Discussion
How on earth did this character get entry to the Police force?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/02/29/sarah-...
https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/couzens-sarah-everards-...
It is unbelievable. The police are the people you tell your children to find if they are ever in trouble.
It is unbelievable. The police are the people you tell your children to find if they are ever in trouble.
Part of the problem is probably the lack of quality to choose from. In the 80s, there were lots of people turned down because of the choice. When I joined in 1975, on my intake there was on bloke with pre-cons for robbery and a stabbing when he was in Germany - ex forces - and another who stole from vagrants. That might sound a bit weird but he used to take half their money on pay day. Out of the 8 of us, only one remained after 10 years.
One trend that comes with the stop/start recruitment is sudden demand for a number of recruits to fill places. Recipe for error.
The Met used to have low standards, then they raised the bar, but it had to be dropped again. There used to be a certain dependence on ex-forces but that's dropped away.
One trend that comes with the stop/start recruitment is sudden demand for a number of recruits to fill places. Recipe for error.
The Met used to have low standards, then they raised the bar, but it had to be dropped again. There used to be a certain dependence on ex-forces but that's dropped away.
Biggy Stardust said:
pocketspring said:
How many more are out there?
The rest are as pure as the driven snow. Derek & others have pointed out on many occasions that the bad old days of corruption & bad practice no longer exist. It's all good.309k staff were vetted and 9, 5 staff and 4 serving officers were found to have concerns/failed the vetting
But of course ONE like Cousins is ONE too many
No one would ever dispute that
Derek Smith said:
Part of the problem is probably the lack of quality to choose from. In the 80s, there were lots of people turned down because of the choice. When I joined in 1975, on my intake there was on bloke with pre-cons for robbery and a stabbing when he was in Germany - ex forces - and another who stole from vagrants. That might sound a bit weird but he used to take half their money on pay day. Out of the 8 of us, only one remained after 10 years.
One trend that comes with the stop/start recruitment is sudden demand for a number of recruits to fill places. Recipe for error.
The Met used to have low standards, then they raised the bar, but it had to be dropped again. There used to be a certain dependence on ex-forces but that's dropped away.
Perish the thought offering more money/better conditions might help.One trend that comes with the stop/start recruitment is sudden demand for a number of recruits to fill places. Recipe for error.
The Met used to have low standards, then they raised the bar, but it had to be dropped again. There used to be a certain dependence on ex-forces but that's dropped away.
Biggy Stardust said:
hidetheelephants said:
Perish the thought offering more money/better conditions might help.
I'll bite- how exactly would offering better pay & conditions have prevented Mr Couzens from being the chap that he was?Could it be, that In order to maintain minimum staffing levels, substandard or questionable entrants have had to be accepted?
With better pay and conditions, you would attract better candidates, and a bigger pool to choose from.
Terzo123 said:
Its no secret that pay and conditions have been eroded for many years.
Could it be, that In order to maintain minimum staffing levels, substandard or questionable entrants have had to be accepted?
With better pay and conditions, you would attract better candidates, and a bigger pool to choose from.
How exactly would offering better pay & conditions have prevented Mr Couzens from being the chap that he was?Could it be, that In order to maintain minimum staffing levels, substandard or questionable entrants have had to be accepted?
With better pay and conditions, you would attract better candidates, and a bigger pool to choose from.
All this is just terrible but I am interested on reading the report that he made almost no effort to avoid detection.
Hire car in his own name, CCTV, ANPR, phone was tracked, body not ‘properly’ disposed of left on land next to a plot he owned.
Did he not care? Wanted to get caught? Have no clue as to detection methods? Arrogance, as he had got away with loads more? In such a manic state it just didn’t register?
Hardly any planning at all, totally amateur.
You’d have though a police officer might have a better chance than average with getting away with a murder.
UK police do have a good murder detection rate. As we know - pretty crap on other crimes, such as burglary.
He must have known the resources that would thrown at the abduction of a young woman.
Hire car in his own name, CCTV, ANPR, phone was tracked, body not ‘properly’ disposed of left on land next to a plot he owned.
Did he not care? Wanted to get caught? Have no clue as to detection methods? Arrogance, as he had got away with loads more? In such a manic state it just didn’t register?
Hardly any planning at all, totally amateur.
You’d have though a police officer might have a better chance than average with getting away with a murder.
UK police do have a good murder detection rate. As we know - pretty crap on other crimes, such as burglary.
He must have known the resources that would thrown at the abduction of a young woman.
Earthdweller said:
Biggy Stardust said:
pocketspring said:
How many more are out there?
The rest are as pure as the driven snow. Derek & others have pointed out on many occasions that the bad old days of corruption & bad practice no longer exist. It's all good.309k staff were vetted and 9, 5 staff and 4 serving officers were found to have concerns/failed the vetting
But of course ONE like Cousins is ONE too many
No one would ever dispute that
That does seem incredibly low.
Statistically speaking there has to be more crooks/perverts/a murderer/crazy political views or whatever you like in in such a large number.
Those police WhatsApp groups they have found on a number of occasions sharing photos of dead bodies etc…they contained multiple officers.
smifffymoto said:
Biggy Stardust said:
"Institutional errors"
"Systemic failings"
"lessons have been/will be learned"
"No individual fault"
"Big organisation, inevitable that something can go wrong once in a while"
You have missed the most common one,"Systemic failings"
"lessons have been/will be learned"
"No individual fault"
"Big organisation, inevitable that something can go wrong once in a while"
LESSONS WILL BE LEARNED.
Biggy Stardust said:
hidetheelephants said:
Perish the thought offering more money/better conditions might help.
I'll bite- how exactly would offering better pay & conditions have prevented Mr Couzens from being the chap that he was?The only logic I can think of is that better pay and conditions would have caused such a large cohort of upright citizens applying for the police that they could have overlooked more dubious application from people like couzens with prior history. And the dearth of candidates made the police say, "oh well if that's the best we'll get we'll just have to take him anyway"..
But that's a poor argument - he was accepted given the prevailing standards at the time, with nothing to suggest he was a "that'll have to do" candidate.
So to me there is no basis to believe better pay and conditions would have prevented couzens applying for and getting a police job.
Yes, better pay might help future recruitment: especially from different communities (which is a long standing issue of recruitment)
But it is entirely separate to the rigour applied to vetting the candidates that do apply.
In my view, there can only be two reasons why he got the job
- no one checked properly
- he was checked but the cops didn't think the funds were a problem
This is basic stuff.
As numerous posters have already said, the lessons need learning. I'm not sure the police are very good at learning lessons when it comes to their own behaviour though.
Senior bods talk the talk, but the rank and file seem to have a wide streak of covering for each other and ignoring poor behaviour.
It must be hard though, given the nature of work and how much their safety depends on relying on each other
You can't change culture with a power point slideshow.
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