Macron calls a national election
Discussion
So Melonis Brothers mob I regularly banged the drum about on here prior to her/their election, because they are the real deal loonies. They have actually ended up being very restrained and pretty centrist. The reality of trying to govern Italy has simply made them like that.
Marine isn’t the real deal. Her dad very much was, but Marine - nah. She has always been far more of a realpolitik girl and used her dads party as a vehicle for political career and has spent 20yrs shifting it ever more to the French centre ground. She took the Farage lessons of Eurosceticism and married them with CMDs “reform” calls, so moving her mob from Frexit to staying in but wanting the EU far more French centric. A position actually that she fairly completely stole, lock stock and Vinny Jones from Mr Bruni!
Take all of that and then add it to the French political system. This is for control of “Parliament” and PM, but not for President. Macron will remain President for now, so “at best” for them it become “Co-habitation” which means she and Bardella get to control domestic French policy, whilst Macron remains in charge overall and direct control of foreign policy and defence. What is more likely is that they want get the majority, so will have to form a coalition govt where they won’t get what they want anyway and still have to kow tow to Macron.
And top of that, they have to govern France. An electorate that is notoriously unforgiving on her domestic politicians.
Ppl forget that Macron was the 2nd coming to save France from the staid, crap, useless traditional French parties. He became a “centrist” version of those parties purely by dint of trying to govern the country from a theoretical centrist position. France suddenly decided it didn’t like modern’ish centrist politics because he tried to change stuff. Mais non! said France.
Just wait till they have to try and govern.
Marine isn’t the real deal. Her dad very much was, but Marine - nah. She has always been far more of a realpolitik girl and used her dads party as a vehicle for political career and has spent 20yrs shifting it ever more to the French centre ground. She took the Farage lessons of Eurosceticism and married them with CMDs “reform” calls, so moving her mob from Frexit to staying in but wanting the EU far more French centric. A position actually that she fairly completely stole, lock stock and Vinny Jones from Mr Bruni!
Take all of that and then add it to the French political system. This is for control of “Parliament” and PM, but not for President. Macron will remain President for now, so “at best” for them it become “Co-habitation” which means she and Bardella get to control domestic French policy, whilst Macron remains in charge overall and direct control of foreign policy and defence. What is more likely is that they want get the majority, so will have to form a coalition govt where they won’t get what they want anyway and still have to kow tow to Macron.
And top of that, they have to govern France. An electorate that is notoriously unforgiving on her domestic politicians.
Ppl forget that Macron was the 2nd coming to save France from the staid, crap, useless traditional French parties. He became a “centrist” version of those parties purely by dint of trying to govern the country from a theoretical centrist position. France suddenly decided it didn’t like modern’ish centrist politics because he tried to change stuff. Mais non! said France.
Just wait till they have to try and govern.
Tom8 said:
Somehow managed to read this despite firewall.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/06/30/...
I am not sure what "far right" means if this is it. Reducing pension age back down to 62 would more likely be considered a left wing policy.
Is unaffordable policy intrinsically left wing? https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/06/30/...
I am not sure what "far right" means if this is it. Reducing pension age back down to 62 would more likely be considered a left wing policy.
BikeBikeBIke said:
President Merkin said:
radical conservatism, ultra nationalism, authortarianism & nativism. All of those are present in RN.
Examples of those policies from RN?Macron's liberal agenda has always been about destroying the country's cultural basics, which used to be shared by most sides of the political spectrum until he started tearing common good sense apart, in order to pave the way for a polarised society where the interest of private and foreign organisations prevail over the national interest. He has always been about splitting France apart by pushing at the top of the agenda topics that no one cares about and vastly irrelevant to how the country is supposed to work. The decision to dissolve the parliament was heavily influenced by private advisors defending foreign interests, and the best opportunity to break French society even further than it already was. Who will be the next prime minister is irrelevant as the goal of Macron and his liberal clique is to run the country down and ultimately weaken the Eurozone.
Mr Penguin said:
President Merkin said:
Lot of far right wingers on here have a problem with the name. Why is that? If you're plainly attracted to the politics, why not own it?
It would help if you said what you think makes someone far right and how it is different to just being right.skwdenyer said:
jshell said:
Just seen the videos of the Far Left rampaging through the streets of France protesting against democratic choice. I'm not sure that the so-called 'Far Right' are the ones to be really worried about!!!
Far Left? Or just opposed to the prospect of Far Right government?
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
Far right = not sharing his views, so that he can just insult them rather than try and have a discussion about things. Wonder why that is?
This is my main contribution to this thread today. I'd say it's light on insults. Yours though is in my favourite right wing genre - the chippy guy with nothing constructive to add. There's loads of you.President Merkin said:
Media is a very easy stick to beat people with. among the right iIn this country, it's regularly trotted out as a signifier of left wing decay yet the print press is overwhelmingly right wing. In that sense, perception is an unreliable measure subject to individua bias. But in general, the characteristics of far rght politics tend to be broadly similar across the world, including but not limited to radical conservatism, ultra nationalism, authortarianism & nativism. All of those are present in RN. Some elements have been toned down over the years for electoral palatability but the label is broadly correct. Same goes for Meloni's Brothers of Italy.
Same defnitely doesn't go for people linking Evening Standard & Telegraph articles & cherry picking stuff like pensions policy. So, it it's people's bag, they ought to have no problem with being called it imo.
Same defnitely doesn't go for people linking Evening Standard & Telegraph articles & cherry picking stuff like pensions policy. So, it it's people's bag, they ought to have no problem with being called it imo.
Edited by President Merkin on Monday 1st July 12:39
isaldiri said:
rdjohn said:
The Netherlands have already shown how this will play out. A centre-left alliance will get together to ensure that the 33%never take office.
That will boost their anger even more for next time.
You do realise that Wilders is forming the major part of the government replacing Rutte as a deal was agreed once Wilders accepted not being PM right?That will boost their anger even more for next time.
We may see the same happening right now in France if Macron's gamble fails.
President Merkin said:
TriumphStag3.0V8 said:
Far right = not sharing his views, so that he can just insult them rather than try and have a discussion about things. Wonder why that is?
This is my main contribution to this thread today. I'd say it's light on insults. Yours though is in my favourite right wing genre - the chippy guy with nothing constructive to add. There's loads of you.President Merkin said:
Media is a very easy stick to beat people with. among the right iIn this country, it's regularly trotted out as a signifier of left wing decay yet the print press is overwhelmingly right wing. In that sense, perception is an unreliable measure subject to individua bias. But in general, the characteristics of far rght politics tend to be broadly similar across the world, including but not limited to radical conservatism, ultra nationalism, authortarianism & nativism. All of those are present in RN. Some elements have been toned down over the years for electoral palatability but the label is broadly correct. Same goes for Meloni's Brothers of Italy.
Same defnitely doesn't go for people linking Evening Standard & Telegraph articles & cherry picking stuff like pensions policy. So, it it's people's bag, they ought to have no problem with being called it imo.
Same defnitely doesn't go for people linking Evening Standard & Telegraph articles & cherry picking stuff like pensions policy. So, it it's people's bag, they ought to have no problem with being called it imo.
Edited by President Merkin on Monday 1st July 12:39
Ok.
remedy said:
So, from that word salad I think what you are saying is that what constitutes far right politics = newspapers.
Ok.
You should talk to the guy wanging on about spell checkers if long words are confusing for you. Anyhoo, away from the hurty right guys crying at their political identity being discussed, it appears candidates are standing down in a co-ordinated effort to thwart RN in round two. We live in interesting times, as the saying goes.Ok.
President Merkin said:
Lot of far right wingers on here have a problem with the name. Why is that? If you're plainly attracted to the politics, why not own it?
If life were the beautiful binary you suggest, maybe. Truth is, it's all relative.
What is regarded as "Far Right" here wouldn't be in the US or Italy.
Equally "Far Left" here, not so much elsewhere.
Would be nice if the denigrating tags and sneers could be dropped, and actual policies discussed rather than worrying about the bogeymen.
As noted, trying to marginalise has exactly the opposite impact you intend.
Yes but here is what is under discussion, hence the difficult to grasp word 'here' in the post you're quoting. If you find the analysis of RN distasteful, then perhaps it's your personal politics that you should question. From my POV, you are merely one more in a long line of old campaigners queuing up in here today to characterise something you would rather wasn't aired publicly as sneeering. As dull as it is wrong. Next.
DeejRC said:
So Melonis Brothers mob I regularly banged the drum about on here prior to her/their election, because they are the real deal loonies. They have actually ended up being very restrained and pretty centrist. The reality of trying to govern Italy has simply made them like that..
That's a very roundabout way of admitting you were wrong 
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