UPS drivers in the US earn $170k a year

[s1962a]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66445496

Good on them for negotiating those salaries/benefits, but it got me thinking about the dollar vs the pound and the purchasing power a lot of professionals in the US have compared to us in the UK. If our unions were as militant as the ones for UPS in the states then I think we'd be in a whole heap of financial trouble.

I am sure taxes / living costs /inflation are comparable, and those kinds of salaries must afford a pretty comfortable lifestyle. How much more do US workers generally get paid than those in the UK? I know of one doctor who earns close to a $million in the states, and they'd probably be on £100k in the UK as a consultant.

I found these stats

Americans with full-time jobs who work 50 weeks or more in a year make $76,554 per year on average

The median annual earnings of full-time workers in the US amounted to $56,473 across all occupations and states.

[title should be in dollars not £]

Edited by s1962a on Wednesday 9th August 10:42

[Grumps.]

Its not £170k, it's £135k, up from approx £110k

[s1962a]

Yeah, i just noticed I put £ and not $

[Grumps.]

s1962a said:

Yeah, i just noticed I put £ and not $

Still a lot, though!?

[s1962a]

I googled how much UPS drivers make in the UK

How much does a Ups driver make in United Kingdom? The average ups driver salary in the United Kingdom is £24,500 per year or £12.56 per hour. Entry level positions start at £21,255 per year while most experienced workers make up to £27,554 per year.

Obviously we get free healthcare and some of the benefits they get in the UK are already provided by the state here.

[Rich Boy Spanner]

Salaries are much higher in the US generally than the UK. The US didn't do 10 years of austerity after the 2008 banking crisis unlike Europe. The EU economy back in 2008 was larger than that of the US, the current EU (plus UK) economy is now almost a quarter smaller than the US. The US economy has been growing fast and salaries have gone up with it. It can be expensive to visit there now and it isn't just down to exchange rates.

[valiant]

Total employee costs though?

It costs a hell of a lot more to employ someone than their salary and in the US you may have to include some sort of healthcare insurance.

Would be good to know what the ‘take home’ is rather than the headline figure.

[GroundEffect]

In the US wages are higher (but they have a higher GDP/capita so it's not surprising) but it's not so simple to say that they have a lower cost of living.

Food costs in the US are surprisingly high for decent quality products. And accommodation prices vary wildly across the country.

[Type R Tom]

There are a lot of extra costs in the US, I remember my BOL telling me the cost to get his rubbish taken away alone is more than my council tax.

Also have a look at the cost of mobile phone contracts and home internet.

[Gecko1978]

One thing in the US the goverment here will not tell you about is Tax deductions so employees in Calafronia can deduct cost of commuting to work and cost of health insurance from tax

[JagLover]

Rich Boy Spanner said:

Salaries are much higher in the US generally than the UK. The US didn't do 10 years of austerity after the 2008 banking crisis unlike Europe. The EU economy back in 2008 was larger than that of the US, the current EU (plus UK) economy is now almost a quarter smaller than the US. The US economy has been growing fast and salaries have gone up with it. It can be expensive to visit there now and it isn't just down to exchange rates.

Productivity is 25% higher in the USA than the UK, which means it is richer and can pay its workers more.

"Austerity" is more of a symptom of economic decline.

[Type R Tom]

JagLover said:

Rich Boy Spanner said:

Salaries are much higher in the US generally than the UK. The US didn't do 10 years of austerity after the 2008 banking crisis unlike Europe. The EU economy back in 2008 was larger than that of the US, the current EU (plus UK) economy is now almost a quarter smaller than the US. The US economy has been growing fast and salaries have gone up with it. It can be expensive to visit there now and it isn't just down to exchange rates.

Productivity is 25% higher in the USA than the UK, which means it is richer and can pay its workers more.

"Austerity" is more of a symptom of economic decline.

How much of that 25% is linked to things like little to no PTO, longer hours, sick benefits etc.? Just reading posts on places like Reddit, working in US sounds like absolute hell for many.

[TGCOTF-dewey]

JagLover said:

Productivity is 25% higher in the USA than the UK, which means it is richer and can pay its workers more.

"Austerity" is more of a symptom of economic decline.

I've never understood how they get that figure. I've worked with a few US tech and engineering companies and can't see where this productivity comes from... apart from possibly playing number tricks with contractors to suggest that fewer staff are doing more.

What's the expert view on why the disparity is so high?

[GroundEffect]

JagLover said:

Rich Boy Spanner said:

Salaries are much higher in the US generally than the UK. The US didn't do 10 years of austerity after the 2008 banking crisis unlike Europe. The EU economy back in 2008 was larger than that of the US, the current EU (plus UK) economy is now almost a quarter smaller than the US. The US economy has been growing fast and salaries have gone up with it. It can be expensive to visit there now and it isn't just down to exchange rates.

Productivity is 25% higher in the USA than the UK, which means it is richer and can pay its workers more.

"Austerity" is more of a symptom of economic decline.

Productivity comes from investment.

Yes, they certainly love their long hours in the US (my colleagues start at 6am in Houston, whereas I'm considered an early starter here at 8am) but in terms of output I'm not convinced they do any better. Germany and NL are ahead of the UK in my perception of work output vs hours put in.

[phil-sti]

GroundEffect said:

In the US wages are higher (but they have a higher GDP/capita so it's not surprising) but it's not so simple to say that they have a lower cost of living.

Food costs in the US are surprisingly high for decent quality products. And accommodation prices vary wildly across the country.

I was suprised by this when I visted the US, 12 pack of beer which is £8 here was $17 dollars so about £15, a punnet of grapes was $10 (£8) where as it's £2 here.

[phil-sti]

I wonder if the high average salaries are due to the lack of protections and holidays they have over there? also a big chunk is also medical and health coverage.

[JagLover]

GroundEffect said:

Productivity comes from investment.
.

In a large part it does, but in the most part from private investment with the government helping out in terms of such things as transport investment and educational spending.

If productivity growth had remained as it was in the 1990s then we wouldn't have had much of the "austerity", as the economy and public finances would be better, so "austerity" is primarily a symptom of what has gone wrong.

[Rick1.8t]

phil-sti said:

GroundEffect said:

In the US wages are higher (but they have a higher GDP/capita so it's not surprising) but it's not so simple to say that they have a lower cost of living.

Food costs in the US are surprisingly high for decent quality products. And accommodation prices vary wildly across the country.

I was suprised by this when I visted the US, 12 pack of beer which is £8 here was $17 dollars so about £15, a punnet of grapes was $10 (£8) where as it's £2 here.

This - you need a much higher relative income in the USA just to be able to afford to eat and access healthcare.

Inflation and the exchange rate hasn't helped but I went to the USA around 7 yrs ago and again around 6 months ago and the difference in the price of food was huge, $40 breakfast for two people (inc tip, nothing fancy) and as you say 'normal' food was much more expensive in walmart - I remember seeing a turkey that was $100 that would be about £30 here.

£24k isn't enough to live a normal life in the UK though, not by a mile, the American UPS drive is definitely a lot better off financially than the UK employee.

[s1962a]

It says in the article that the benefits are worth about $50k so $125k salary after benefits. Thats about £97k in todays exchange rate. Still a lot compared to what UPS drivers get paid in the UK even if you do take into account the higher costs of living. Appreciate that we get more holidays than them and probably have more workers rights, but it's still a pretty big disparity.

[captain_cynic]

Grumps. said:

s1962a said:

Yeah, i just noticed I put £ and not $

Still a lot, though!?

That's the power of collective bargaining.

The Teamsters Union is the US's most powerful union and delivery drivers are one of the largest unionised work forces.

Of course this is a misleading headline. It's an "average" which means a few highly paid ones on places like NYC with its high cost of living is going to raise the average compared to those in rural Georgia

Also 1/3 of the package are benefits like health care and other things we don't have to pay for our of our salaries.

Still not bad though. Shame we demonise unions so much over here.