Scottish Politics / Independence - Vol 12
Discussion
Klippie said:
SNP wiped out..!!!
There must be a lot of happy faces on here this morning...this day has been long coming but it was worth it, I can't wait to hear the excuses from the muppet squad.
Swinney will now be under mega pressure from Labour to call a Scottish election following that landslide.
I think it's quite revealing - and says a lot about our electoral system (for GEs, anyway) - that this scope of change was brought about with an increase in voter share for Labour of just 1.6% and a fall of just 1.3% for the SNP.There must be a lot of happy faces on here this morning...this day has been long coming but it was worth it, I can't wait to hear the excuses from the muppet squad.
Swinney will now be under mega pressure from Labour to call a Scottish election following that landslide.
It might not take much to reverse it. We can't be complacent.
is-uk said:
As a consequence they can make little headway in terms of improving services in health, education, transport or policing that voters would see. That will result in two years of disappointment for Scottish voters if they do not realise and accept that the next Holyrood election is the one that will have the greatest impact upon their daily lives. Will those voters stay the course and continue to support Labour.... or simply revert to normal and punish them for their apparent inaction between now and then?
I'd broadly agree with that, and the above part in particular. It's an unfortunate outcome of the devolved parliaments - local elections are generally ignored as a "protest vote", especially if the party in power at Westminster has a healthy majority.Perhaps Labour will get smart about their messaging on that topic, though I wouldn't bet on it.
dxg said:
I think it's quite revealing - and says a lot about our electoral system (for GEs, anyway) - that this scope of change was brought about with an increase in voter share for Labour of just 1.6% and a fall of just 1.3% for the SNP.
It might not take much to reverse it. We can't be complacent.
Absolutely.It might not take much to reverse it. We can't be complacent.
If Labour overturn the SNP at the next Holyrood elections don't you think they will just get on with the day job of running Scotland.
The polar opposite of what the SNP are currently doing which is deliberately running Scotland into the ground to blame Westminster, division has always been their plan so they can peddle this pathetic independence nonsense.
My constituency (Inverness, Skye & West Ross-shire) won't be available till tomorrow due to "statistical discrepancies".
Beeb news link
I expect midges have bitten into the abaci.
Beeb news link
I expect midges have bitten into the abaci.
Edited by jet_noise on Friday 5th July 13:02
Well, while you, my fellow Scots are celebrating the demise of the Nasty Party, please have some sympathy for this exile in W Yorkshire.
Labour are the party of the moment in the majority of locations. Here, our last MP was Labour as has been the case for many years. So a Labour victory is a given you might think. The Asian population is around 38-40% of the area, Dewsbury and Batley.
Here are my results:
So a 41% vote for an Independent who has come from nowhere. Labour vote drops by 36%. The rest of the votes seem to mirror most other constituencies. Just a little curious given the national result and the last local elections were tainted by missing postal votes and voter fraud plus the same in parliamentary elections, which has existed here for a long time.
Plus the leader of our council had to resign for lying and a Labour councillor was sent to prison:
"Clr Pandor's resignation comes just a week after his judgment was called into question at a full meeting of the council. It was alleged he “wilfully misled” the council over the suspension of Batley East Labour councillor Fazila Loonat, who was jailed this month for lying over a speeding ticket.27 Jul 2023"
Enjoy your 'freedum' up there as I fear more of the same s
te down here. 
Labour are the party of the moment in the majority of locations. Here, our last MP was Labour as has been the case for many years. So a Labour victory is a given you might think. The Asian population is around 38-40% of the area, Dewsbury and Batley.
Here are my results:
So a 41% vote for an Independent who has come from nowhere. Labour vote drops by 36%. The rest of the votes seem to mirror most other constituencies. Just a little curious given the national result and the last local elections were tainted by missing postal votes and voter fraud plus the same in parliamentary elections, which has existed here for a long time.
Plus the leader of our council had to resign for lying and a Labour councillor was sent to prison:
"Clr Pandor's resignation comes just a week after his judgment was called into question at a full meeting of the council. It was alleged he “wilfully misled” the council over the suspension of Batley East Labour councillor Fazila Loonat, who was jailed this month for lying over a speeding ticket.27 Jul 2023"
Enjoy your 'freedum' up there as I fear more of the same s
te down here. dxg said:
I think it's quite revealing - and says a lot about our electoral system (for GEs, anyway) - that this scope of change was brought about with an increase in voter share for Labour of just 1.6% and a fall of just 1.3% for the SNP.
It might not take much to reverse it. We can't be complacent.
Those figures are based on national vote share, yes? That represents nearly a third drop for the SNP, in other words all the soft-Yes and strategic anti-Brexit voters making other choices. I'm not sure the soft-Yesers will be coming back anytime soon. It might not take much to reverse it. We can't be complacent.
I've said for a decade that the SNP need to accept the result of the referendum; I've realised it's time for the electorate to accept the result of the referendum and that the question can only be revisited after a long period of competent governance.
jet_noise said:
My constituency (Inverness, Skye & West Ross-shire) won't be available till tomorrow due to "statistical discrepancies".
Beeb news link
I expect midges have bitten into the abaci.
Probably the counters are too tired to think straight.Beeb news link
I expect midges have bitten into the abaci.
Edited by jet_noise on Friday 5th July 13:02
XCP said:
jet_noise said:
My constituency (Inverness, Skye & West Ross-shire) won't be available till tomorrow due to "statistical discrepancies".
Beeb news link
I expect midges have bitten into the abaci.
Probably the counters are too tired to think straight.Beeb news link
I expect midges have bitten into the abaci.
Edited by jet_noise on Friday 5th July 13:02
is-uk said:
If the SNP were to suddenly find a more charismatic leader with great communication skills in the next 12 months it would be difficult to not rule out a resurgence in support for them sadly. Five years ago pundits were saying Labour were out of power for at least the next two election cycles yet look at todays results. They have won with a huge parliamentary majority that is built on 1 million votes less than Corbyn achieved. They have been aided by the failure of both the Conservatives and SNP as opposed to any real appetite for them as a government with over 2/3rds of the electorate voting for other parties. It is hardly a resounding mandate yet it is enough to let them do what they want.
Fortunately there's no danger of that; John "safe hands" Swinney will steer a steady path onto the same rocks Sturgeon and Humza steered themselves onto with more of the same failed policies but done with less hair. The old guard that made a passable fist of running Scotland 07-14 aren't there anymore.Viper201 said:
Well, while you, my fellow Scots are celebrating the demise of the Nasty Party, please have some sympathy for this exile in W Yorkshire.
Labour are the party of the moment in the majority of locations. Here, our last MP was Labour as has been the case for many years. So a Labour victory is a given you might think. The Asian population is around 38-40% of the area, Dewsbury and Batley.
On your new MPs website it has his key focuses. Number 1 being...Labour are the party of the moment in the majority of locations. Here, our last MP was Labour as has been the case for many years. So a Labour victory is a given you might think. The Asian population is around 38-40% of the area, Dewsbury and Batley.
Iqbal said:
Ceasefire and Peace Agreement in Gaza: Fighting for a ceasefire and a two-state peace agreement.
Yup, that's really his biggest focus as when we've got Russia knocking on the door of NATO and a fooked NHS. He says politics is an act of worship too... If there's one thing more ridiculous than 21st century politics, it's 21st century people talking sincerely about sky fairies.
Of course, maybe he's just being as cynical as any other MP candidate and knows that in his area, "Grrr Palestine, I'm doing an act of worship, here are lots of pictures of bearded Asian men" will get him a nice £91k + expenses + pied a terre job, just as "Grrr foreigners. Here's some pictures of happy white people during rationing" gets the same in Reform constituencies
having trouble reading eyes watering with laughter is-uk said:
It is immensely satisfying to see the SNP being punished.
However, at the risk of sounding like a killjoy, Labour will have the same problem in Government at Westminster with regard to Scotland and making a tangible difference to those voters who want and expect to see an immediate improvement as the Conservatives had. The last Labour government gave away all of the levers they now need to achieve that sort of demonstrable change to the Scottish Parliament. As a consequence they can make little headway in terms of improving services in health, education, transport or policing that voters would see. That will result in two years of disappointment for Scottish voters if they do not realise and accept that the next Holyrood election is the one that will have the greatest impact upon their daily lives. Will those voters stay the course and continue to support Labour.... or simply revert to normal and punish them for their apparent inaction between now and then? It's not a great look for Labour to have to admit there is little they can do for 2 years due to a constitutional change they enacted 25 years ago.
It's the same problem that bedevils local government elections. Many voters simply do not know/cannot see/can't be bothered to understand which level of government has control over policy in the areas that affect their daily lives and so simply use their vote as a punishment tool without considering the ramifications to themselves.
If the SNP were to suddenly find a more charismatic leader with great communication skills in the next 12 months it would be difficult to not rule out a resurgence in support for them sadly. Five years ago pundits were saying Labour were out of power for at least the next two election cycles yet look at todays results. They have won with a huge parliamentary majority that is built on 1 million votes less than Corbyn achieved. They have been aided by the failure of both the Conservatives and SNP as opposed to any real appetite for them as a government with over 2/3rds of the electorate voting for other parties. It is hardly a resounding mandate yet it is enough to let them do what they want.
And how has that worked out for us since the inception of the diddy parliament ? Don't you worry is-uk (independent scotland-uk ? edinburger ? or one of the mental indy loons that is too embarrassed to come on here using their original user name anymore) the next campaign we will see up here will be to get rid of that diddy parliament for good.However, at the risk of sounding like a killjoy, Labour will have the same problem in Government at Westminster with regard to Scotland and making a tangible difference to those voters who want and expect to see an immediate improvement as the Conservatives had. The last Labour government gave away all of the levers they now need to achieve that sort of demonstrable change to the Scottish Parliament. As a consequence they can make little headway in terms of improving services in health, education, transport or policing that voters would see. That will result in two years of disappointment for Scottish voters if they do not realise and accept that the next Holyrood election is the one that will have the greatest impact upon their daily lives. Will those voters stay the course and continue to support Labour.... or simply revert to normal and punish them for their apparent inaction between now and then? It's not a great look for Labour to have to admit there is little they can do for 2 years due to a constitutional change they enacted 25 years ago.
It's the same problem that bedevils local government elections. Many voters simply do not know/cannot see/can't be bothered to understand which level of government has control over policy in the areas that affect their daily lives and so simply use their vote as a punishment tool without considering the ramifications to themselves.
If the SNP were to suddenly find a more charismatic leader with great communication skills in the next 12 months it would be difficult to not rule out a resurgence in support for them sadly. Five years ago pundits were saying Labour were out of power for at least the next two election cycles yet look at todays results. They have won with a huge parliamentary majority that is built on 1 million votes less than Corbyn achieved. They have been aided by the failure of both the Conservatives and SNP as opposed to any real appetite for them as a government with over 2/3rds of the electorate voting for other parties. It is hardly a resounding mandate yet it is enough to let them do what they want.
Given the tough times we live in there has to be a reduction in troughers, sorry representatives, as mentioned above how many people do we need doing their best to not represent us ?
+1 glorified talking shop, P45 the lot, sell off the furniture to the painted ones and flatten the building, build affordable housing on site.
Ugly, impractical, boat shaped floor pan? Too expensive to maintain.
Then have a cost reduction exercise on the local Councillors too, far too many, too expensive.
Then have a cull of the House of Lords, far too many, compulsory retirement at 70. In future make it honorary with no expenses for the majority, they can be Lord in name only with no voting rights, save a fortune but then again MP’s will not vote it in cos they want on the gravy train
Ugly, impractical, boat shaped floor pan? Too expensive to maintain.
Then have a cost reduction exercise on the local Councillors too, far too many, too expensive.
Then have a cull of the House of Lords, far too many, compulsory retirement at 70. In future make it honorary with no expenses for the majority, they can be Lord in name only with no voting rights, save a fortune but then again MP’s will not vote it in cos they want on the gravy train
wc98 said:
And how has that worked out for us since the inception of the diddy parliament ? Don't you worry is-uk (independent scotland-uk ? edinburger ? or one of the mental indy loons that is too embarrassed to come on here using their original user name anymore) the next campaign we will see up here will be to get rid of that diddy parliament for good.
Given the tough times we live in there has to be a reduction in troughers, sorry representatives, as mentioned above how many people do we need doing their best to not represent us ?
I think you have misinterpreted my post by a country mile as you'd see from any posts I've made on the subject on the many chapters of this thread. Given the tough times we live in there has to be a reduction in troughers, sorry representatives, as mentioned above how many people do we need doing their best to not represent us ?
I've been totally against independence since the first devolution vote in the 70's and my user name was from another international forum hence the uk part. I sincerely hope the SNP are done and stay out of power for the next couple of decades. I'd rather not have seen Holyrood opened in the first place. It was of much more use to the people of Scotland when it housed the Scottish & Newcastle brewery. I am merely playing Devil's advocate as the support for the SNP remains stubbornly strong. I am no fan of Labour either as they have stirred grievance politics in Scotland in the central belt for as long as I can remember.
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