General Election July 2024
Discussion
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .egor110 said:
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .The fact that, to the best of my knowledge, not one person on here has supported his position seems to pass him by.
Edited by BigMon on Sunday 30th June 18:50
BigMon said:
egor110 said:
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .The fact that, to the best of my knowledge, not one person on here has supported his position seems to pass him by.
Because there all currently flocking to those social care jobs looking after the elderly aren't they .
Murph7355 said:
Sway said:
Generally, the high tax socialist countries with both staggeringly good public services and happy citizenry, everyone pays a big chunk. There's not really a perspective of 'who can afford to' - everyone chips in a decent percentage of whatever income they've got (yes, there's obviously progressive rates, but in some ways less progressive than what we have).
What sized populations do t hose countries have......?I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
Sway said:
Murph7355 said:
Sway said:
Generally, the high tax socialist countries with both staggeringly good public services and happy citizenry, everyone pays a big chunk. There's not really a perspective of 'who can afford to' - everyone chips in a decent percentage of whatever income they've got (yes, there's obviously progressive rates, but in some ways less progressive than what we have).
What sized populations do t hose countries have......?I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
Successive govts of all colours have actually been proud of how many people they take out of paying tax. Once that bulls
t starts, the type of environment you note is not going to happen.Sway said:
Mostly pretty small. Belgium hasn't got scandi pop density levels though.
I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
Given the belgians are mostly miserable sods, I’d question the ‘happy citizenry’ bit. France I suppose is the poster child for high taxes and good public services that clearly works with a larger population compared to the scandi countries.I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
isaldiri said:
Sway said:
Mostly pretty small. Belgium hasn't got scandi pop density levels though.
I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
Given the belgians are mostly miserable sods, I’d question the ‘happy citizenry’ bit. France I suppose is the poster child for high taxes and good public services that clearly works with a larger population compared to the scandi countries.I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
You either have to pay more tax, or cut the spend.
The French don't seem to happy to do either.
BigMon said:
egor110 said:
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .The fact that, to the best of my knowledge, not one person on here has supported his position seems to pass him by.
Edited by BigMon on Sunday 30th June 18:50
egor110 said:
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .Everyone is educated. Your parents' generation paid for your generation's education, you pay for the next generation's.
As for NHS costs, the overwhelming majority of those costs come in old age. Unless you get very unlucky, costs up to retirement age are minimal, and again they're costs we all have, so you're effectively paying back the previous generation.
The big issue is that since the 1950s the number of working age adults has dropped from 6 per pensioner to below 3 and falling. If you're contributing to that by not having kids, the fact that your wheelie bin is only half full when it's collected it not even close to covering the shortfall.
Rufus Stone said:
Kermit power said:
Depends. Are you happy to have an ever increasing level of immigration?
If you're not, then we need to have more kids here. Maybe if we take some of the extra tax and spend it on education, we'll be able to create a more efficient future workforce from the kids we do have?
Immigration is fine with me. Saves the cost of childrens education and healthcare.If you're not, then we need to have more kids here. Maybe if we take some of the extra tax and spend it on education, we'll be able to create a more efficient future workforce from the kids we do have?
BigMon said:
egor110 said:
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .The fact that, to the best of my knowledge, not one person on here has supported his position seems to pass him by.
Falling birth rates are arguably the biggest single issue facing Western nations in the long term. Sticking your head in the sand won't change that.
egor110 said:
BigMon said:
egor110 said:
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .The fact that, to the best of my knowledge, not one person on here has supported his position seems to pass him by.
Because there all currently flocking to those social care jobs looking after the elderly aren't they .
Have you tried getting a builder lately, or a plumber? Needed to try and find a new dentist or book a GP?
There are loads of areas where we.don't have enough people, and with birth rates falling, retirement age static and life expectancy way up, problems are only going to get worse.
isaldiri said:
Sway said:
Mostly pretty small. Belgium hasn't got scandi pop density levels though.
I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
Given the belgians are mostly miserable sods, I’d question the ‘happy citizenry’ bit. France I suppose is the poster child for high taxes and good public services that clearly works with a larger population compared to the scandi countries.I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
carlo996 said:
BigMon said:
egor110 said:
Kermit power said:
I'd start by removing the tax free lump sum on the pension of anyone retiring before state pension age without having had children. That group is most able to afford it as they've not had kids, and has also most contributed to the ageing population crisis for the same reason.
They'd also use less services , no schooling costs , less nhs costs compared to a family of 4 , produce less rubbish so need less bin collections .The fact that, to the best of my knowledge, not one person on here has supported his position seems to pass him by.
Edited by BigMon on Sunday 30th June 18:50
pingu393 said:
It gets a bit tetchy when the government has to balance the tax and spend, though.
You either have to pay more tax, or cut the spend.
The French don't seem to happy to do either.
Yeah. A mate in France is quite open that he likes the spending but doesn't want the tax and, despite accepting that can't work is strongly opposed to it changing. Not sure how a democracy resolves that.You either have to pay more tax, or cut the spend.
The French don't seem to happy to do either.
Britain's no better though. The IFS say we'll likely need cuts and neither of the two main parties are even commenting on it. Frankly, I blame the media. They should be pointing this stuff out.
https://youtu.be/qi4wLfsSScE?si=Hob1ZSpr-nBdQ49h
Kermit power said:
isaldiri said:
Sway said:
Mostly pretty small. Belgium hasn't got scandi pop density levels though.
I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
Given the belgians are mostly miserable sods, I’d question the ‘happy citizenry’ bit. France I suppose is the poster child for high taxes and good public services that clearly works with a larger population compared to the scandi countries.I do think as a concept it has a lot of merit. If you're going for a high tax/high service environment - then have everyone chipping in, and feeling engaged in the solutions and value for money.
Kermit power said:
You're surely not that incapable of looking ahead? You seriously think the only area we're going to have shortages is in social care???
Have you tried getting a builder lately, or a plumber? Needed to try and find a new dentist or book a GP?
There are loads of areas where we.don't have enough people, and with birth rates falling, retirement age static and life expectancy way up, problems are only going to get worse.
But 850k 16-24 year olds not in work or education. Plenty of people here to a lot of that work if they learn the skills.Have you tried getting a builder lately, or a plumber? Needed to try and find a new dentist or book a GP?
There are loads of areas where we.don't have enough people, and with birth rates falling, retirement age static and life expectancy way up, problems are only going to get worse.
Many of these are global issues and need a wider view - especially doctors who tend to see Canada or Australia as good places to go.
isaldiri said:
Yes that France. The fact they have turned against that prat Macron in a move that was entirely self inflicted doesn’t in any way change that the high taxes and good provision of public services can be done in a country with a significant population.
Havent they had a slap on the wrist for their large deficit and debt?Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff