Coal miners. Welsh ones. Were they well paid?
Discussion
I had to go to Wales today "The valleys" still lots of mining stuff around and not much else.
I was born mid 60's so had a vague awareness of the troubles and conflict in the 70's.
Was it a well paid job or was it simply that there was nothing else to do in Wales so they tried to protect the job at all costs?
Also was it a "Good" job. I know there was decent cameraderie and all pulling together but were the employment terms good relative to other industries?
Thanks. Just a random post really.
I was born mid 60's so had a vague awareness of the troubles and conflict in the 70's.
Was it a well paid job or was it simply that there was nothing else to do in Wales so they tried to protect the job at all costs?
Also was it a "Good" job. I know there was decent cameraderie and all pulling together but were the employment terms good relative to other industries?
Thanks. Just a random post really.
Truly men from a different time and a different world. It was VERY well paid compared to the other limited employment options available. But it was also very hard and dangerous work; pensions were basically irrelevant for most. Watch this excellent C4 documentary series if you’re interested:
Edited by WindyCommon on Thursday 23 May 21:30
Thankyou4calling said:
I had to go to Wales today "The valleys" still lots of mining stuff around and not much else.
I was born mid 60's so had a vague awareness of the troubles and conflict in the 70's.
Was it a well paid job or was it simply that there was nothing else to do in Wales so they tried to protect the job at all costs?
Also was it a "Good" job. I know there was decent cameraderie and all pulling together but were the employment terms good relative to other industries?
Thanks. Just a random post really.
It wasn't a particularly well paid job when you consider if was life-limiting at best, deadly at worse, and you'd probably finish with at least one part of your body missing, if not more.I was born mid 60's so had a vague awareness of the troubles and conflict in the 70's.
Was it a well paid job or was it simply that there was nothing else to do in Wales so they tried to protect the job at all costs?
Also was it a "Good" job. I know there was decent cameraderie and all pulling together but were the employment terms good relative to other industries?
Thanks. Just a random post really.
Coal seams were rarely more than a meter high. 9.5 hr days labour, alternating Saturdays, and later on you were lucky the mines had good wash houses.
They weren't well paid, only that they were better paid than the less risky and less skilled jobs in that immediate area. Far better money could be made by anyone that finished their schooling and left the mining towns.
in the Yorkshire coal fields there were various perks on top of wages that I assume Welsh miners had too: many of the costs of living were subsidised like free coal, free school uniforms, free school meals, shoe allowance, subsidised social club booze and fags, subsidised rent, generous pensions, cheap loans and mortgage deals, free bus travel and such like... Added up it was quite a good package.
Huff said:
..Contemporary with that - my late Uncle was a Trawlerman, out of Hull; became youngest Skipper in the Cod War, with J Marr & Sons.
And yes, goddamn - wonder why fish was, is expensive? - the saying was, remains: 'it's not fish you're buying - it's Men's lives'
No less true for coal.
And yes, goddamn - wonder why fish was, is expensive? - the saying was, remains: 'it's not fish you're buying - it's Men's lives'
No less true for coal.
I watched this documentary on BBC 4 a few years ago, scary stuff and very impressive campaigning.
My nan on my mother’s side was from The Valleys.
1920s and 30s
Some of the stories!
You think the Temperance Movement was all fuddy-duddy killjoys? The alcoholism was rife. She remembered well helping her mum varnish her dad’s coffin - dead from alcohol at young age.
Men would get paid on a Friday, give their wive’s some money (not enough for the coming week) then drink it all away that night. Rampant domestic abuse, just seen as the norm.
The cold.. she was given some kittens but they froze to death.
Her dad in a tin bath in the living room but never getting free of the coal dust.
One other memorable story has the ending ‘when they found him in the morning that rats had already started to eat his face..’
1920s and 30s
Some of the stories!
You think the Temperance Movement was all fuddy-duddy killjoys? The alcoholism was rife. She remembered well helping her mum varnish her dad’s coffin - dead from alcohol at young age.
Men would get paid on a Friday, give their wive’s some money (not enough for the coming week) then drink it all away that night. Rampant domestic abuse, just seen as the norm.
The cold.. she was given some kittens but they froze to death.
Her dad in a tin bath in the living room but never getting free of the coal dust.
One other memorable story has the ending ‘when they found him in the morning that rats had already started to eat his face..’
RedAndy said:
in the Yorkshire coal fields there were various perks on top of wages that I assume Welsh miners had too: many of the costs of living were subsidised like free coal, free school uniforms, free school meals, shoe allowance, subsidised social club booze and fags, subsidised rent, generous pensions, cheap loans and mortgage deals, free bus travel and such like... Added up it was quite a good package.
Do you think if you said to an offshore oil worker that they'd be paid bang average money (£35k), but they'd get their gas bill paid, their children's school uniform, a bus pass and loan deals, they'd call it a good package? I'm not sure they would.Evanivitch said:
RedAndy said:
in the Yorkshire coal fields there were various perks on top of wages that I assume Welsh miners had too: many of the costs of living were subsidised like free coal, free school uniforms, free school meals, shoe allowance, subsidised social club booze and fags, subsidised rent, generous pensions, cheap loans and mortgage deals, free bus travel and such like... Added up it was quite a good package.
Do you think if you said to an offshore oil worker that they'd be paid bang average money (£35k), but they'd get their gas bill paid, their children's school uniform, a bus pass and loan deals, they'd call it a good package? I'm not sure they would.Trivia - Even today, there's a (small) number of ex Coal Board workers and widows who receive free coal, https://www.gov.uk/national-concessionary-fuel-sch... Imagine being able to heat your house for free over the last 12 months or so.
shtu said:
Maybe comparing eras there, rahter than jobs. By the standards of the time and area, they were better-paid than most. A tough job, but so were eg steelworkers. The UK doesn't have much of that sort of dangerous manual labour anymore.
They were better paid than farm workers, and the work obviously wasn't seasonal. Factory workers typically had better pay and conditions, but those jobs weren't generally located in the valleys town, and were largely female dominated (women being paid less).Coal mining was seen as a skilled labour job, but also an incredibly dangerous one. Again, given you would be struggling to mine beyond your 40s (20 years underground qualified for pension) and would probably have a work related disease and injury by that point.
shtu said:
Trivia - Even today, there's a (small) number of ex Coal Board workers and widows who receive free coal, https://www.gov.uk/national-concessionary-fuel-sch... Imagine being able to heat your house for free over the last 12 months or so.
I'm sure they really enjoy lumping and shovelling coal onto the fire in their old age.Such a luxury, being able to heat rooms with fires for free. But not the rest of the house, or hot water, both of which will be central heating like everyone else, or cooking.
In reality I doubt many take up the free coal. I know my father in law has had central heating and no coal fire for 40ish years. Not sure what he would do with free his free coal if he chose to get it delivered.
The cash amount is £600, and seems to only be for people who didn’t stop getting the coal before the cash alternative was introduced. Hardly a princely sum.
Having said that, it was reasonably well paid compared to the cost of living at the time, especially with overtime. My father in law paid off his mortgage on a 3 bed detached, on a new estate, on just his income, with two children, within 10 years. He was a fitter rather than a miner, so slightly more skilled and better paid, but still… I’d say train drivers are the equivalent today, although he did have to retire on ill health due to PTSD that still haunts him today, so he paid a heavy price.
In reality I doubt many take up the free coal. I know my father in law has had central heating and no coal fire for 40ish years. Not sure what he would do with free his free coal if he chose to get it delivered.
The cash amount is £600, and seems to only be for people who didn’t stop getting the coal before the cash alternative was introduced. Hardly a princely sum.
Having said that, it was reasonably well paid compared to the cost of living at the time, especially with overtime. My father in law paid off his mortgage on a 3 bed detached, on a new estate, on just his income, with two children, within 10 years. He was a fitter rather than a miner, so slightly more skilled and better paid, but still… I’d say train drivers are the equivalent today, although he did have to retire on ill health due to PTSD that still haunts him today, so he paid a heavy price.
Edited by Electro1980 on Friday 24th May 10:15
As others have said, coalminers were generally well paid by comparison with what other jobs were available in the same regions. Often not many other jobs around esp if you were in S Wales or the rural parts of the Yorks and NE coalfields.
But compared to the later (last?) generation of high risk jobs, like oil rig workers, they were not well paid, and the job was prob more dangerous given the high incidence of lung disease.
A rig worker might be as likely to lose a finger as a miner but I don't think they were anything like as much at rsk of chronic work-related disease.
But compared to the later (last?) generation of high risk jobs, like oil rig workers, they were not well paid, and the job was prob more dangerous given the high incidence of lung disease.
A rig worker might be as likely to lose a finger as a miner but I don't think they were anything like as much at rsk of chronic work-related disease.
Electro1980 said:
Having said that, it was reasonably well paid compared to the cost of living at the time, especially with overtime. My father in law paid off his mortgage on a 3 bed detached, on a new estate, on just his income, with two children, within 10 years. He was a fitter rather than a miner, so slightly more skilled and better paid, but still… ]
So, wasn't a below ground miner then... 
Electro1980 said:
….
Having said that, it was reasonably well paid compared to the cost of living at the time, especially with overtime. My father in law paid off his mortgage on a 3 bed detached, on a new estate, on just his income, with two children, within 10 years. He was a fitter rather than a miner, so slightly more skilled and better paid, but still… I’d say train drivers are the equivalent today, although he did have to retire on ill health due to PTSD that still haunts him today, so he paid a heavy price.
Not sure there are many parallels with modern day train driving; were miners earning the equivalent of c.£60k basic back in the day? The entry path into those jobs are also worlds apart; people queue up in their thousands to be train drivers, undertake a pretty intense assessment process and spend 18 months becoming qualified. Mining was almost a dead cert from the moment you were born for a lot of blokes, it was the reason their towns existed and there was precious little else. Not the same picture!Having said that, it was reasonably well paid compared to the cost of living at the time, especially with overtime. My father in law paid off his mortgage on a 3 bed detached, on a new estate, on just his income, with two children, within 10 years. He was a fitter rather than a miner, so slightly more skilled and better paid, but still… I’d say train drivers are the equivalent today, although he did have to retire on ill health due to PTSD that still haunts him today, so he paid a heavy price.
Edited by Electro1980 on Friday 24th May 10:15
Mrs Loto comes from Mansfield and when we were 'courting' (christ there's an old fashioned expression!) you could always spot the miners in the pubs on a Friday night as they were dressed like models, Armani suits and golf GTI's (kid you not). I guess some of that was escapism from what they had to do during the week but as I recall it they made damn good money by the standards of the day - that's not to say they did not deserve it of course.
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