Net migration to push UK population to 74m by 2036
Discussion
I find this an interesting topic and will admit that I happened to stumble across a Nigel Farage video released yesterday discussing exactly this.
I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
fat80b said:
I find this an interesting topic and will admit that I happened to stumble across a Nigel Farage video released yesterday discussing exactly this.
I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
You're wasting your voice.I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
Too many here are of an ideology which are triggered by such thoughts and WILL just respond "racist".
It's genuinely ruining the country.
Problem is capitalists control immigration and they profit from it, whilst not suffering the consequences.
fat80b said:
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
After Brexit, we are gladly accepting hundreds of thousands of people each year from India, to work and study here, and they bring their families too. The family bit is being repealed, but with the current free trade agreement with India, they have asked for more visas, and it looks like we'll have to give into that if we want to do more business with India.And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/uk-india-fta...
What grown up discussion are you suggesting we have?
gt_12345 said:
You're wasting your voice.
Too many here are of an ideology which are triggered by such thoughts and WILL just respond "racist".
It's genuinely ruining the country.
Problem is capitalists control immigration and they profit from it, whilst not suffering the consequences.
I voted to remain in the Brexit vote. Even I could see quite plainly that replacing "European looking" people from Europe with people from the rest of the world would make the demographic make up of the UK even more different that it was/is already.Too many here are of an ideology which are triggered by such thoughts and WILL just respond "racist".
It's genuinely ruining the country.
Problem is capitalists control immigration and they profit from it, whilst not suffering the consequences.
s1962a said:
fat80b said:
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
After Brexit, we are gladly accepting hundreds of thousands of people each year from India, to work and study here, and they bring their families too. The family bit is being repealed, but with the current free trade agreement with India, they have asked for more visas, and it looks like we'll have to give into that if we want to do more business with India.And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/other/uk-india-fta...
What grown up discussion are you suggesting we have?
Tell India to f
k off. Oh wait, the capitalists won't get their money.fat80b said:
I find this an interesting topic and will admit that I happened to stumble across a Nigel Farage video released yesterday discussing exactly this.
I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
You could Incentivise having children and working like not cut child benefit etc. If the problem is we don't make enough babies then that's an easy fix right. But the reason birth rates have fallen in the West is cost of living. I recall a documentary about this. In the 1950s a father in America could work and support a hoke and 4 kids, today both parents need to work full time just to support 2. So loom at that and then decide on policyI think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
Gecko1978 said:
fat80b said:
I find this an interesting topic and will admit that I happened to stumble across a Nigel Farage video released yesterday discussing exactly this.
I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
You could Incentivise having children and working like not cut child benefit etc. If the problem is we don't make enough babies then that's an easy fix right. But the reason birth rates have fallen in the West is cost of living. I recall a documentary about this. In the 1950s a father in America could work and support a hoke and 4 kids, today both parents need to work full time just to support 2. So loom at that and then decide on policyI think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
Right wing capitalists make money from immigration. That's why it's pushed.
And Marxists love it because it's less British people here as a %.
Edited by gt_12345 on Wednesday 31st January 15:20
gt_12345 said:
Did this literally start with Sunak?
Tell India to fk off. Oh wait, the capitalists won't get their money.
Who are these capitalist who won't get their money. Tell India to f
k off. Oh wait, the capitalists won't get their money.Do you not want Care workers, nurses, doctors and in the private sector expertise being brought into the UK. My fellow partners came from all over the globe. They all brought something slightly different.
You also may want to check out the UKs birth rate which will not sustain the current ageing population.
Are you going to become one of those care workers?
BTW the UK is generally fine despite this current government. Of course anyone is free to leave if it doesn't suit.
Gecko1978 said:
fat80b said:
I find this an interesting topic and will admit that I happened to stumble across a Nigel Farage video released yesterday discussing exactly this.
I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
You could Incentivise having children and working like not cut child benefit etc. If the problem is we don't make enough babies then that's an easy fix right. But the reason birth rates have fallen in the West is cost of living. I recall a documentary about this. In the 1950s a father in America could work and support a hoke and 4 kids, today both parents need to work full time just to support 2. So loom at that and then decide on policyI think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
Its definitely worth looking at population growth in context globally before drawing conclusions. For instance since 1950 UK has gone from roughly 50m to 70m (40% up), the USA from 200m to 330m (65% up) or even globally from 2.5bn to 8bn (lots more!). Some interesting stats show a big boost in birthrates between 2002 and 2015 before dropping back again in the UK which will have a multiplying effect (kids have kids). And obviously people are living longer than ever, without the impact of world wars to wipe millions out (well not yet anyway). Immigration causes population growth of course it does, but looking at context and looking at all the variables of what causes population growth gives you the correct view rather than just pointing fingers in one single direction.
Just my tuppence worth.
Just my tuppence worth.
Nomme de Plum said:
gt_12345 said:
Did this literally start with Sunak?
Tell India to fk off. Oh wait, the capitalists won't get their money.
Who are these capitalist who won't get their money. Tell India to f
k off. Oh wait, the capitalists won't get their money.Do you not want Care workers, nurses, doctors and in the private sector expertise being brought into the UK. My fellow partners came from all over the globe. They all brought something slightly different.
You also may want to check out the UKs birth rate which will not sustain the current ageing population.
Are you going to become one of those care workers?
BTW the UK is generally fine despite this current government. Of course anyone is free to leave if it doesn't suit.
Anyone profiting from property
CBI
Anyone who pays wages
Children argument is false. They would still want migration even if birth rate was fine. It's a cash machine to them.
RE jobs: we have unemployed. Make them do certain jobs. Not care workers but less patient-focussed work. We don't need to import people to stack shelves in Asda.
Gecko1978 said:
You could Incentivise having children and working like not cut child benefit etc. If the problem is we don't make enough babies then that's an easy fix right. But the reason birth rates have fallen in the West is cost of living. I recall a documentary about this. In the 1950s a father in America could work and support a hoke and 4 kids, today both parents need to work full time just to support 2. So loom at that and then decide on policy
That is not completely correct. There are other more important factors. The USA is not the sole country to be used as data set and in the 50s women had much less say than 20 years later. People were actually relatively wealthier but had less children so your argument is flawed.
The reason the birth rate has fallen is very simple. As previously 3rd world economies develop and gain wealth women become educated and emancipated and of course birth control.
The evidence for this is very clear. Check Hans Rosling if you wish to read further.
gt_12345 said:
Who are these capitalists?
Anyone profiting from property
CBI
Anyone who pays wages
Children argument is false. They would still want migration even if birth rate was fine. It's a cash machine to them.
RE jobs: we have unemployed. Make them do certain jobs. Not care workers but less patient-focussed work. We don't need to import people to stack shelves in Asda.
I think that is up there with one of the most unpleasant posts I have seen on PH.Anyone profiting from property
CBI
Anyone who pays wages
Children argument is false. They would still want migration even if birth rate was fine. It's a cash machine to them.
RE jobs: we have unemployed. Make them do certain jobs. Not care workers but less patient-focussed work. We don't need to import people to stack shelves in Asda.
BTW Hospitals have patients not care homes or people in their own home that need assistance.
Do you intend forced movement of unemployed people around the UK.
crankedup5 said:
Gecko1978 said:
fat80b said:
I find this an interesting topic and will admit that I happened to stumble across a Nigel Farage video released yesterday discussing exactly this.
I think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
You could Incentivise having children and working like not cut child benefit etc. If the problem is we don't make enough babies then that's an easy fix right. But the reason birth rates have fallen in the West is cost of living. I recall a documentary about this. In the 1950s a father in America could work and support a hoke and 4 kids, today both parents need to work full time just to support 2. So loom at that and then decide on policyI think he said that there has been a net increase (ONS data) of 10M people since Tony Blair became PM which if you think about it is quite a percentage increase since 1997.
I suspect that one of the problems that is looming is that we really need to have a bit of a grown up discussion in this country about how many people we are willing to accept in to live in the UK in 20-30 years' time.
And part of that will mean having some fairly uncomfortable discussions about where they come from.
In that it is all well and good to say, I don't want any more people, but we also know that we do need more people as the population ages and we don't product enough babies of our own to work the jobs that we can't fill.
How the West solves this, I am not sure, but we somehow need to have the discussion without it ending up all a bit brexity / racist.......
This is what immigration is about. Housebuilders and companies profiting.
Edited by gt_12345 on Wednesday 31st January 15:50
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