Youth worker tasered by police

[272BHP]

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/jun/30/bl...

How did we end up with a system where something like this can clog up the courts? clearly doing everything he can to obstruct the police, refused to properly give a sample on multiple occasions, refused to be arrested, ignored all warnings he might be tasered.

He needs to go to jail for obstructing and wasting police time, how many officers are there at the scene who could better serve elsewhere? And how on earth is someone like this working with kids? what a terrible example he makes.

[bobbo89]

The police are very easy to work with if you're a normal person who can follow simple instructions and not become shouty and obstructive.

Simple case of fk about and find out. He found out.

[Ian Geary]

I remember some noise about this at the time.

The "fighting stance" comment rings a bell, but once again, we have camera footage (plod's this time) contradicting what would have been accepted as the given truth from two police officers. I can see how this causes umbridge.

However

The guy is an idiot. Crossing your arms when told to put your hands behind your back might not be a "fighting stance", bit it's clearly a uncooperative stance, that is basically resisting arrest.

The "speeding" claim was a canard - the police can pull any car over at any time. Always have, always will.

The breathalyser not producing a result multiple times is highly suspicious - I assume he was never subject to an evidential blood test for alcohol,so mission accomplished for the suspect there.

At least the UK cops only used a taser, and didn't just shoot him (reference to France this week for those who don't recognise it)

I disagree this should not have been to court. Our justice system needs to make these decisions transparently and openly.

If the case had been quashed, or overlooked, the guy and others would have just been able to polish the chip on his shoulder, whilst claiming to be denied justice.

I see his lawyers fancy some more fees by stringing out an appeal, but the guy needs to learn not to frame everything about his colour: you act stupid, then there are consequences, irrespective of colour.

[skwdenyer]

Ian Geary said:

I remember some noise about this at the time.

The "fighting stance" comment rings a bell, but once again, we have camera footage (plod's this time) contradicting what would have been accepted as the given truth from two police officers. I can see how this causes umbridge.

However

The guy is an idiot. Crossing your arms when told to put your hands behind your back might not be a "fighting stance", bit it's clearly a uncooperative stance, that is basically resisting arrest.

The "speeding" claim was a canard - the police can pull any car over at any time. Always have, always will.

The breathalyser not producing a result multiple times is highly suspicious - I assume he was never subject to an evidential blood test for alcohol,so mission accomplished for the suspect there.

At least the UK cops only used a taser, and didn't just shoot him (reference to France this week for those who don't recognise it)

I disagree this should not have been to court. Our justice system needs to make these decisions transparently and openly.

If the case had been quashed, or overlooked, the guy and others would have just been able to polish the chip on his shoulder, whilst claiming to be denied justice.

I see his lawyers fancy some more fees by stringing out an appeal, but the guy needs to learn not to frame everything about his colour: you act stupid, then there are consequences, irrespective of colour.

All of that may be so. But the consequence should be arrest, not physical punishment with a sometimes-lethal device. Tasering does seem to have become rather too common.

See the guy tweeted for standing on a bin - broke his back. In times past, BiB seemed very able to deal with these issues without electrocuting people.

[pork911]

'Officers at the scene had wrongly claimed in written statements that Afriyie had adopted a “fighting stance” before being Tasered.

The judge, Henrietta Hill, said it was clear from video footage that he had done “no such thing at any point in the incident” and that this created a “justified concern” that they had deliberately colluded to exaggerate Afriyie’s aggression.'



Call me 'umbridged'

[Biggy Stardust]

pork911 said:

'Officers at the scene had wrongly claimed in written statements that Afriyie had adopted a “fighting stance” before being Tasered.

The judge, Henrietta Hill, said it was clear from video footage that he had done “no such thing at any point in the incident” and that this created a “justified concern” that they had deliberately colluded to exaggerate Afriyie’s aggression.'

Call me 'umbridged'

Likewise.

My understanding was that tasers were to be used for self defence, not just to enforce compliance. My understanding was also that police dudes aren't supposed to tell fibs in their reports.

[Bigends]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS-pw5Vhv1g

Video here

Edited by Bigends on Sunday 2nd July 23:18

[mwstewart]

Six of one, and half a dozen of another...normally.

[carinaman]

Bigends said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS-pw5Vhv1g

Video here

Thanks.

I am not finding that an easy watch and stopped at 50 secs.

After the first non-blow, inform the chap that if his 'breathing difficulties' mean he cannot or doesn't blow sufficiently he'll be taken to the police station for a blood test?

[Oliver Hardy]

Officer colluded to exaggerate evidence is also worrying and should be sacked.

How can they ever be believed or trusted?

[Bigends]

carinaman said:

Bigends said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sS-pw5Vhv1g

Video here

Thanks.

I am not finding that an easy watch and stopped at 50 secs.

After the first non-blow, inform the chap that if his 'breathing difficulties' mean he cannot or doesn't blow sufficiently he'll be taken to the police station for a blood test?

Agreed - not pleasant.
Yep, failure or refusal results in arrest

[272BHP]

Quite clearly in the video he refused to give a reading, refused to be arrested and simply would not comply despite a number of attempts and warnings by police. The only option left for the police is to then take him by force, none of which is going to be pretty, would we all prefer they jump him, baton him or taser him?

I find it staggering that he has got off scot free and has provided a template for all others to non-comply, including the youths he works with.

[Biggy Stardust]

272BHP said:

Quite clearly in the video he refused to give a reading, refused to be arrested and simply would not comply despite a number of attempts and warnings by police. The only option left for the police is to then take him by force, none of which is going to be pretty, would we all prefer they jump him, baton him or taser him?

I find it staggering that he has got off scot free and has provided a template for all others to non-comply, including the youths he works with.

Scot free? Did you see the bit where he got tasered (whilst just standing there with folded arms) & smacked his head? Did you read the bit where the judge mentioned fibbing in the reports?

He was a fool & there was zero racial issue but he's not the only naughty person involved here.

[Bigends]

272BHP said:

Quite clearly in the video he refused to give a reading, refused to be arrested and simply would not comply despite a number of attempts and warnings by police. The only option left for the police is to then take him by force, none of which is going to be pretty, would we all prefer they jump him, baton him or taser him?

I find it staggering that he has got off scot free and has provided a template for all others to non-comply, including the youths he works with.

Not sure why he wasnt charged with failing to provide . Maybe procedure wasnt followed - cant think of another reason offhand. Suspects resist arrest everyday of the week - nothing new here

Edited by Bigends on Monday 3rd July 00:24

Edited by Bigends on Monday 3rd July 00:45

[skwdenyer]

272BHP said:

Quite clearly in the video he refused to give a reading, refused to be arrested and simply would not comply despite a number of attempts and warnings by police. The only option left for the police is to then take him by force, none of which is going to be pretty, would we all prefer they jump him, baton him or taser him?

I find it staggering that he has got off scot free and has provided a template for all others to non-comply, including the youths he works with.

So how did Police arrest people before Tasers? Remember that video from some years back that had so many US cops in awe as unarmed BiB expertly took down a (IIRC) knife-wielding suspect.

There’s a worrying - and perhaps justifiable - concern amongst the public that the Taser has simply become the British version of a US cop’s handgun. Look at the stats:



Source: https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/police-us...

So Tasers outweighs batons 7:1 nowadays. Tasers are used in approx 10% of drawings.

That report also reveals Tasers and other non-lethal (or more accurately less lethal) tactics are used disproportionately on black people, whilst black people are 3 times more likely to be on the receiving end of police “force” than white people, which is pretty worrying in this day and age.

[JuanCarlosFandango]

Seems worth a bit of umbridge. He was awkward but didn't look like he was about to kill anyone. If 4 (was it?) policemen can't arrest him without that then there's something wrong.

Not claiming any expertise in these matters but the police didn't seem very in control of the situation. As one of them said there were "too many voices" and it all seemed a bit haywire.

On the plus side nobody is dead and there aren't riots about it, but it appears that was more by luck than judgement.

[bitchstewie]

Biggy Stardust said:

He was a fool & there was zero racial issue but he's not the only naughty person involved here.

Pretty much this.

It's not always an either/or thing.

[944 Man]

Remember when CS gas was a less lethal alternative to firearms?

CS gas is now routinely deployed when people resist arrest, without consequence.

Remember when Tasers were introduced as a less lethal alternative firearms, used in similar situations and only by specialist officers?

Tasers are now routinely used to threaten people and the news is full of repeated cases where they are used inappropriately, without consequence.

Only a fool would be in favour of British police being routinely armed.

[mikey_b]

skwdenyer said:

272BHP said:

Quite clearly in the video he refused to give a reading, refused to be arrested and simply would not comply despite a number of attempts and warnings by police. The only option left for the police is to then take him by force, none of which is going to be pretty, would we all prefer they jump him, baton him or taser him?

I find it staggering that he has got off scot free and has provided a template for all others to non-comply, including the youths he works with.

So how did Police arrest people before Tasers? Remember that video from some years back that had so many US cops in awe as unarmed BiB expertly took down a (IIRC) knife-wielding suspect.

There’s a worrying - and perhaps justifiable - concern amongst the public that the Taser has simply become the British version of a US cop’s handgun. Look at the stats:



Source: https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/police-us...

So Tasers outweighs batons 7:1 nowadays. Tasers are used in approx 10% of drawings.

That report also reveals Tasers and other non-lethal (or more accurately less lethal) tactics are used disproportionately on black people, whilst black people are 3 times more likely to be on the receiving end of police “force” than white people, which is pretty worrying in this day and age.

Which is more dangerous for the cop though - a taser from a few feet away, or a short steel stick that can only be used when in knife-range of the suspect? Tasers are considered non-lethal because for an overwhelming majority of times they are used, they are indeed merely very unpleasant. A baton to the skull or knees/shins/etc can cause serious injury too, and is more risky for the officer to use.

It isn't just the safety of the suspect that needs consideration.

[Slowboathome]

Sorry, but that's pretty poor on the part of the police.

The bloke was uncooperative but there is nothing on that video that could be construed as aggressive.

If they're going to taser him they may as well do it to every JSO plonker who sits down in the road (hmm, not a bad idea).