45th President Of The United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 14)

[g4ry13]

CambsBill said:

NRS said:

CambsBill said:

Fiscally? He increased the US national debt by 8 TRILLION Dollars, having promised before the 2016 election that he'd reduce the debt. That's a 40% increase in the gross national debt in a single term. Can the USA afford for him to be president again?

Covid?

In 2017, 2018 & 2019? Nope, I don't think so.

The US has been in debt ever since it was founded and has been going up rather consistently.

From fiscal year 2019 to fiscal year 2021 spending also increased under Trump by about 50% which was largely driven by tax cuts and COVID-19 relief measures.

US national debt is not an issue which is going away any time soon and tbh not really a big problem either.

[skwdenyer]

Mortarboard said:

PinkHouse said:

CambsBill said:

PinkHouse said:

Trump has been better fiscally and on issues of national and international security than Biden and in summary the country was a much better place under his leadership than the current admin. The voters get to decide later this year so all we have to do is wait and see which way they prefer

Fiscally? He increased the US national debt by 8 TRILLION Dollars, having promised before the 2016 election that he'd reduce the debt. That's a 40% increase in the gross national debt in a single term. Can the USA afford for him to be president again?

But conversely every single stock market index fund had a bigger % rise under Trump than Biden, so businesses were doing better. Inflation also rose much higher under Biden than Trump, so everyday consumers were also doing better.

Equally though, trump benefitted from the tail end of the Obama improvements, and Biden inherited the post-covid financial headache.

M.

It is also important to look at the dynamics of legislating and budget-setting in the US. The President doesn’t exist in a vacuum. He can only sign bills that are passed; his powers under executive order are relatively limited; he doesn’t set the budget; and so on. He doesn’t directly control the national debt. Nor does he control interest rates.

[Voldemort]

PinkHouse said:

Since you are such a stickler for detail:
How much in USD did Trump sell highly classified national security info for?
What specific info was sold?
Where was the auction held and via what channels? Who made the eventual purchase?

I don't know.
Why do you think he had dozens of boxes of classified materials removed from the White House?

[Catatafish]

Voldemort said:

PinkHouse said:

Since you are such a stickler for detail:
How much in USD did Trump sell highly classified national security info for?
What specific info was sold?
Where was the auction held and via what channels? Who made the eventual purchase?

I don't know.
Why do you think he had dozens of boxes of classified materials removed from the White House?

The same reason Biden had them lying around his property I suppose.

[hidetheelephants]

Voldemort said:

PinkHouse said:

Since you are such a stickler for detail:
How much in USD did Trump sell highly classified national security info for?
What specific info was sold?
Where was the auction held and via what channels? Who made the eventual purchase?

I don't know.
Why do you think he had dozens of boxes of classified materials removed from the White House?

What persuaded the saudis to give his son in law $2bn to manage despite having no qualification or experience of fund management?

[Byker28i]

PinkHouse said:

LF5335 said:

CharlesdeGaulle said:

Despite thinking that someone living in London/West Sussex, as our pink friend appears to, having a favourable view of Trump is pretty bizarre, I do commend him for sticking around and arguing his case.

I’m not sure he is arguing his case though. He’s avoiding answering any question directly and just coming out with vague responses, such as “I admire some of his personality traits”, but when pressed to explain, he wafts it away with a “what’s the point?” style reply. The comment around the war and international relations as a whole is ridiculously poor. He somehow is arguing that Trump,will play world peacemaker. This is the guy who encouraged Russia to attack US allies, who wants to hand over Ukraine to Russian, the guy who sells highly classified US national security info to the highest bidder.

He can’t be taken seriously and is just another bot, or “Own the libtards” right wing hardman.

That looks like an almighty strawman, there is nowhere on this thread where I've claimed to "Own the libtards". So you can continue your imaginary fight and I simply won't engage. You may think my responses are poor but I won't lose any sleep over your opinion as it's going to have no bearing on the result.

Since you are such a stickler for detail:
How much in USD did Trump sell highly classified national security info for?
What specific info was sold?
Where was the auction held and via what channels? Who made the eventual purchase?

Easy answer there which you know, is that none of that has been disclosed yet, because there's a trial pending.
I think you have to look at the big picture, who would benefit, who were trumps paymasters, simple examples of questions like:

Why did trump hold a private meeting with Putin in Helsinki, take back the interpreters notes and destroy them?
Why did trump tell Russian officials about classified intelligence about Israel secret operations, that led to agents being compromised
Why did trump tel the russians not to retaliate against sanctions because it would all be sorted when he took office in Dec 2016
Why did trump try many times to drop sanctions against Russia, get Russia back into the world leadres meetings etc
Why was trump trying to gift Crimea to Russia
Why did China give trump $10m routed through Egypt to prop up his campaign in the last month of 2016
Why did China loan trump org money for a eastern development, when trump dropped sanctions on ZTE
Why did Saudi pump excessive money into trump through Liv Golf tournaments
Why was trump so keen for Kushner to have a security clearance, when he couldn't pass one normally
Why did Kushner ensure no retaliation was taken over the murder of Khashoggi
Why did Saudi gift Kushner $2bn
Why were China pumping money into a Chinese bank account for trump
Why was trump taking money from foreign govts from the booking of unused rooms at excessive fees in trump hotel

Then the documents.
Why did trump steal them and refuse to give them back, documents including details of Saudi's neighbours capabilities.
Why did trump sort through them when he received the subpoena to hand them back
Why did trump get his lawyers to lie he had no more documents, even though he knew he had over 300 classifed documents, including some at top secret.
Why did trump have an aide start digitising them and copying them onto a laptop and onto a cloud account.
Why did trump obstruct and try to destroy the evidence that he was moving them around.
Where are the boxes trump had Nauta put on his plane and fly to Bedminster?
Why was trump showing off secret documents relating to Iran at Bedminster
Why did trump boast about the US Nuclear submarine fleet capabilities to people without security clearance

Then the current examples of trump willing to sell US policy to anyone that would give him money, big oil companies if they give him $1bn, taking money from Miriam Adelson if he'll support Israel side...

[NRS]

dobbo_ said:

NRS said:

It’s stuff like this that is stupid. We had country closures, massive ballooning of government debt across the world and it’s not to do with Covid? Yet inflation is out of Biden’s hands and nothing to do with him, it’s just something that happens?

You do realize how crazy this sort of claims are? They’re as bad as some of Trump’s ‘facts’. As I said it’s like the polls being ignored before until they show Biden winning. Be consistent, that’s all I ask.

Let me fire it back to you, what was the Covid spending under Trump’s government if it had so little impact? The UK’s debt to GDP jumped from 80 to around 100% under Covid, so a significant debt increase. What was it about the US that caused so little Covid debt there in your opinion?

Calling my comment stupid whilst not even remotely understanding how the deficit ballooned under trump. Bravo!

Have a look, digest, then come back.

First, the original comment was debt, which is not the same thing. But both have been impacted by COVID. So this big jump in debt at the time Covid happened was just a coincidence?



And the big spikes in the deficit were down to COVID, and when Biden came in it was down to his good work it dropped at first, and nothing to do with the economy opening up?



Yes, there was of course his tax breaks too, but Covid played a massive part too. It’s odd everything on the internet about government spending talks about Covid having a big impact but it wasn’t important in the US.

[Byker28i]

thatsprettyshady said:

Snopes finally fact checks “very fine people” lies.

No, Trump Did Not Call Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists 'Very Fine People' - https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-...

And was called out on it, because there's tapes/video of trump saying just that. Why have Snopes just changed that?

[Byker28i]

PinkHouse said:

Thanks it might seem strange but I've got strong American family links in Texas which had quite the influence

SB8, the Republican-backed Texas law that banned abortions in early pregnancy, is associated with a stark increase in infant and newborn deaths, a study published in JAMA Pediatrics found.

Infant deaths in Texas rose by nearly 13% the year after SB8 was passed.
https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/texas-a...

[Byker28i]

Alex Jones bankrupcy trustees plans to shout down and liquidate infowars
https://apnews.com/article/alex-jones-infowars-ban...

[NRS]

Byker28i said:

Easy answer there which you know, is that none of that has been disclosed yet, because there's a trial pending.
I think you have to look at the big picture, who would benefit, who were trumps paymasters, simple examples of questions like:

Why did trump hold a private meeting with Putin in Helsinki, take back the interpreters notes and destroy them?
Why did trump tell Russian officials about classified intelligence about Israel secret operations, that led to agents being compromised
Why did trump tel the russians not to retaliate against sanctions because it would all be sorted when he took office in Dec 2016
Why did trump try many times to drop sanctions against Russia, get Russia back into the world leadres meetings etc
Why was trump trying to gift Crimea to Russia
Why did China give trump $10m routed through Egypt to prop up his campaign in the last month of 2016
Why did China loan trump org money for a eastern development, when trump dropped sanctions on ZTE
Why did Saudi pump excessive money into trump through Liv Golf tournaments
Why was trump so keen for Kushner to have a security clearance, when he couldn't pass one normally
Why did Kushner ensure no retaliation was taken over the murder of Khashoggi
Why did Saudi gift Kushner $2bn
Why were China pumping money into a Chinese bank account for trump
Why was trump taking money from foreign govts from the booking of unused rooms at excessive fees in trump hotel

Then the documents.
Why did trump steal them and refuse to give them back, documents including details of Saudi's neighbours capabilities.
Why did trump sort through them when he received the subpoena to hand them back
Why did trump get his lawyers to lie he had no more documents, even though he knew he had over 300 classifed documents, including some at top secret.
Why did trump have an aide start digitising them and copying them onto a laptop and onto a cloud account.
Why did trump obstruct and try to destroy the evidence that he was moving them around.
Where are the boxes trump had Nauta put on his plane and fly to Bedminster?
Why was trump showing off secret documents relating to Iran at Bedminster
Why did trump boast about the US Nuclear submarine fleet capabilities to people without security clearance

Then the current examples of trump willing to sell US policy to anyone that would give him money, big oil companies if they give him $1bn, taking money from Miriam Adelson if he'll support Israel side...

To be honest some of those could be Trump’s egomania and need to boast about everything/be the biggest most specialist person in the room at all times. Added together with many of the others which are far less easy to explain about his ego though and at best it ‘doesn’t look very good’, to phrase it lightly.

[Byker28i]

Lady Gaga delivers a powerful rebuke to trump,
https://twitter.com/i/status/1805303877496967619


As the Biden campaign releases a new advert showing the many times trump claimed he was the one to kill Roe v Wade.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1805399602574901595

Edited by Byker28i on Tuesday 25th June 06:49

[Byker28i]

NRS said:

Byker28i said:

Easy answer there which you know, is that none of that has been disclosed yet, because there's a trial pending.
I think you have to look at the big picture, who would benefit, who were trumps paymasters, simple examples of questions like:

Why did trump hold a private meeting with Putin in Helsinki, take back the interpreters notes and destroy them?
Why did trump tell Russian officials about classified intelligence about Israel secret operations, that led to agents being compromised
Why did trump tel the russians not to retaliate against sanctions because it would all be sorted when he took office in Dec 2016
Why did trump try many times to drop sanctions against Russia, get Russia back into the world leadres meetings etc
Why was trump trying to gift Crimea to Russia
Why did China give trump $10m routed through Egypt to prop up his campaign in the last month of 2016
Why did China loan trump org money for a eastern development, when trump dropped sanctions on ZTE
Why did Saudi pump excessive money into trump through Liv Golf tournaments
Why was trump so keen for Kushner to have a security clearance, when he couldn't pass one normally
Why did Kushner ensure no retaliation was taken over the murder of Khashoggi
Why did Saudi gift Kushner $2bn
Why were China pumping money into a Chinese bank account for trump
Why was trump taking money from foreign govts from the booking of unused rooms at excessive fees in trump hotel

Then the documents.
Why did trump steal them and refuse to give them back, documents including details of Saudi's neighbours capabilities.
Why did trump sort through them when he received the subpoena to hand them back
Why did trump get his lawyers to lie he had no more documents, even though he knew he had over 300 classifed documents, including some at top secret.
Why did trump have an aide start digitising them and copying them onto a laptop and onto a cloud account.
Why did trump obstruct and try to destroy the evidence that he was moving them around.
Where are the boxes trump had Nauta put on his plane and fly to Bedminster?
Why was trump showing off secret documents relating to Iran at Bedminster
Why did trump boast about the US Nuclear submarine fleet capabilities to people without security clearance

Then the current examples of trump willing to sell US policy to anyone that would give him money, big oil companies if they give him $1bn, taking money from Miriam Adelson if he'll support Israel side...

To be honest some of those could be Trump’s egomania and need to boast about everything/be the biggest most specialist person in the room at all times. Added together with many of the others which are far less easy to explain about his ego though and at best it ‘doesn’t look very good’, to phrase it lightly.

Those were just off my head, just a few examples, without even scratching at the many times trump campaign coordinated with Russia, the russian help in 2016, the foreign money flowing into trump.

A highly compromised person, willing to sell anything for personal profit.

[Byker28i]

Chief Executive Leadership Institute CEO Jeffrey Sonnenfeld says there will not be one Fortune 500 CEO supporting Donald Trump.
"The Trump economic package frightens them. It's extremely inflationary. The Tariffs, 10% across the board on all imports will lead to a 3% increase in inflation and plunging the GDP....."
https://twitter.com/i/status/1805367674446184931

[Byker28i]

Replying to Pinks claim that trump is the more financialluy sound

A new analysis comparing the fiscal records of President Biden against those of trump reveals that trump ran up the national debt twice as much as President Biden.

According to an Axios report, fiscal analysis done by the watchdog group, Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget, discovered that Trump added $8.4 trillion of borrowing over a ten-year period.

By comparison, President Biden has only added $4.3 trillion thus far.

The major differences in spending between the two, is that trump blew $1.9 trillion on his tax cut for the wealthy, while Biden invested over $2.5 trillion in infrastructure, student debt relief, and health care for veterans.
https://www.axios.com/2024/06/24/trump-biden-debt-...

Real benefits for US citizens, not just tax cuts for the rich
https://www.crfb.org/papers/trump-and-biden-nation...



Edit: from https://twitter.com/SteveRattner/status/1805329001...
Trump approved $8.4T of new borrowing during his full term in office: $4.8 trillion excluding COVID relief.
Biden, in his first 3 years in office, approved $4.3T of new borrowing, or $2.2 trillion excluding COVID relief.

Edited by Byker28i on Tuesday 25th June 08:06

Edited by Byker28i on Tuesday 25th June 08:06

[Byker28i]

Walter Ringfield, 27,was arrested for stealing election security equipment in Arizona's Maricopa County. He was a temporary worker for the counties upcoming primaries.

https://ktar.com/story/5577947/maricopa-county-ele...

Meidas Touch, claim to have identified that Ringfield has shut down most of his social media accounts, but posted screenshots of his account on Truth Social, where he has reportedly reposted content "from pro-trump MAGA accounts like The Epoch Times, Gateway Pundit, The Babylon Bee, and Catturd."
https://meidasnews.com/news/individual-who-stole-e...

[Killer2005]

Can't afford bacon

https://x.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1805279711112...

[Byker28i]

Judge Cannon had her hearing yesterday over whether to further gag trump over his claims the FBI tried to assassinate him. She remained skeptical over further gagging trump and gave the prosecuters team until Weds to come back with ore evidence.

Cannon demanded the prosectuion make the connection between trump's rhetoric outside of court and threats faced by law enforcement officials tied to the case.

trumps lawyers defended ttumps false claims as “constitutionally protected campaign speech”
https://edition.cnn.com/politics/live-news/trump-c...


The current thinking is that Cannon will play both sides so she can stay on the case and delay further. She'll deny trump’s motion to dismiss on special counsel appointment and funding, and she’ll deny Jack Smith’s motion to modify bail conditions.

The question remains whether Smith will appeal the denial of his motion to the 11th circuit. A denial would be appealable, which means Cannon will probably do as she did before and deny it without prejudice pending a filing seeking emergency relief or additional briefing or something else that makes it unappealable.

Either way, shes's getting background assistance from somewhere (Federalist Society?) on the best way to delay this trial.

Edited by Byker28i on Tuesday 25th June 07:06

[ScotHill]

thatsprettyshady said:

Snopes finally fact checks “very fine people” lies.

No, Trump Did Not Call Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists 'Very Fine People' - https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-...

Even on the same page you linked to:

“Editors' Note: Some readers have raised the objection that this fact check appears to assume Trump was correct in stating that there were "very fine people on both sides" of the Charlottesville incident. That is not the case. This fact check aimed to confirm what Trump actually said, not whether what he said was true or false. For the record, virtually every source that covered the Unite the Right debacle concluded that it was conceived of, led by and attended by white supremacists, and that therefore Trump was wrong.”

[LF5335]

thatsprettyshady said:

Snopes finally fact checks “very fine people” lies.

No, Trump Did Not Call Neo-Nazis and White Supremacists 'Very Fine People' - https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-...

“Very fine people on both sides” so those actively supporting the white supremacists and Neo-Nazis who organised the Unite the Right rally are “very fine people”. Seems tenuous to me.

Interesting that you’ve jumped on this quickly. What is again that makes you a Trump supporter?