45th President Of The United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 14)

[Mortarboard]

PinkHouse said:

It's certainly an infinitely better situation where world leaders can sit across the table for a discussion than in a proxy war that costs hundreds of thousands of casualties

Do you think he silenced the interpreter because of what he said, or what putin said?

Many Trump supporters I know stopped being Trump supporters after that meeting.

M.

[dvs_dave]

PinkHouse said:

cayman-black said:

Pink this is the anti Trump thread so dont waste your time here.

Unfortunately seems to be that way. As soon as I post the indisputable facts that Trump is ahead in recent election and battleground polls, I get accused of the grave sin of having a 5 year old account which is baffling as I didn't realise that was somehow an insult. I can see why most others have stopped engaging as you can't really have any good discourse here so it's utterly pointless.

So you’re both pro-trump, or do you identify as the more typical “I’m not a fan of trump but…” trump fan?

Either way, what genuine fact based positives do either of you see with trump, and why would he be your choice (if you actually had a vote) for the next POTUS?

[PinkHouse]

paulguitar said:

PinkHouse said:

Trump has been better fiscally and on issues of national and international security than Biden and in summary the country was a much better place under his leadership than the current admin. The voters get to decide later this year so all we have to do is wait and see which way they prefer

I'm concerned that many voters are not well-educated and/or informed enough to understand context. I've had some exchanges with trump supporters on Twitter who don't appear to think beyond 'my gas was cheaper' and 'my heating oil was cheaper'. It would be completely ridiculous to expect any country to be doing better now than pre-pandemic, and the US is relatively doing well.


As far as international security goes, trump was scary. He is beholden to Putin, leading to some very embarrassing scenes. His baiting of Kim Jong Un (another of his heroes) with his 'little rocket man' taunts was so mental that it seems scarcely possible it happened. Like a lot of his presidency, actually.

I echo your concerns and agree the taunting world leaders via tweets is childish, however Kim is doing more missile testing now than at any point during Trump's presidency and the situation in the South China Sea continues to escalate under Biden's admin. Likewise for the situation in Russia/Ukraine, the Middle East not to mention all the militias currently springing up around Central Africa. If the price to pay for a relatively peaceful world is the occasional embarrassing tweet then that's preferable to the current situation

[CambsBill]

PinkHouse said:

Trump has been better fiscally and on issues of national and international security than Biden and in summary the country was a much better place under his leadership than the current admin. The voters get to decide later this year so all we have to do is wait and see which way they prefer

Fiscally? He increased the US national debt by 8 TRILLION Dollars, having promised before the 2016 election that he'd reduce the debt. That's a 40% increase in the gross national debt in a single term. Can the USA afford for him to be president again?

[Countdown]

PinkHouse said:

There are personal traits of his that I like and also traits that I dislike. That goes for his track record too, but it's not going to change any minds here so I don't see the point in sharing my opinion on him

What personal traits of his do you like? I’m genuinely curious as I can’t think of a single facet of his personality that isn’t vile.

[PinkHouse]

dvs_dave said:

PinkHouse said:

cayman-black said:

Pink this is the anti Trump thread so dont waste your time here.

Unfortunately seems to be that way. As soon as I post the indisputable facts that Trump is ahead in recent election and battleground polls, I get accused of the grave sin of having a 5 year old account which is baffling as I didn't realise that was somehow an insult. I can see why most others have stopped engaging as you can't really have any good discourse here so it's utterly pointless.

So you’re both pro-trump, or do you identify as the more typical “I’m not a fan of trump but…” trump fan?

Either way, what genuine fact based positives do either of you see with trump, and why would he be your choice (if you actually had a vote) for the next POTUS?

Oh I'm definitely pro-Trump, the only stipulation I made is that it doesn't mean I agree with every single action of his, which is a similar standard I hold other people to. In terms of fact based positives, the only problem with stating mine is that what might be a fact to me is going to be seen as an opinion by those that disagree so it's just really fruitless, as no minds will be changed here

[Speed 3]

There's an interesting segment on TRIP US podcast on Friday discussing the "blocs" of votes traditionally chased. As the US ages (in existence terms, not population) the thinking of groups traditionally thrown together - Black/Brown/Hispanic are unsurprisingly more nuanced than being a "bloc". More interestingly the generations think very differently. The second and third generation kids of immigrants think more like white folks that have been there several more decades. As we're seeing all over the world, Populists appeal to the young way more than the establishment. Killer fact they quoted - a US hispanic turns 18 every 30 seconds.

I think this illustrates why old/white/male/educated/foreigners/whatever^ find the polls baffling but they do carry weight.


^ delete as appropriate to you

[PinkHouse]

CambsBill said:

PinkHouse said:

Trump has been better fiscally and on issues of national and international security than Biden and in summary the country was a much better place under his leadership than the current admin. The voters get to decide later this year so all we have to do is wait and see which way they prefer

Fiscally? He increased the US national debt by 8 TRILLION Dollars, having promised before the 2016 election that he'd reduce the debt. That's a 40% increase in the gross national debt in a single term. Can the USA afford for him to be president again?

But conversely every single stock market index fund had a bigger % rise under Trump than Biden, so businesses were doing better. Inflation also rose much higher under Biden than Trump, so everyday consumers were also doing better.

[Mortarboard]

PinkHouse said:

CambsBill said:

PinkHouse said:

Trump has been better fiscally and on issues of national and international security than Biden and in summary the country was a much better place under his leadership than the current admin. The voters get to decide later this year so all we have to do is wait and see which way they prefer

Fiscally? He increased the US national debt by 8 TRILLION Dollars, having promised before the 2016 election that he'd reduce the debt. That's a 40% increase in the gross national debt in a single term. Can the USA afford for him to be president again?

But conversely every single stock market index fund had a bigger % rise under Trump than Biden, so businesses were doing better. Inflation also rose much higher under Biden than Trump, so everyday consumers were also doing better.

Equally though, trump benefitted from the tail end of the Obama improvements, and Biden inherited the post-covid financial headache.

M.

[paulguitar]

PinkHouse said:

But conversely every single stock market index fund had a bigger % rise under Trump than Biden, so businesses were doing better. Inflation also rose much higher under Biden than Trump, so everyday consumers were also doing better.

This is exactly the point I was making about context though. By themselves, these stats can be misleading. I could point out that trump lost more jobs than any president in history, but without context that's not very helpful.


Also to quite a large extent, I suspect that many economic ebbs and flows are cyclical, and not affected all that much by who is president. In many ways, a president should be a respectable figurehead with an experienced and solid team behind him. trump is a man with significant mental illness in the form of personality disorders, he's getting more out to lunch by the day, and he intends to put in a team of lackeys.

[CharlesdeGaulle]

Despite thinking that someone living in London/West Sussex, as our pink friend appears to, having a favourable view of Trump is pretty bizarre, I do commend him for sticking around and arguing his case.

[thegreenhell]

No economy operates in a vacuum. Despite what some Americans might think, their economy is affected by global influences, and the policies of individual presidents are reacting to those global influences, especially when there are pandemics and wars during one term and not others. Only a simpleton judges a leader of any country based only on the headline figures without looking at the wider context.

[paulguitar]

I'm back in the UK today, having been in the US for a while.


I saw two visible political statements. One was a house with a 'loony tunes' flag of Biden, like this:







The other was a car driving around from car park to car park, playing loud 'patriotic' music and looking like this.






Aside from that, I didn't see any yard signs or flags. This was in Connecticut.

[CharlesdeGaulle]

paulguitar said:

... The other was a car driving around from car park to car park, playing loud 'patriotic' music and looking like this.




Aside from that, I didn't see any yard signs or flags. This was in Connecticut.

Definitely one for the Council thread.

[ScotHill]

dukeboy749r said:

PinkHouse said:

Unfortunately seems to be that way. As soon as I post the indisputable facts that Trump is ahead in recent election and battleground polls, I get accused of the grave sin of having a 5 year old account which is baffling as I didn't realise that was somehow an insult. I can see why most others have stopped engaging as you can't really have any good discourse here so it's utterly pointless.

You really love teasing...

What's your stage name?

I'd have thought PinkHouse was already a pretty good name for a stripper?

[Mortarboard]

No flags here (yet), but I did see a Nikki Haley bumper sticker the other day.

M.

[InformationSuperHighway]

Mortarboard said:

No flags here (yet), but I did see a Nikki Haley bumper sticker the other day.

M.

Couple of Trump flags have started to appear here (South Orange County, CA) but probably 10% of the volume of them we saw in 2020.

I put it down to it being more controversial than ever to support Trump (But they still do) and lots of people not supporting him any more.

I see the occasional Biden bumper sticker.

[CambsBill]

PinkHouse said:

CambsBill said:

PinkHouse said:

Trump has been better fiscally and on issues of national and international security than Biden and in summary the country was a much better place under his leadership than the current admin. The voters get to decide later this year so all we have to do is wait and see which way they prefer

Fiscally? He increased the US national debt by 8 TRILLION Dollars, having promised before the 2016 election that he'd reduce the debt. That's a 40% increase in the gross national debt in a single term. Can the USA afford for him to be president again?

But conversely every single stock market index fund had a bigger % rise under Trump than Biden, so businesses were doing better. Inflation also rose much higher under Biden than Trump, so everyday consumers were also doing better.

Two minutes of searching shows that to be untrue though - the S&P 500 is showing a higher gain under Biden than under Trump, & the Dow Jones is pretty much even Stevens. Both lag noticeably behind Obama.

https://www.macrotrends.net/2482/sp500-performance...

https://www.macrotrends.net/2481/stock-market-perf...

As others have already pointed out, Presidents have relatively little influence over inflation (or is Biden to blame for the inflation in UK, EU & everywhere else it rose in parallel?).

[LF5335]

CharlesdeGaulle said:

Despite thinking that someone living in London/West Sussex, as our pink friend appears to, having a favourable view of Trump is pretty bizarre, I do commend him for sticking around and arguing his case.

I’m not sure he is arguing his case though. He’s avoiding answering any question directly and just coming out with vague responses, such as “I admire some of his personality traits”, but when pressed to explain, he wafts it away with a “what’s the point?” style reply. The comment around the war and international relations as a whole is ridiculously poor. He somehow is arguing that Trump,will play world peacemaker. This is the guy who encouraged Russia to attack US allies, who wants to hand over Ukraine to Russian, the guy who sells highly classified US national security info to the highest bidder.

He can’t be taken seriously and is just another bot, or “Own the libtards” right wing hardman.

[Mortarboard]

All lot of it is down to "the feelz" rather than reality though.

The debate this week gives biden an opportunity to rectify that, as no matter what his talking point actually is, trump always claims it was "better" under him. Or so "many people say", etc.

M.