WFH to blame for hosepipe ban
Discussion
Really can't believe this is the case as regardless of where that person is, surely they would use the same amount of water (assuming working within the same water authority area) as if they were in the office?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-66007675
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-66007675
Had a laugh at this. Even if there is a corralation, I doubt it's causation - how did they manage in lockdown, when everyone was working from home, or at home not working?
It's utter trash - they got their models wrong, massively under invested, and are now scrambling. If they were a rail franchise, the govt would be stepping in to remove it from them: why aren't they doing this? Seems to me that they've clearly failed in their mandate and alternative leadership is required.
Humans may consume marginally more water when at home in a hot office instead of an airconditioned one, but I doubt it's significant (and indeed, in light of our leaders decision that we will use less energy, it seems preferable to sitting in an A/C'd room).
It's utter trash - they got their models wrong, massively under invested, and are now scrambling. If they were a rail franchise, the govt would be stepping in to remove it from them: why aren't they doing this? Seems to me that they've clearly failed in their mandate and alternative leadership is required.
Humans may consume marginally more water when at home in a hot office instead of an airconditioned one, but I doubt it's significant (and indeed, in light of our leaders decision that we will use less energy, it seems preferable to sitting in an A/C'd room).
The UK water system clearly isn't working. The basic component of a private market is that customers have choice. If you don't want to buy a car from BMW you buy from Skoda, if you don't want to shop as ASDA you can shop at ALDI. The water companies operate as private businesses but the customers have no way to move from their supplier for any reason. If you don't like that Southern Water are not investing and the quality of the service is crap you can't buy from Scottish Water. If you don't like that Thames Water are pumping more s
t into the sea than Yorkshire Water you can't change supplier to the one with the best performance.
Unfortunately the Government and Ofgem appear toothless in the face of international investors who expect ongoing returns from their investments. The Government are so focussed on low prices to consumers while maintaining dividend payments that they seem unwilling to either allow companies to raise prices to invest in the water network or block dividends for a period of time until the system works better for consumers. Fines for poor performance are totally pointless, the company has a regulated income and fines just eat into their budget to invest.
The whole system is a failure and the country would be in a much better place if it was all renationalised, OR you set up a proper market place similar to the electricity network whereby customers can buy from any supplier while an overall system operator manages the pipework and infrastructure. At the very least renationalising would allow cheaper borrowing and any profits would be for the benefit of the country not overseas pension funds and governments.
That said, planners don't help either. 10 years ago Thames Water wanted to build a large reservoir near Oxford to plan for future increases in demand. The plan was blocked by planners, with them stating that decreasing leaks and encouraging customers to use less would suffice. It is considerably cheaper and more efficient to increase supply than try and decrease leaks though - digging up roads is very expensive!
t into the sea than Yorkshire Water you can't change supplier to the one with the best performance. Unfortunately the Government and Ofgem appear toothless in the face of international investors who expect ongoing returns from their investments. The Government are so focussed on low prices to consumers while maintaining dividend payments that they seem unwilling to either allow companies to raise prices to invest in the water network or block dividends for a period of time until the system works better for consumers. Fines for poor performance are totally pointless, the company has a regulated income and fines just eat into their budget to invest.
The whole system is a failure and the country would be in a much better place if it was all renationalised, OR you set up a proper market place similar to the electricity network whereby customers can buy from any supplier while an overall system operator manages the pipework and infrastructure. At the very least renationalising would allow cheaper borrowing and any profits would be for the benefit of the country not overseas pension funds and governments.
That said, planners don't help either. 10 years ago Thames Water wanted to build a large reservoir near Oxford to plan for future increases in demand. The plan was blocked by planners, with them stating that decreasing leaks and encouraging customers to use less would suffice. It is considerably cheaper and more efficient to increase supply than try and decrease leaks though - digging up roads is very expensive!
Condi said:
The UK water system clearly isn't working. The basic component of a private market is that customers have choice. If you don't want to buy a car from BMW you buy from Skoda, if you don't want to shop as ASDA you can shop at ALDI. The water companies operate as private businesses but the customers have no way to move from their supplier for any reason. If you don't like that Southern Water are not investing and the quality of the service is crap you can't buy from Scottish Water. If you don't like that Thames Water are pumping more st into the sea than Yorkshire Water you can't change supplier to the one with the best performance.
Unfortunately the Government and Ofgem appear toothless in the face of international investors who expect ongoing returns from their investments. The Government are so focussed on low prices to consumers while maintaining dividend payments that they seem unwilling to either allow companies to raise prices to invest in the water network or block dividends for a period of time until the system works better for consumers. Fines for poor performance are totally pointless, the company has a regulated income and fines just eat into their budget to invest.
The whole system is a failure and the country would be in a much better place if it was all renationalised, OR you set up a proper market place similar to the electricity network whereby customers can buy from any supplier while an overall system operator manages the pipework and infrastructure. At the very least renationalising would allow cheaper borrowing and any profits would be for the benefit of the country not overseas pension funds and governments.
That said, planners don't help either. 10 years ago Thames Water wanted to build a large reservoir near Oxford to plan for future increases in demand. The plan was blocked by planners, with them stating that decreasing leaks and encouraging customers to use less would suffice. It is considerably cheaper and more efficient to increase supply than try and decrease leaks though - digging up roads is very expensive!
Could not agree more, particularly when water is such a critical piece of infrastructure.t into the sea than Yorkshire Water you can't change supplier to the one with the best performance. Unfortunately the Government and Ofgem appear toothless in the face of international investors who expect ongoing returns from their investments. The Government are so focussed on low prices to consumers while maintaining dividend payments that they seem unwilling to either allow companies to raise prices to invest in the water network or block dividends for a period of time until the system works better for consumers. Fines for poor performance are totally pointless, the company has a regulated income and fines just eat into their budget to invest.
The whole system is a failure and the country would be in a much better place if it was all renationalised, OR you set up a proper market place similar to the electricity network whereby customers can buy from any supplier while an overall system operator manages the pipework and infrastructure. At the very least renationalising would allow cheaper borrowing and any profits would be for the benefit of the country not overseas pension funds and governments.
That said, planners don't help either. 10 years ago Thames Water wanted to build a large reservoir near Oxford to plan for future increases in demand. The plan was blocked by planners, with them stating that decreasing leaks and encouraging customers to use less would suffice. It is considerably cheaper and more efficient to increase supply than try and decrease leaks though - digging up roads is very expensive!
Scrimpton said:
Anglian are pretty good to be fair, they've made substantial investments and we didn't even have a hosepipe ban last summer. For a ban to be in place already after such a wet winter suggests incompetence.
I beg to differ: they paid £90M to shareholders in dividends last year, then sent a letter to all their customers insisting bills would need to rise because their costs were increasing after they joined in the st pumping... Then on the performance aspect, they haven't been building any new reservoirs (fortunately we seem to have just about enough water in the region for the last few years, but that's luck), they still have a lot of rusty iron mains, and have nothing in the way of subsidies etc for lead replacement.
So no, I'd call them a shower of b
ds.My son-in-law is contracted to a water company to repair various bits when the fail. He's not cheap. It used to take him a few days a month. Now it is all but full time.
He has told the bosses of plants that if they bought new items, rather than repair the outdated ones he works on, they would save money in a little over a year. When an item does fail completely, and a new one is required, he is given a second hand unit to fit. A couple of times they supplied the wrong part and he has to work on site for a couple of days or more to make it up to regulation standards, charging them more than the fitted price of a new item. On top of that, there's the price of the rubbish part they bought. Ironically, they are throwing money, our money, down the drain, that's as well as at shareholders.
He's just had an extension built on your and my water rates.
It is farcical.
He has told the bosses of plants that if they bought new items, rather than repair the outdated ones he works on, they would save money in a little over a year. When an item does fail completely, and a new one is required, he is given a second hand unit to fit. A couple of times they supplied the wrong part and he has to work on site for a couple of days or more to make it up to regulation standards, charging them more than the fitted price of a new item. On top of that, there's the price of the rubbish part they bought. Ironically, they are throwing money, our money, down the drain, that's as well as at shareholders.
He's just had an extension built on your and my water rates.
It is farcical.
donkmeister said:
Scrimpton said:
Anglian are pretty good to be fair, they've made substantial investments and we didn't even have a hosepipe ban last summer. For a ban to be in place already after such a wet winter suggests incompetence.
I beg to differ: they paid £90M to shareholders in dividends last year, then sent a letter to all their customers insisting bills would need to rise because their costs were increasing after they joined in the st pumping... Then on the performance aspect, they haven't been building any new reservoirs (fortunately we seem to have just about enough water in the region for the last few years, but that's luck), they still have a lot of rusty iron mains, and have nothing in the way of subsidies etc for lead replacement.
So no, I'd call them a shower of b
ds.ds.crankedup5 said:
donkmeister said:
Scrimpton said:
Anglian are pretty good to be fair, they've made substantial investments and we didn't even have a hosepipe ban last summer. For a ban to be in place already after such a wet winter suggests incompetence.
I beg to differ: they paid £90M to shareholders in dividends last year, then sent a letter to all their customers insisting bills would need to rise because their costs were increasing after they joined in the st pumping... Then on the performance aspect, they haven't been building any new reservoirs (fortunately we seem to have just about enough water in the region for the last few years, but that's luck), they still have a lot of rusty iron mains, and have nothing in the way of subsidies etc for lead replacement.
So no, I'd call them a shower of b
ds.ds.Thames Water frequent our tv screens regularly round here telling us 'While you're asleep we are out mending leaks.'
Yeah, invariably leaks which TW caused, and all the while filling our rivers with 's
t', rivers (like the Windrush) where once you could see the bottom of a foot and a half of crystal clear fast moving water, brimming with fish and wildlife. Today, you see little water movement in the river just all the 'filth' that's been pumped into it, and warning signs like 'Do not enter the water!' 'Do not let your Dog enter the water' ...as if we need to be told.
Tossers?
'Criminals' is probably a far more accurate assessment of them.
Right, give it half-an-hour and I'll be out 'watering' our garden. Already washed the car this morning.
F 'em! I look at it in simplistic terms:
I PAY for my water, so I'll use it - and that means if and when I wish to'.
s the lot of them. Today much of the South Coast is once again a no swim zone given Southern Water’s scumbag practices of dumping sewage with impunity. Fines simply don’t work; the CEOs of these companies need to have the menace of criminal charges for every illegal dumping. Look at the state of this on the South Coast today. We live 3 mins walk from the beach in Sussex and plenty of people were swimming today - all ages too.
https://www.sas.org.uk/water-quality/sewage-pollut...
Galsia said:
I’m not surprised to hear this. For some reason companies absolutely hate working from home and are trying everything to portray these employees as lazy and immoral.
Some companies. And I'd be more specific still...some CEOs.What seems to be happening now, with stories like this, the daft lines from The Telegraph and morons like Hunt, is utterly bizarre.
But what it seems to be pointing at is that none of them have a clue about productivity and seem to be in full on deflection mode. I guess none of that should come as a surprise really.
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