that people rolling stuff around on pallets and in cages are doing hard physical work, though I'd also say the same pallets and cages get wheeled about inside shops by the folk stacking shelves.
"unsociable hours" - dunno if they still do this now, but for the time period these folk are claiming, night shift was a thing in shops, for shelf stacking.
What about warehouse work is heavier than moving the same goods around inside a shop?
Asda will pay as little as they can for each job, so the higher wages are due to difficulties in recruitment.
It may not even be that much higher now. My son is a shelf stacker with Aldi and they have company a couple of quid above minimum wage these days to attract and retain staff.
Sheets Tabuer said:
Why would you work in a warehouse rather than a checkout for the same money, you get to sit down, there are no performance targets, don't get told off for having a natter and your in the warm.
The converse is also true, why work on the shop floor and deal with a million grumpy customers and being exposed to a wide variety of diseases on a daily basis.You get to sit on the forklift and I`m sure there is a lot of "bants" when the manager is off playing golf
Its almost like they are totally different roles with different skill sets!
Philip Richardson said:
“At its core, it underlines once again that there is no genuine reason for a disparity in pay between store workers and warehouse workers based solely on their sex,” he concluded.
Sure, but is that actually the case?JagLover said:
mac96 said:
The starting point for this is ridiculous. Wages are not determined by nebulous concepts of value ,but by the difficulty of recruitment of sufficient staff for the role. Which almost certainly explains why warehouse staff are paid more than shop staff.
How can an employer recruit staff for unpopular roles if they are not allowed to pay more than for those with lots of applicants?
Well the issue is more that there was historically gender pay discrimination if you go back far enough. Hence why there was an equal pay act. How can an employer recruit staff for unpopular roles if they are not allowed to pay more than for those with lots of applicants?
The issue becomes when work that is very different suddenly starts to be considered of "equal value", when it is a nonsense. We had it with bin men and dinner ladies and now we are having it with Retail work and Warehouse work. If they are the same why is the employer having to pay more to recruit?, answer because they are not.
The trouble with 'value' in this context is that it is subjective and completely ignores supply and demand.
Is a hedge fund manager worth more than several nurses? How many nurses?
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