Rayner - housing targets

[crankedup5]

From the woman’s mouth ‘ we will not be building on ‘Suffolk’s rolling hills countryside’. Doesn’t bode well.

[119]

She is on This Morning today to put all our minds at rest apparently.

[.:ian:.]

I mean, at least she can't be wrong? Right?

[Dingu]

We need houses, it’s about time it got done.

[Kwackersaki]

From the property developers on here, have we actually got the resources and enough skilled personnel to build 300’000 new houses per year, or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

[WyrleyD]

Kwackersaki said:

From the property developers on here, have we actually got the resources and enough skilled personnel to build 300’000 new houses per year, or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

No, my son-in-law has had a terrible time in the last couple of years getting and keeping skilled trades/time served workers. His very best blokes are coming up to retirement and there just aren't the skilled people coming through and when they do start work they do it for a couple of months and disappear saying it's too hard. This is in S. Yorks/N Lincs/Notts. i think Rayner is living in some sort of parallel universe.

[119]

10,000 homes per town.

Yep, thats easily achievable.

[simon_harris]

There simply isn't the workforce to build them and it isn't possible to import the skilled workforce required in the timescales being discussed

[Kwackersaki]

WyrleyD said:

Kwackersaki said:

From the property developers on here, have we actually got the resources and enough skilled personnel to build 300’000 new houses per year, or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

No, my son-in-law has had a terrible time in the last couple of years getting and keeping skilled trades/time served workers. His very best blokes are coming up to retirement and there just aren't the skilled people coming through and when they do start work they do it for a couple of months and disappear saying it's too hard. This is in S. Yorks/N Lincs/Notts. i think Rayner is living in some sort of parallel universe.

I thought it might be the case.

From my experience, I’ve been waiting for the roofer to turn up now for 5 months and the builder has threatened to be here ‘next week’ three times over the last 4 months and I’ve now given up on him. Our neighbours can’t even get a roofer round for a quote.

[aeropilot]

WyrleyD said:

Kwackersaki said:

From the property developers on here, have we actually got the resources and enough skilled personnel to build 300’000 new houses per year, or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

No, my son-in-law has had a terrible time in the last couple of years getting and keeping skilled trades/time served workers. His very best blokes are coming up to retirement and there just aren't the skilled people coming through and when they do start work they do it for a couple of months and disappear saying it's too hard. This is in S. Yorks/N Lincs/Notts. i think Rayner is living in some sort of parallel universe.

Yep.

Not enough skilled people building the numbers currently, let alone more. Also, not enough skilled people to supervise the less skilled people either.

Rayner is idiot. Or rather Starmer is an idiot for making her a minister.

[Cupramax]

crankedup5 said:

From the woman’s mouth ‘ we will not be building on ‘Suffolk’s rolling hills countryside’. Doesn’t bode well.

I’m glad I’m not the only one that had a chuckle at that, she’s a cretin.

[Collectingbrass]

aeropilot said:

WyrleyD said:

Kwackersaki said:

From the property developers on here, have we actually got the resources and enough skilled personnel to build 300’000 new houses per year, or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

No, my son-in-law has had a terrible time in the last couple of years getting and keeping skilled trades/time served workers. His very best blokes are coming up to retirement and there just aren't the skilled people coming through and when they do start work they do it for a couple of months and disappear saying it's too hard. This is in S. Yorks/N Lincs/Notts. i think Rayner is living in some sort of parallel universe.

Yep.

Not enough skilled people building the numbers currently, let alone more. Also, not enough skilled people to supervise the less skilled people either.

Rayner is idiot. Or rather Starmer is an idiot for making her a minister.

The idiots are the ones who voted in government after government who didn't invest in skills training, who shored up the property market, who backed NIMBYs and who led an immigration environment and a hard Brexit that made skilled resource less inclined to want to work in the UK. For the avoidance of doubt I am blaming all parties.

[aeropilot]

Collectingbrass said:

aeropilot said:

WyrleyD said:

Kwackersaki said:

From the property developers on here, have we actually got the resources and enough skilled personnel to build 300’000 new houses per year, or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

No, my son-in-law has had a terrible time in the last couple of years getting and keeping skilled trades/time served workers. His very best blokes are coming up to retirement and there just aren't the skilled people coming through and when they do start work they do it for a couple of months and disappear saying it's too hard. This is in S. Yorks/N Lincs/Notts. i think Rayner is living in some sort of parallel universe.

Yep.

Not enough skilled people building the numbers currently, let alone more. Also, not enough skilled people to supervise the less skilled people either.

Rayner is idiot. Or rather Starmer is an idiot for making her a minister.

The idiots are the ones who voted in government after government who didn't invest in skills training, who shored up the property market, who backed NIMBYs and who led an immigration environment and a hard Brexit that made skilled resource less inclined to want to work in the UK. For the avoidance of doubt I am blaming all parties.

To be fair, it's not entirely the fault of the any Govt., as margins in construction slumped hugely by the early 90's from its traditional point (which largely paid for a lot of company training schemes) and the then all established large contractors started shutting down their training centres, and moved to the employ sub-contractors method rather than direct labour. That was all fine for the subsequent couple of decades while that large well trained workforce was around. I remember people in the industry making warnings that shutting down all the training scheme's would come to bite them on the arse in 20+ years time, but the city bean counters don't care about 20 years time, only 2 years time citing "the days of 10-14% margins are gone, we're lucky if we can get 2-3%, so we can't afford them".
20 years later and we were able to import those people from elsewhere in the world, so again, everything was OK for a while, but again, warnings were ignored about that short term sticking plaster.
It takes time and money to train people......and no one wants to pay for it anymore.

[Good Plan Ted]

From a relative who's involved in pricing cranes for sites in the SE, since January 30% of blocks were being mothballed on the basis of a November election. Mobile cranes numbers for housing estates are down 45% as sales slowed and footings being covered over.

This is sadly only the start, Landlords are selling up due to uncertainty with the housing laws, rent controls and EPC requirements, for instance it’s estimated that at least 18 million homes have a rating of an EPC D or below. This takes into account both homes that have an EPC, and those that have never had one because they haven't been sold or rented out since EPCs were introduced. It equates to over half (55%) of all UK housing stock.Now Labour being pressured by Shelter are going to reintroduce laws to say that any property below C after 2030 cannot be rented, so your going to have half of the current tenant’s trying to keep warm in a tent/motorhome/cave.It’s estimated it will take 50 years to update those properties as we literally haven’t got the manpower (remember the 1.5 million new homes as well) or owners the money for the transformation.It’s not really possible to get an EPC better than D on an existing property (say pre 2000) with internal insulation as the surveyor(?) cannot see what work has been done so rates it D. If the whole house is gutted and rebuilt to a spec then an improved EPC rating is possible.

Rayners/Labour big stick approach will not work.

[simon_harris]

I am sure the usual labour approach of fining people for not meeting unrealistic targets will solve the problem.

[phil4]

Building houses faster is going to be an interesting challenge. Round our way a small town, there's been two huge housing developments for the past 10 years. Even if they could get the manpower and supplies, they wouldn't build them all out straight away because they need to drip feed the market to keep the prices up.

So you have a residents doing the NIMBY thing, developers not wanting to build too quickly, and a lack of skills. It's not going to work out as they hoped.

[crankedup5]

Collectingbrass said:

aeropilot said:

WyrleyD said:

Kwackersaki said:

From the property developers on here, have we actually got the resources and enough skilled personnel to build 300’000 new houses per year, or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

No, my son-in-law has had a terrible time in the last couple of years getting and keeping skilled trades/time served workers. His very best blokes are coming up to retirement and there just aren't the skilled people coming through and when they do start work they do it for a couple of months and disappear saying it's too hard. This is in S. Yorks/N Lincs/Notts. i think Rayner is living in some sort of parallel universe.

Yep.

Not enough skilled people building the numbers currently, let alone more. Also, not enough skilled people to supervise the less skilled people either.

Rayner is idiot. Or rather Starmer is an idiot for making her a minister.

The idiots are the ones who voted in government after government who didn't invest in skills training, who shored up the property market, who backed NIMBYs and who led an immigration environment and a hard Brexit that made skilled resource less inclined to want to work in the UK. For the avoidance of doubt I am blaming all parties.

I recall the mantra from Blair Government, pushing young people into Uni degrees and trade apprenticeships deliberately verbally downgraded to a somehow less intelligent option. Oldies like me were shouting out at the time that this was a terrible mistake and would lead to where we are now as a Country regarding our skills base.

[aeropilot]

Kwackersaki said:

or are we going to end up with a load of shoddily built crap chucked up on a shoestring?

The Iron Triangle.

[nikaiyo2]

It seems like a simple solution to a very complex problem... I wonder why :P

I can see it driving daft developments in locations people dont want. The conversion of offices on industrial estates the building of masses and masses of identical studio flats. When landlords were able to make a profit they would have bought them, I am not sure who will now, first time buyers wont, downsizers wont.

[119]

fking deluded.

That’s all there is to it.