Reform UK - A symptom of all that is wrong?
Discussion
President Merkin said:
I used to believe Turbo that you were at least intelligent. I credited you with that, albeit hopelessly biased. However, riding on the coat tails of some brain surgeon posting a single poll is causing me to do some heavy lifting on that front Very few people would be stupid enough not only to accept that as a valid repsonse, much less repeat it.
So is that the best you can do? If it is, I would stop now.
FYI Poster you are being sniffy about is an OG PHer. Here to steer cars more than votes.So is that the best you can do? If it is, I would stop now.
Nasty, petty little snipe that.
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/refor...
I read this thinking "no point reading beyond the headline because it can't be much worse", then I read it anyway
Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
I read this thinking "no point reading beyond the headline because it can't be much worse", then I read it anyway
Article said:
Leslie Lilley, who is set to win almost 20 per cent of the vote in the Labour battleground seat of Southend East & Rochford, made the threats on the official Facebook account he uses to run his local campaign.
In a post in June 2020, Lilley reacted to the news of a small boat arriving in Dover saying: “I hope I’m near one of these scumbags one day I won’t run away I’ll slaughter them then have their family taken out.”
The same month, Lilley, now 70, railed against “more scum entering the UK”, adding “I hope your family get Robbed, Beaten or attacked”.
Are there any Reform candidates left who haven't said something awful?In a post in June 2020, Lilley reacted to the news of a small boat arriving in Dover saying: “I hope I’m near one of these scumbags one day I won’t run away I’ll slaughter them then have their family taken out.”
The same month, Lilley, now 70, railed against “more scum entering the UK”, adding “I hope your family get Robbed, Beaten or attacked”.
Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
Mr Penguin said:
Are there any Reform candidates left who haven't said something awful?
Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
I guess past the sorts of stories, before the snap election call, weren't deemed suitably newsworthy and filed the the press offices as "general nutter, non news".Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
Utterly staggering racism.
Mr Penguin said:
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/refor...
I read this thinking "no point reading beyond the headline because it can't be much worse", then I read it anyway
Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
June 2020 - during the early hysterical period of the covid pandemic. Doesn't excuse the sentiment but given the words said about the unvaxxed and non-mask wearers in the media up to 2 years later - there may have been a little panic induced language being used.I read this thinking "no point reading beyond the headline because it can't be much worse", then I read it anyway
Article said:
Leslie Lilley, who is set to win almost 20 per cent of the vote in the Labour battleground seat of Southend East & Rochford, made the threats on the official Facebook account he uses to run his local campaign.
In a post in June 2020, Lilley reacted to the news of a small boat arriving in Dover saying: “I hope I’m near one of these scumbags one day I won’t run away I’ll slaughter them then have their family taken out.”
The same month, Lilley, now 70, railed against “more scum entering the UK”, adding “I hope your family get Robbed, Beaten or attacked”.
Are there any Reform candidates left who haven't said something awful?In a post in June 2020, Lilley reacted to the news of a small boat arriving in Dover saying: “I hope I’m near one of these scumbags one day I won’t run away I’ll slaughter them then have their family taken out.”
The same month, Lilley, now 70, railed against “more scum entering the UK”, adding “I hope your family get Robbed, Beaten or attacked”.
Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
Our local Reform candidate popped a post up on the sparsely populated local politics page...
"Andrea" being Jenkyns, a figure I've wittered on about here far too much already but I find her whole career trajectory fascinating from a position of absolute bemusement.
Anyway her sister is currently "helping" with her campaign, this is an insight into things at a small local level as more and more people here seem to be shifting in the direction of a Reform vote:
"Andrea" being Jenkyns, a figure I've wittered on about here far too much already but I find her whole career trajectory fascinating from a position of absolute bemusement.
Anyway her sister is currently "helping" with her campaign, this is an insight into things at a small local level as more and more people here seem to be shifting in the direction of a Reform vote:
MPs Sister said:
James, these really are underhand tactics for someone who claims to be honest and have integrity.
The reality, as both you and I know full well, is that you have been contacting Andrea's office for months - long before the election was called - asking for meetings and then flaking when she suggested a time and place. You even spoke and met with a resident in this group and said you wanted to meet.
You have regularly messaged her office staff, (to which they still have the messages) and you reached out again late last week wanting to meet with Andrea to discuss something you didn't want to reveal in your text message.
We met you on Monday at the White Rose shopping centre and I sat down and spoke with you first while Andrea took her son, Clifford, to the toilet.
You told me that you had wanted to stand in Hillary Benn's constituency but were told by Reform UK's central office that you were to announce your candidacy in Leeds South West and Morley in order to pressure Andrea to defect.
When she refused to do so, you were told to fill out your nomination papers and stand against her, despite you telling me that you have huge respect for Andrea, agree with her on everything, and really didn't want to stand here and split the vote.
Later, when you spoke with Andrea, you said the following about the Reform Party leadership:
"They've just thrown you under the bus. They're a
holes. It's horrific."
You also said: "Andrea, it doesn't make f**king sense why I'm standing against you... I've made it clear. I did not want to stand against you."
You explained that you knew you could not win this seat, telling Andrea: "We know this. I'm not that f**king stupid," and made it perfectly clear that you knew you were splitting the vote against a conservative you respect purely to fulfill a vendetta at Reform UK against Andrea for not being blackmailed into defecting.
You say that Reform UK is a party for the people, yet you told Andrea: "Reform is what it is but I think it's just going to fold like UKIP, like the Brexit Party." You said of your own volunteers in the constituency, "I wouldn't let some of them knock on doors."
And on the structure of Reform UK as a private company, you explained how you have no control over your candidate Facebook page. "Everything has to go through them. They are literally admin on my Facebook. They watch everything I do." You also explained how you are unable to obtain funding for your campaign, revealing all donations from members goes straight to head office and you have to apply to have funding approved.
Wondering why you wanted to meet and after hearing your concerns and your acceptance that you know you cannot win, Andrea explained how she thought you were a nice guy, and how you both really did not want to split the vote and let in Labour.
Only at this point did Andrea ask you if you would consider doing a video endorsing her to which you replied: "Let me have a think. It sounds like a plan to me."
You even added how you would want to be "suited and booted" and wouldn't want to come across as a "dosser," suggesting you were serious about the idea.
You've since go on social media and insinuated that Andrea asked you to endorse her, omitting to mention all of the above that provides vital context and gives a very clear insight into just what is going on in your "party".
Also you said to me personally that you do not want to become an MP as you earn far more in your Regional Manager role.
Do you dispute or deny anything I have said?
Is this sort of thing just happening around here or are others witnessing this kind of right vs right public fighting on social media? The reality, as both you and I know full well, is that you have been contacting Andrea's office for months - long before the election was called - asking for meetings and then flaking when she suggested a time and place. You even spoke and met with a resident in this group and said you wanted to meet.
You have regularly messaged her office staff, (to which they still have the messages) and you reached out again late last week wanting to meet with Andrea to discuss something you didn't want to reveal in your text message.
We met you on Monday at the White Rose shopping centre and I sat down and spoke with you first while Andrea took her son, Clifford, to the toilet.
You told me that you had wanted to stand in Hillary Benn's constituency but were told by Reform UK's central office that you were to announce your candidacy in Leeds South West and Morley in order to pressure Andrea to defect.
When she refused to do so, you were told to fill out your nomination papers and stand against her, despite you telling me that you have huge respect for Andrea, agree with her on everything, and really didn't want to stand here and split the vote.
Later, when you spoke with Andrea, you said the following about the Reform Party leadership:
"They've just thrown you under the bus. They're a
holes. It's horrific."You also said: "Andrea, it doesn't make f**king sense why I'm standing against you... I've made it clear. I did not want to stand against you."
You explained that you knew you could not win this seat, telling Andrea: "We know this. I'm not that f**king stupid," and made it perfectly clear that you knew you were splitting the vote against a conservative you respect purely to fulfill a vendetta at Reform UK against Andrea for not being blackmailed into defecting.
You say that Reform UK is a party for the people, yet you told Andrea: "Reform is what it is but I think it's just going to fold like UKIP, like the Brexit Party." You said of your own volunteers in the constituency, "I wouldn't let some of them knock on doors."
And on the structure of Reform UK as a private company, you explained how you have no control over your candidate Facebook page. "Everything has to go through them. They are literally admin on my Facebook. They watch everything I do." You also explained how you are unable to obtain funding for your campaign, revealing all donations from members goes straight to head office and you have to apply to have funding approved.
Wondering why you wanted to meet and after hearing your concerns and your acceptance that you know you cannot win, Andrea explained how she thought you were a nice guy, and how you both really did not want to split the vote and let in Labour.
Only at this point did Andrea ask you if you would consider doing a video endorsing her to which you replied: "Let me have a think. It sounds like a plan to me."
You even added how you would want to be "suited and booted" and wouldn't want to come across as a "dosser," suggesting you were serious about the idea.
You've since go on social media and insinuated that Andrea asked you to endorse her, omitting to mention all of the above that provides vital context and gives a very clear insight into just what is going on in your "party".
Also you said to me personally that you do not want to become an MP as you earn far more in your Regional Manager role.
Do you dispute or deny anything I have said?
Edited by thetapeworm on Wednesday 26th June 14:34
A look at whether the sums add up on Net zero and NHS spending.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-problem-wi...
Of course the implications are that the other parties tax and spending promises do not add up either. But I am sure we will discover that soon enough.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-problem-wi...
Of course the implications are that the other parties tax and spending promises do not add up either. But I am sure we will discover that soon enough.
JagLover said:
A look at whether the sums add up on Net zero and NHS spending.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-problem-wi...
Of course the implications are that the other parties tax and spending promises do not add up either. But I am sure we will discover that soon enough.
So the £17bn that Reform are promising to spend on the NHS by not not doing Net Zero doesn't actually exist as there there has been no provision made in budgets for Net Zero, so the £17bn would have to come from tax raises.https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-problem-wi...
Of course the implications are that the other parties tax and spending promises do not add up either. But I am sure we will discover that soon enough.
Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bulls
t when anyone looks at the detail.Plenty appear to be falling for it though
smn159 said:
So the £17bn that Reform are promising to spend on the NHS by not not doing Net Zero doesn't actually exist as there there has been no provision made in budgets for Net Zero, so the £17bn would have to come from tax raises.
Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bullst when anyone looks at the detail.
Plenty appear to be falling for it though
I probably agree with you but need a bit of convincing that the other parties are much different.Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bulls
t when anyone looks at the detail.Plenty appear to be falling for it though
.
Mr Penguin said:
https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/refor...
I read this thinking "no point reading beyond the headline because it can't be much worse", then I read it anyway
Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
That is truly terrible. They are awful people. I read this thinking "no point reading beyond the headline because it can't be much worse", then I read it anyway
Article said:
Leslie Lilley, who is set to win almost 20 per cent of the vote in the Labour battleground seat of Southend East & Rochford, made the threats on the official Facebook account he uses to run his local campaign.
In a post in June 2020, Lilley reacted to the news of a small boat arriving in Dover saying: “I hope I’m near one of these scumbags one day I won’t run away I’ll slaughter them then have their family taken out.”
The same month, Lilley, now 70, railed against “more scum entering the UK”, adding “I hope your family get Robbed, Beaten or attacked”.
Are there any Reform candidates left who haven't said something awful?In a post in June 2020, Lilley reacted to the news of a small boat arriving in Dover saying: “I hope I’m near one of these scumbags one day I won’t run away I’ll slaughter them then have their family taken out.”
The same month, Lilley, now 70, railed against “more scum entering the UK”, adding “I hope your family get Robbed, Beaten or attacked”.
Does someone have a spreadsheet to track all this stuff?
Vasco said:
smn159 said:
So the £17bn that Reform are promising to spend on the NHS by not not doing Net Zero doesn't actually exist as there there has been no provision made in budgets for Net Zero, so the £17bn would have to come from tax raises.
Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bullst when anyone looks at the detail.
Plenty appear to be falling for it though
I probably agree with you but need a bit of convincing that the other parties are much different.Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bulls
t when anyone looks at the detail.Plenty appear to be falling for it though
.
Isn't Nigel supposed to 'tell it like it is?"
smn159 said:
Reform are making very specific promises, knowing full well that the money for them doesn't exist. If you have examples of the others doing the same I'm all ears.
Isn't Nigel supposed to 'tell it like it is?"
Reform aren't going have more than a handful (at most) of MPs. Their promises, contracts, manifestos aren't ever going to come under scrutiny. They're aren't event going to get into "official" opposition.Isn't Nigel supposed to 'tell it like it is?"
M.
Digga said:
FYI Poster you are being sniffy about is an OG PHer. Here to steer cars more than votes.
Nasty, petty little snipe that.
Odd... That's exactly how most would describe the actions of Turbobloke. Nasty, petty little snipe that.
Along with delusional.
Sadly he's got a cadre of defenders who'll excuse anything.
smn159 said:
So the £17bn that Reform are promising to spend on the NHS by not not doing Net Zero doesn't actually exist as there there has been no provision made in budgets for Net Zero, so the £17bn would have to come from tax raises.
Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bullst when anyone looks at the detail.
Plenty appear to be falling for it though
Who's falling for what? Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bulls
t when anyone looks at the detail.Plenty appear to be falling for it though
Provision has been made by Labour in terms of their GB Energy budget. Labour has said GB Energy would be headquartered in Scotland so it's not surprising to see commentary from north of the border. GBE would need boosting beyond the initial £8bn proposal though.
Net Zero needs 'far larger' investment than Labour's GB Energy plans
So not surprisingly...
Labour risks breaking debt rule with Net Zero borrowing binge
JagLover said:
A look at whether the sums add up on Net zero and NHS spending.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-problem-wi...
Of course the implications are that the other parties tax and spending promises do not add up either. But I am sure we will discover that soon enough.
it's a big downside with the lack of debate and challenge around the countries finances and what net zero really means.https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-problem-wi...
Of course the implications are that the other parties tax and spending promises do not add up either. But I am sure we will discover that soon enough.
To plug the countries finances, without growth is 120bn a year, to plug the finances and implement net zero it's an additional 220bn a year.
nobody really votes for growth because the no mainstream politician gunning for this election dare touches on the state of the countries finances.
everyone seems to be telling porkie pies!
captain_cynic said:
Digga said:
FYI Poster you are being sniffy about is an OG PHer. Here to steer cars more than votes.
Nasty, petty little snipe that.
Odd... That's exactly how most would describe the actions of Turbobloke. Nasty, petty little snipe that.
Along with delusional.
Sadly he's got a cadre of defenders who'll excuse anything.
smn159 said:
Vasco said:
smn159 said:
So the £17bn that Reform are promising to spend on the NHS by not not doing Net Zero doesn't actually exist as there there has been no provision made in budgets for Net Zero, so the £17bn would have to come from tax raises.
Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bullst when anyone looks at the detail.
Plenty appear to be falling for it though
I probably agree with you but need a bit of convincing that the other parties are much different.Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bulls
t when anyone looks at the detail.Plenty appear to be falling for it though
.
Isn't Nigel supposed to 'tell it like it is?"
smn159 said:
Vasco said:
smn159 said:
So the £17bn that Reform are promising to spend on the NHS by not not doing Net Zero doesn't actually exist as there there has been no provision made in budgets for Net Zero, so the £17bn would have to come from tax raises.
Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bullst when anyone looks at the detail.
Plenty appear to be falling for it though
I probably agree with you but need a bit of convincing that the other parties are much different.Typical Reform modus operandi then - say something which on the face of it sounds plausible to those who don't want to / aren't able to dig any further but are complete bulls
t when anyone looks at the detail.Plenty appear to be falling for it though
.
Isn't Nigel supposed to 'tell it like it is?"
Are they not all promising money that doesn’t exist?
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