Sad Guardian Compo Face. (Leasehold charges on ex LA flats)

[wisbech]

OK, I feel for them that they have even less control of the situation vs a privately managed block.

But complaining that it 'undermines right to buy' because you have to pay maintenance seems a bit rich. Presumably the answer is to have a sinking fund, in the same way that a normal block of flats would, but allow the council to pay in a lump sum when work required. This would mean the owners wouldn't get as big a shock, as they would be paying up front for more of the work (and the larger management fee would clue them into the real cost of living there, so they can make better informed decisions when buying)

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/jan/16/leas...

[Biggy Stardust]

I think of it this way: if you don't want a lease & all of its issues then don't buy a leasehold property.

It's not a perfect solution but it's incredibly simple & straightforward. So much better than buying one & then complaining.

[Lotobear]

...demand for Government action and more 'free' money incoming.

[The Wookie]

Probably an opportunity for some visibility of how much council contracted builders and housing associations are ripping the arse out of any work they do, enabled by box-ticking council staff with inadequate appreciation of the value of the money they're dishing out

[Jonmx]

"I would expect a Labour council to be more caring to the needs of ordinary citizens"

This quote amused me. Of course, Labour are the party of no responsibility and free money in the eyes of so many. I sympathise with the lack of a S20 consultation process, and that should be addressed, but why should other folks fund the repairs to your building?

[wisbech]

Jonmx said:

"I would expect a Labour council to be more caring to the needs of ordinary citizens"

This quote amused me. Of course, Labour are the party of no responsibility and free money in the eyes of so many. I sympathise with the lack of a S20 consultation process, and that should be addressed, but why should other folks fund the repairs to your building?

Or the fact that the local Labour council still aren’t best pleased about RTB, and probably regard them as carpetbaggers

[anonymous-user]

Biggy Stardust said:

I think of it this way: if you don't want a lease & all of its issues then don't buy a leasehold property.

It's not a perfect solution but it's incredibly simple & straightforward. So much better than buying one & then complaining.

Tell me how I know you haven't got a clue about London property prices and availability.

"Just buy freehold instead", in Islington

[Jonmx]

wisbech said:

Jonmx said:

"I would expect a Labour council to be more caring to the needs of ordinary citizens"

This quote amused me. Of course, Labour are the party of no responsibility and free money in the eyes of so many. I sympathise with the lack of a S20 consultation process, and that should be addressed, but why should other folks fund the repairs to your building?

Or the fact that the local Labour council still aren’t best pleased about RTB, and probably regard them as carpetbaggers

Exactly how my slightly more left wing friends view them.

[768]

WorldBoss said:

Biggy Stardust said:

I think of it this way: if you don't want a lease & all of its issues then don't buy a leasehold property.

It's not a perfect solution but it's incredibly simple & straightforward. So much better than buying one & then complaining.

Tell me how I know you haven't got a clue about London property prices and availability.

"Just buy freehold instead", in Islington

Must be terrible being unable to leave Islington.

[Countdown]

wisbech said:

OK, I feel for them that they have even less control of the situation vs a privately managed block.

But complaining that it 'undermines right to buy' because you have to pay maintenance seems a bit rich. Presumably the answer is to have a sinking fund, in the same way that a normal block of flats would, but allow the council to pay in a lump sum when work required. This would mean the owners wouldn't get as big a shock, as they would be paying up front for more of the work (and the larger management fee would clue them into the real cost of living there, so they can make better informed decisions when buying)

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/jan/16/leas...

These issues are highlighted in BIG BOLD LETTERS to everybody doing an RTB. The Councils would much rather people didn't exercise their RTB, and they are well aware of the upset that major repair works cost. It's a lot easier for the Council to charge it all to the HRA. However of people want to buy their own property, and benefit from the capital appreciation, and to "leave something for the kids" then they have to take the rough with the smooth.

[donkmeister]

WorldBoss said:

Biggy Stardust said:

I think of it this way: if you don't want a lease & all of its issues then don't buy a leasehold property.

It's not a perfect solution but it's incredibly simple & straightforward. So much better than buying one & then complaining.

Tell me how I know you haven't got a clue about London property prices and availability.

"Just buy freehold instead", in Islington

He has a point though; a desire to have my own freehold property was the reason I moved out of London. People have to make choices, sometimes those choices have significant risks or downsides. Wouldn't life be great if we could cherry pick everything?

Maybe the work should be put to tender when there are private leaseholders involved, but from secondhand accounts of the perils of maintenance costs in a private block (the "I will retire here" gang wanted new windows, the "I'm here for a couple of years and want to move up to a house soon" gang didn't want to pay thousands of pounds for windows) the costs of maintaining a block can be high even when split multiple ways. Jobs that can be conducted easily on a one or two storey building require massive scaffolding, cranes, proper risk assessments etc.

[JagLover]

wisbech said:

OK, I feel for them that they have even less control of the situation vs a privately managed block.

But complaining that it 'undermines right to buy' because you have to pay maintenance seems a bit rich. Presumably the answer is to have a sinking fund, in the same way that a normal block of flats would, but allow the council to pay in a lump sum when work required. This would mean the owners wouldn't get as big a shock, as they would be paying up front for more of the work (and the larger management fee would clue them into the real cost of living there, so they can make better informed decisions when buying)

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/jan/16/leas...

100% this

It is the lack of a sinking fund that is the issue. Locally to where I used to live were newbuild flats with a service charge of around £1,500 and probably around two thirds of that is the sinking fund. They are fifteen years old so you would hope little will go wrong with them for a while and when it does there should be a significant sum built up and if you are paying £1K a year it is far better than the current owner being presented with a bill of this size.

[Biggy Stardust]

WorldBoss said:

Tell me how I know you haven't got a clue about London property prices and availability.

"Just buy freehold instead", in Islington

I didn't say "just buy a freehold in Islington", did I? I said don't buy a leasehold & then complain about having a lease.

[Matthen]

Perhaps the council should offer to buy the flats back (with the same discount rate as the tenant received when they bought the lease), with a contract stating that the tenant forfeits the right to buy for the next 10 years -

The alternative is to remortgage - council shouldn't be offering payment plans imo; exposes them to an unacceptable loss.

[bloomen]

By 'buying' such a thing you are writing a blank cheque to a mindless and faceless organisation with no obligation to anything other than itself. And it doesn't care about itself either, just covering the one small arse that's about to ruin your life by ticking a box somewhere.

That seems like a really, really bad idea.

[KAgantua]

WorldBoss said:

Biggy Stardust said:

I think of it this way: if you don't want a lease & all of its issues then don't buy a leasehold property.

It's not a perfect solution but it's incredibly simple & straightforward. So much better than buying one & then complaining.

Tell me how I know you haven't got a clue about London property prices and availability.

"Just buy freehold instead", in Islington

Er, maybe dont buy in Islington at all? Its one of the most expensive areas in the UK!

[JagLover]

KAgantua said:

Er, maybe dont buy in Islington at all? Its one of the most expensive areas in the UK!

Yes, there are cheaper places further out that are still commutable.

I lived for a number of years in a nice maisonette in New Eltham. Nice quiet road, five minutes walk to train station and some very solid construction (probably the best in terms of noise insulation I have been in). Can buy a two bed maisonette there for around £300K

[Oakey]

The Wookie said:

Probably an opportunity for some visibility of how much council contracted builders and housing associations are ripping the arse out of any work they do, enabled by box-ticking council staff with inadequate appreciation of the value of the money they're dishing out

My dad took our council to court over this and won and the council kept appealing and he kept winning until it got to whichever the highest court is (Supreme Court?) at which point he lost. Then they gagged him from talking about it. In his case it was regards the replacement of the soffits and fascias on his block of eight flats ( 2 stories, 4 on top, 4 on bottom)... the council were charging £32k to fit UPVC over the existing timber!

Highlighted what work was carried out below;

Edited by Oakey on Monday 16th January 12:45

[carreauchompeur]

I suppose it depends on the division of the bill. I had a shared ownership flat in Bristol a few years ago and it really rankled that us as leaseholders with 30% shares were 100% responsible for maintenance of everything.

The bills they are talking about seem huge.

[JagLover]

carreauchompeur said:

I suppose it depends on the division of the bill. I had a shared ownership flat in Bristol a few years ago and it really rankled that us as leaseholders with 30% shares were 100% responsible for maintenance of everything.

The bills they are talking about seem huge.

Well it depends how long it has been since any serious work was done to the property. Hence the sinking fund comparison as £x for thirty years is much more manageable than £30x in the thirtieth year.