US Nitrogen execution?
Discussion
Looks like this is going ahead,
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Plus, in the past we had all sorts of grisly methods, some of which were particularly spiteful and drawn out, but others, that don't seem to be used any more aren't used yet seem to be more humane and instant, firing squad for example ? Even the guillotine, macabre as it was, it was at least pretty effective and quick.
The Electric chair seems the most horrendous modern version and is still an option in some states, last used in 2020. Does make me wonder if its horrific as is made out, or is our understanding from the film "The Green Mile" ?
I am generally against the death penalty but the methods, pros and cons are interesting.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Plus, in the past we had all sorts of grisly methods, some of which were particularly spiteful and drawn out, but others, that don't seem to be used any more aren't used yet seem to be more humane and instant, firing squad for example ? Even the guillotine, macabre as it was, it was at least pretty effective and quick.
The Electric chair seems the most horrendous modern version and is still an option in some states, last used in 2020. Does make me wonder if its horrific as is made out, or is our understanding from the film "The Green Mile" ?
I am generally against the death penalty but the methods, pros and cons are interesting.
J4CKO said:
Looks like this is going ahead,
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Plus, in the past we had all sorts of grisly methods, some of which were particularly spiteful and drawn out, but others, that don't seem to be used any more aren't used yet seem to be more humane and instant, firing squad for example ? Even the guillotine, macabre as it was, it was at least pretty effective and quick.
The Electric chair seems the most horrendous modern version and is still an option in some states, last used in 2020. Does make me wonder if its horrific as is made out, or is our understanding from the film "The Green Mile" ?
I am generally against the death penalty but the methods, pros and cons are interesting.
My opinion of it is, a lot of Yanks especially don't really want to kill people humanely. Like you say, the Guillotine as gory as it is, could be made instant and 100% effective, but it's messy and honestly, I think a lot of them want to see them suffer. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Plus, in the past we had all sorts of grisly methods, some of which were particularly spiteful and drawn out, but others, that don't seem to be used any more aren't used yet seem to be more humane and instant, firing squad for example ? Even the guillotine, macabre as it was, it was at least pretty effective and quick.
The Electric chair seems the most horrendous modern version and is still an option in some states, last used in 2020. Does make me wonder if its horrific as is made out, or is our understanding from the film "The Green Mile" ?
I am generally against the death penalty but the methods, pros and cons are interesting.
I've also wondered about assisted suicide, they drink a tasteless colourless liquid in some water, fall asleep peacefully and die. It's a nasty business forcing someone to drink something, but a feeding peg, or an IV version must be better than however they're botching it at the moment.
"if its horrific as is made out," Yes, every bit as bad as you can imagine, even a perfect execution by electric chair is brutal, painful and longer than it should be. They often don't die with a single charge and it can go on for a long time. It would be kinder and faster for the executioner to shoot them in the head, but that's 'inhumane' because it's messy.
J4CKO said:
Looks like this is going ahead,
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Not sure where you get the tolerating a bit of temporary hell from, there are a couple of different methods for self euthanasia, one is an injection and the other a cocktail of drugs taken orally usually with fruit juice, what they both have in common is a fact acting anaesthetic/relaxant and then the one that slows and stops the heart, supposed to be very peaceful.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Like you I'm against the death penalty apart from where there is direct proof of a hideous act resulting in death of somebody else, I don't see another method needs to be used when a peaceful method exists.
Death penalty in the US seems to lie at the intersection of their piety, squeamishness and cruelty.
The imperative seems to be to find a method which is 'humane' but also distances the executioners from the barbarity of the process. So no shooting or 'long drop' hanging.The obvious option would be a Dignitas type cocktail. Problem is firstly a prisoner may not cooperate with swallowing; many have been IV drug users and don't have veins that are easy to find and importantly that drug companies now refusing to supply medication. Hence the states where its used scratching around for methods.
Theoretically a nitrogen chamber could be humane. If I was in a Dignitas situation it might appeal. Submersion in nitrogen foam has been developed for humane euthanasia of pigs
What they are trying to do here is administer 100% nitrogen through a mask. This sounds problematic to me if the guy struggles or vomits and they can't get a good seal on the mask I suspect he'll suffocate slowly.
They had the prisoners pastor on R4 this lunchtime who was expressing the concern that nitrogen might leak from the mask and poison the bystanders
The imperative seems to be to find a method which is 'humane' but also distances the executioners from the barbarity of the process. So no shooting or 'long drop' hanging.The obvious option would be a Dignitas type cocktail. Problem is firstly a prisoner may not cooperate with swallowing; many have been IV drug users and don't have veins that are easy to find and importantly that drug companies now refusing to supply medication. Hence the states where its used scratching around for methods.
Theoretically a nitrogen chamber could be humane. If I was in a Dignitas situation it might appeal. Submersion in nitrogen foam has been developed for humane euthanasia of pigs
What they are trying to do here is administer 100% nitrogen through a mask. This sounds problematic to me if the guy struggles or vomits and they can't get a good seal on the mask I suspect he'll suffocate slowly.
They had the prisoners pastor on R4 this lunchtime who was expressing the concern that nitrogen might leak from the mask and poison the bystanders
oddman said:
They had the prisoners pastor on R4 this lunchtime who was expressing the concern that nitrogen might leak from the mask and poison the bystanders
Indeed. Thus sayeth the pastor while breathing a gas containing almost 80% nitrogen, aka air. Presumably the pastor is allowed outdoors unaccompanied and can vote.sherbertdip said:
J4CKO said:
Looks like this is going ahead,
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Not sure where you get the tolerating a bit of temporary hell from, there are a couple of different methods for self euthanasia, one is an injection and the other a cocktail of drugs taken orally usually with fruit juice, what they both have in common is a fact acting anaesthetic/relaxant and then the one that slows and stops the heart, supposed to be very peaceful.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Like you I'm against the death penalty apart from where there is direct proof of a hideous act resulting in death of somebody else, I don't see another method needs to be used when a peaceful method exists.
My point was, are people afflicted with a terrible disease like MND more apt to put up with some temporary discomfort to achieve relief from it, as its at odds with the botching, surviving and general agro around lethal injections for executions in the US, why dont they just use whatever Dignitas use ?
Isn’t this a painless way to die, doesn’t it mimic oxygen in the lungs, so you have no idea you’re suffocating, and you actually get ‘high’ before dying?
I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
Legacywr said:
Isn’t this a painless way to die, doesn’t it mimic oxygen in the lungs, so you have no idea you’re suffocating, and you actually get ‘high’ before dying?
I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
Its not been used yet so nobody knows what his death will be like. The Yanks seem to try and find harder and harder ways to execute prisoners. Need to use good old English long drop hanging method - all over in seconds.I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
Bigends said:
Legacywr said:
Isn’t this a painless way to die, doesn’t it mimic oxygen in the lungs, so you have no idea you’re suffocating, and you actually get ‘high’ before dying?
I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
Its not been used yet so nobody knows what his death will be like. The Yanks seem to try and find harder and harder ways to execute prisoners. Need to use good old English long drop hanging method - all over in seconds.I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
P-Jay said:
My opinion of it is, a lot of Yanks especially don't really want to kill people humanely. Like you say, the Guillotine as gory as it is, could be made instant and 100% effective, but it's messy and honestly, I think a lot of them want to see them suffer.
I wouldn't be too sure about that.https://www.theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/...
P-Jay said:
J4CKO said:
Looks like this is going ahead,
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Plus, in the past we had all sorts of grisly methods, some of which were particularly spiteful and drawn out, but others, that don't seem to be used any more aren't used yet seem to be more humane and instant, firing squad for example ? Even the guillotine, macabre as it was, it was at least pretty effective and quick.
The Electric chair seems the most horrendous modern version and is still an option in some states, last used in 2020. Does make me wonder if its horrific as is made out, or is our understanding from the film "The Green Mile" ?
I am generally against the death penalty but the methods, pros and cons are interesting.
My opinion of it is, a lot of Yanks especially don't really want to kill people humanely. Like you say, the Guillotine as gory as it is, could be made instant and 100% effective, but it's messy and honestly, I think a lot of them want to see them suffer. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-6808927...
There is a lot of outcry about the method, which as replaced lethal injection but how does this fit in with assisted dying methods ? like Dignitas where folk seem to manage and dont hear as much about it ? Is that due to the difference between people who want to die and will tolerate a bit of temporary hell for permanent relief from whatever horrendous pain afflicts them ? Vs those who dont typically want to die ?
Plus, in the past we had all sorts of grisly methods, some of which were particularly spiteful and drawn out, but others, that don't seem to be used any more aren't used yet seem to be more humane and instant, firing squad for example ? Even the guillotine, macabre as it was, it was at least pretty effective and quick.
The Electric chair seems the most horrendous modern version and is still an option in some states, last used in 2020. Does make me wonder if its horrific as is made out, or is our understanding from the film "The Green Mile" ?
I am generally against the death penalty but the methods, pros and cons are interesting.
I've also wondered about assisted suicide, they drink a tasteless colourless liquid in some water, fall asleep peacefully and die. It's a nasty business forcing someone to drink something, but a feeding peg, or an IV version must be better than however they're botching it at the moment.
"if its horrific as is made out," Yes, every bit as bad as you can imagine, even a perfect execution by electric chair is brutal, painful and longer than it should be. They often don't die with a single charge and it can go on for a long time. It would be kinder and faster for the executioner to shoot them in the head, but that's 'inhumane' because it's messy.
Hard one, but a good excuse to post this interesting article:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Pierrepoint
He'd know what to do, not so much in later life however!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Pierrepoint
He'd know what to do, not so much in later life however!
Roofless Toothless said:
That's very interesting. Everydays a school day.MonkeyBusiness said:
Roofless Toothless said:
That's very interesting. Everydays a school day.dundarach said:
Hard one, but a good excuse to post this interesting article:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Pierrepoint
He'd know what to do, not so much in later life however!
Many years ago I was at home bored at 3am or so, thanks to my usual insomnia and I found myself watching a film about him with Timothy Spall.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Pierrepoint
He'd know what to do, not so much in later life however!
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0462477/
I've been morbidly interested in the subject ever since. I absolutely disagree with it with every fibre of my being, but I still find it fascinating.
I watched another film about some women being executed in Thailand (I think) they tied them to a post holding some flowers and shot them through a screen with an M60.
I can't dwell on it too much or it makes me depressed. Hideous business, there shouldn't be a place for it in a civilised world.
Legacywr said:
Bigends said:
Legacywr said:
Isn’t this a painless way to die, doesn’t it mimic oxygen in the lungs, so you have no idea you’re suffocating, and you actually get ‘high’ before dying?
I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
Its not been used yet so nobody knows what his death will be like. The Yanks seem to try and find harder and harder ways to execute prisoners. Need to use good old English long drop hanging method - all over in seconds.I remember seeing a program about the death penalty with Michael Portillo in it. In one segment he partially went through this process.
Or have I got that wrong?
CT05 Nose Cone said:
Bigends said:
Need to use good old English long drop hanging method - all over in seconds.
Only if it's done properly, plenty of examples where it was botched and the person slowly strangled to death.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff