Unions - you cant have it both ways...
Discussion
So we have the RMT that is hell bent on screwing every single penny out of everyone in the name of helping its employees.
You have Bombardier Transportation’s consortium who was going for the new 1,200 new carriages on the Thameslink route in South East England.
Now they didnt win the contract due to the competition being better outside the country lead by Siemens.
So now you have an influx of new jobs actually into the country to help make parts and everyone should be happy, we get new carriages and they are better than anything we can make here... but no, Bob is not happy.
Bob Crow, general secretary of the RMT transport union, said: “We are being fobbed off with a deal which will only create a minimal number of component jobs in Tyne and Wear with the trains themselves built in Germany.”
So lets get this correct Bombardier Transportation’s consortium that has put in 2 bids now for 2 different projects and failed with both of them, obviously there is something not right with their bids or their manufactoring ability is not up to scratch... but thats ok for Bob as we should make it in the UK as its for the UK????
I can see the EU having a field day if we did that and not allow someone in the EU to bid on one of our projects and besides if they are getting a good deal on them then I see no issue... Plus I bet they put in some pretty hefty fines in if the carriages are not on time.
You have Bombardier Transportation’s consortium who was going for the new 1,200 new carriages on the Thameslink route in South East England.
Now they didnt win the contract due to the competition being better outside the country lead by Siemens.
So now you have an influx of new jobs actually into the country to help make parts and everyone should be happy, we get new carriages and they are better than anything we can make here... but no, Bob is not happy.
Bob Crow, general secretary of the RMT transport union, said: “We are being fobbed off with a deal which will only create a minimal number of component jobs in Tyne and Wear with the trains themselves built in Germany.”
So lets get this correct Bombardier Transportation’s consortium that has put in 2 bids now for 2 different projects and failed with both of them, obviously there is something not right with their bids or their manufactoring ability is not up to scratch... but thats ok for Bob as we should make it in the UK as its for the UK????
I can see the EU having a field day if we did that and not allow someone in the EU to bid on one of our projects and besides if they are getting a good deal on them then I see no issue... Plus I bet they put in some pretty hefty fines in if the carriages are not on time.
As I don't know anything about this I feel eminently qualified to pass comment;)
It seems that the UK applies EU law religiously whereas other countries do so only when it benefits them.
Even if it cost more to build in the UK would the benefits of more tax being generated and less err "benefits" being paid out PLUS a boost to the manufacturing industry not have been worth the extra cost ?
It seems that the UK applies EU law religiously whereas other countries do so only when it benefits them.
Even if it cost more to build in the UK would the benefits of more tax being generated and less err "benefits" being paid out PLUS a boost to the manufacturing industry not have been worth the extra cost ?
Countdown said:
JMGS4 said:
Bob Crow the workers worker.... just goes out for supper at £650 a throw... time that guy was hung for his hypocricy!!! along with most of the other champagne socialists...
Why shouldn't he spend his money as he sees fit 
Countdown said:
JMGS4 said:
Bob Crow the workers worker.... just goes out for supper at £650 a throw... time that guy was hung for his hypocricy!!! along with most of the other champagne socialists...
Why shouldn't he spend his money as he sees fit Countdown said:
As I don't know anything about this I feel eminently qualified to pass comment;)
It seems that the UK applies EU law religiously whereas other countries do so only when it benefits them.
Even if it cost more to build in the UK would the benefits of more tax being generated and less err "benefits" being paid out PLUS a boost to the manufacturing industry not have been worth the extra cost ?
Cause we have been left hung out to dry...It seems that the UK applies EU law religiously whereas other countries do so only when it benefits them.
Even if it cost more to build in the UK would the benefits of more tax being generated and less err "benefits" being paid out PLUS a boost to the manufacturing industry not have been worth the extra cost ?
The latest one being the Greek bailout...
The arguement is that we are not part of the EU and therefore should not need to bail them out, france and german are happy with that, but if there is a vote and the majority go against us then we are stuck with 12% of the bailout of Greece.
nice eh?
Follow the rules to the letter when it f
ks us up and gain no benefit... I see very little sense in being part of the EU when all me are doing is paying for other people and when the other countries dont like it they tell them to fk off... but not us!!ewenm said:
As long as he doesn't complain about others making and spending lots of money too. No "fat cat" comments please Mr Crow... ah, hold on...
Ahh but his beef is his members being screwed for the benefit of the fat cats. He would probably be quite happy if his members got a fair share of the profits 
AndrewW-G said:
Countdown said:
JMGS4 said:
Bob Crow the workers worker.... just goes out for supper at £650 a throw... time that guy was hung for his hypocricy!!! along with most of the other champagne socialists...
Why shouldn't he spend his money as he sees fit 
Countdown said:
Ahh but his beef is his members being screwed for the benefit of the fat cats. He would probably be quite happy if his members got a fair share of the profits
Bob Crow being happy 
"Fair" is a politician's favourite word - it can be defined as anyone wishes and no-one will ever agree.
Unfortunately giving the Contract to Siemens will turn out to be much more expensive. Even if Siemens do spend money here with component makers it's a fraction of the total cost of the money spent going out of the UK. If the UK company was given the contract most of the money recycles back into the UK economy. Not only via component contracts but taxation and NI payments, Local businesses taking money for sales etc. It never sounds much until it's added up.
Countdown said:
JMGS4 said:
Bob Crow the workers worker.... just goes out for supper at £650 a throw... time that guy was hung for his hypocricy!!! along with most of the other champagne socialists...
Why shouldn't he spend his money as he sees fit telecat said:
Unfortunately giving the Contract to Siemens will turn out to be much more expensive. Even if Siemens do spend money here with component makers it's a fraction of the total cost of the money spent going out of the UK. If the UK company was given the contract most of the money recycles back into the UK economy. Not only via component contracts but taxation and NI payments, Local businesses taking money for sales etc. It never sounds much until it's added up.
Very true, how crap must Bombardier Transportation be to loose the bid? As a Derby bloke, I'm not happy about losing the deal. But it's not as if Bombardier lost it because the workers wanted more pay and to keep their pensions untouched too at no cost to themselves.
Or would Bob have wanted that as well? As the OP said, you can't have it both ways.
Does he change his tune whether it's the public or private sector he's representing?
Or would Bob have wanted that as well? As the OP said, you can't have it both ways.
Does he change his tune whether it's the public or private sector he's representing?
Edited by Balmoral Green on Monday 20th June 11:00
The problem I have with all this is that if this were a project for a German train operator, the order would never have gone anywhere other than to a German manufacturer. It's the same with the power industry, and....
It's anti competitive practice but as it's politicians, local and national, doing it seems to be considered OK.
It's been widely known for a long time that in the smoke filled rooms the discussion goes along the lines of, "OK this time it's X's turn for the switch gear, and Y's for the motors and so on."
It's bloody obvious when you see it.
It's anti competitive practice but as it's politicians, local and national, doing it seems to be considered OK.
It's been widely known for a long time that in the smoke filled rooms the discussion goes along the lines of, "OK this time it's X's turn for the switch gear, and Y's for the motors and so on."
It's bloody obvious when you see it.
As was pointed out by many commentators when this hit the news last week. The Germans, the French and the Spanish all buy their own.
This is one private company buying off another, but there should be a political Nationalistic angle for stuff like this IMO. If for no other reason than everyone else does it. There's no way the French or the Germans would have bought British even if it was the best bid.
This is one private company buying off another, but there should be a political Nationalistic angle for stuff like this IMO. If for no other reason than everyone else does it. There's no way the French or the Germans would have bought British even if it was the best bid.
F i F said:
The problem I have with all this is that if this were a project for a German train operator, the order would never have gone anywhere other than to a German manufacturer.
Or perhaps they make the best trains? I don't mean this as a facetious comment but my uncle has just come back from a trip to China and most of their new 200mph+ train hardware appear to be made by Siemens.MrTom said:
Very true, how crap must Bombardier Transportation be to loose the bid?
As I understand it, Siemens have bid for other contracts and been unsuccessful. Apparently this time they made it known that if they were unsuccessful this time they would not bid for any future contracts.Balmoral Green said:
As was pointed out by many commentators when this hit the news last week. The Germans, the French and the Spanish all buy their own.
This is one private company buying off another, but there should be a political Nationalistic angle for stuff like this IMO. If for no other reason than everyone else does it. There's no way the French or the Germans would have bought British even if it was the best bid.
Well its not like the germans dont seem to make the best components at the moment and I cant see anyone else specialising in TGVs outside of France, so can anyone really compete with them on internal markets?This is one private company buying off another, but there should be a political Nationalistic angle for stuff like this IMO. If for no other reason than everyone else does it. There's no way the French or the Germans would have bought British even if it was the best bid.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff