Pregnant and Prison

[Gecko1978]

So sly news has a story about a call. It to jail pregnant women

https://news.sky.com/story/should-pregnant-women-b...

What do we all think. My view would be if your facing a custodial sentence being pregnant is a bit like being old or disabled and we still jail those people where there is a need.

Paige Blake was a women who worked at my kids nursery. During covid driving ar 80mph on the empty A414 she hit a cyclist and killed him. She was texting at the time.

Due to covid her trail and sentence was delayed by 12 months in that time knowing she faced a custodial sentence she got pregnant and was 8 months pregnant when she was sent to jail for 24 months.

This feels like it was the right thing to do. The prison service should help pregnant women but there is a limit to its ability but being pregnant should not be a get out of jail free card when jail is appropriate.

[dundarach]

Let's face it, she and her soon to be ADHD, autistic, anxiety ridden child have no place in society, other than to cause problems for the rest of us.

[ZedLeg]

dundarach said:

Let's face it, she and her soon to be ADHD, autistic, anxiety ridden child have no place in society, other than to cause problems for the rest of us.

And we wonder why some people in society feel like they've been left behind.

[anonymous-user]

Eeer, sounds like a responsible adult. Perhaps the pregnancy was in hopes of leniency? Sounds like a low rent Elizabeth Holmes.

I don't think it should effect the sentence at all.

[Biggy Stardust]

ZedLeg said:

And we wonder why some people in society feel like they've been left behind.

This woman is complaining that prison isn't fun, which is kinda the point, surely?

She then complains that she's not fed enough & in the next sentence moans about apparent weight gain.

I'm actually quite happy for people like that to get left behind as they have no intention of keeping up.

[ZedLeg]

We've been through how I feel about prison already.

My comment was more about the derisive use of ADHD, Autism, Anxiety ridden child. Kid's not even born yet and folk are writing them off.

[dundarach]

ZedLeg said:

We've been through how I feel about prison already.

My comment was more about the derisive use of ADHD, Autism, Anxiety ridden child. Kid's not even born yet and folk are writing them off.

You know I'm right.

[Don Roque]

Don't like the sound of prison whilst pregnant? Don't commit crime then, and you won't have to worry about going there. Not able to safely have a child? Don't become pregnant or continue a pregnancy in those circumstances then.

We often hear complaints from prisoners about how bad prison is but very rarely do they ever seem to realise that going to prison is elective and based entirely on choices you make.

[Terminator X]

ZedLeg said:

dundarach said:

Let's face it, she and her soon to be ADHD, autistic, anxiety ridden child have no place in society, other than to cause problems for the rest of us.

And we wonder why some people in society feel like they've been left behind.

You think we should help everyone at whatever cost?

TX.

[ZedLeg]

Terminator X said:

ZedLeg said:

dundarach said:

Let's face it, she and her soon to be ADHD, autistic, anxiety ridden child have no place in society, other than to cause problems for the rest of us.

And we wonder why some people in society feel like they've been left behind.

You think we should help everyone at whatever cost?

TX.

I think that saying an unborn child has no place in society due to it's parent's actions is fked up tbh.

[spaximus]

ZedLeg said:

dundarach said:

Let's face it, she and her soon to be ADHD, autistic, anxiety ridden child have no place in society, other than to cause problems for the rest of us.

And we wonder why some people in society feel like they've been left behind.

The point I suspect is this woman killed another person and is now complaining about her treatment. She is exactly the sort of person who will know every dodge and will be willing to use her child to feather her own nest, regardless of the harm it does to them.

Had she any remorse she would keep quite and think about how to turn her life around but the signs so far are not good on that one.

[dundarach]

ZedLeg said:

Terminator X said:

ZedLeg said:

dundarach said:

Let's face it, she and her soon to be ADHD, autistic, anxiety ridden child have no place in society, other than to cause problems for the rest of us.

And we wonder why some people in society feel like they've been left behind.

You think we should help everyone at whatever cost?

TX.

I think that saying an unborn child has no place in society due to it's parent's actions is fked up tbh.

Think I said 'other than to cause problems' which you still know I'm correct and know that they both will, for many, many years to come, god bless them!

[Biggy Stardust]

ZedLeg said:

My comment was more about the derisive use of ADHD, Autism, Anxiety ridden child. Kid's not even born yet and folk are writing them off.

Let's give it a few years. If the kid becomes a successful doctor/lawyer/engineer/teacher/whatever I promise you that I will hunt Dundarach down like a dog, drag him in front of you & demand the apology you would so richly deserve, using thumbscrews if necessary to enforce his compliance.

Somehow I doubt I'll need to.

[ZedLeg]

Why bother discussing it more, it's not a surprise to me that you lot have no consideration for people outside your bubble.

[bitchstewie]

Lovely thread.

PistonHeads at its finest once again.

[thewarlock]

Biggy Stardust said:

Let's give it a few years. If the kid becomes a successful doctor/lawyer/engineer/teacher/whatever I promise you that I will hunt Dundarach down like a dog, drag him in front of you & demand the apology you would so richly deserve, using thumbscrews if necessary to enforce his compliance.

Somehow I doubt I'll need to.

Why does someone need to be a lawyer or doctor etc to be worthy of life? Does the guy that empties your bins not deserve a smidgen of respect? Does he not contribute to the economy and to society?

Edited by thewarlock on Tuesday 24th October 10:53

[Ian Geary]

This thread literally portrays hope versus experience.

You can see the hopeful posters, wishing things were better.

You can see the posters with experience of how things are.

What is lacking is any analysis of how to get from the "experience" (which very much rings true to me) to the "hope".

- The woman that killed by texting/ speeding does not seem repentant,or that she wants to be a useful part of society.
- does anyone genuinely think she will be able to bring up a child that doesn't have the same (or less?) usefulness to society? Really?
- irrespective of the child spending the first few months of life behind bars (which the child will never know about of course, if it weren't for the fact the mum will harp on about it for her entire life as if it wasn't her killing someone that caused it)
- and to cap it , chaotic families like this often cost the tax payer substantial sums over and above standard public services that are provided.

So what's the solution?

- permits for children?
- forced adoption?
- tough love / back to the slums and workhouses?
- quadruple the amount of public money spent on education/SEN / family intervention, in the hope "no one is left behind" and these families actually produce the country more than they cost?
- just ignore it, and just hope this lady doesn't impact on your life


Like all the other problems in npe, if they were easy, they would have been sorted. Moaning about it is all we have...

[Biggy Stardust]

thewarlock said:

Why does someone need to be a lawyer or doctor etc to be worthy of life? Does the guy that empties your bins not deserve a smidgen of respect? Does he not contribute to the economy and to society?

You're absolutely right.

If the kid gets any worthwhile job & in any way contributes meaningfully to society then my promise will apply.

I still consider it unlikely.

[mwstewart]

Biggy Stardust said:

ZedLeg said:

My comment was more about the derisive use of ADHD, Autism, Anxiety ridden child. Kid's not even born yet and folk are writing them off.

Let's give it a few years. If the kid becomes a successful doctor/lawyer/engineer/teacher/whatever I promise you that I will hunt Dundarach down like a dog, drag him in front of you & demand the apology you would so richly deserve, using thumbscrews if necessary to enforce his compliance.

Somehow I doubt I'll need to.

Autism is a genetic disorder: the brain hasn't developed correctly. The rest is just common sense and the science backs it up.

"Lack of parental attention through parenting can increase dopamine and norepinephrine levels in children, which is one of the causes of hyperactivity and will increase the risk of ADHD in children"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC94388...

The association between parenting and the error-related negativity across childhood and adolescence
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC74793...

Negative adult influences and the protective effects of role models: A study with urban adolescents
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC27524...

In terms of the original subject: women can't have it both ways; are we for equal treatment or only the parts of it that yield a positive benefit (e.g. equal pay, return to work policies after pregnancy etc.)

[The Rotrex Kid]

dundarach said:

Let's face it, she and her soon to be ADHD, autistic, anxiety ridden child have no place in society, other than to cause problems for the rest of us.

Crikey, that's not very Christian of you.