Russia Invades Ukraine. Volume 5
Discussion
SlimJim16v said:
Iamnotkloot said:
Possibly too bleak an assessment for my tastes but interesting nonetheless.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/germanys-trage...
Very bleak, as a worst case scenario, but it is what Germany isn't doing. Basically if Trump gets in and walks away from NATO, Europe is potentially fhttps://www.spectator.co.uk/article/germanys-trage...
ked. ked? The central premise, that europe defending itself hinges solely on Germany, is bunkum. As it is Poland will be capable of flattening Russia on its own if they follow through with their defence pledges.rossub said:
bks.
Russia wouldn’t get past Poland.
You haven't read it and it all hinges on Trump not only getting in, but also deciding to leave NATO. Russia would intimate and go for the weak, which is what bullies do, so wouldn't be going in Poland's direction. It is a depressing, but possible worst case scenario. ks.Russia wouldn’t get past Poland.
SlimJim16v said:
rossub said:
bks.
Russia wouldn’t get past Poland.
You haven't read it and it all hinges on Trump not only getting in, but also deciding to leave NATO. Russia would intimate and go for the weak, which is what bullies do, so wouldn't be going in Poland's direction. It is a depressing, but possible worst case scenario. ks.Russia wouldn’t get past Poland.
Iamnotkloot said:
Possibly too bleak an assessment for my tastes but interesting nonetheless.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/germanys-trage...
It's a bit pound shop Tom Clancy.https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/germanys-trage...
That said...
The obvious path is for all NATO nations to get that alliance back on track, starting with fronting up the 2% currently required and not reneging on it.
And then maybe revisiting the amount and what we are defending against.
The answer isn't Europe trying to do its own thing on that front.
Will be interesting to see where the politicians take it.
I found this an interesting little video, just contextualising the home front a little.
There feels to be a slight disparity between his observations on missile attack likelihood and the damaged houses and vehicles everywhere, but I guess that's what being at war for years does to people. I imagine it was very similar in WW2 or in Iraq for most people.
There feels to be a slight disparity between his observations on missile attack likelihood and the damaged houses and vehicles everywhere, but I guess that's what being at war for years does to people. I imagine it was very similar in WW2 or in Iraq for most people.
I've just returned from Lviv, and I can say it's exactly like that. Even when the air raid sirens go off, no-one really takes any notice. The people are living their lives, almost normally. They go shopping, out to restaurants or bars, (until curfew). We didn't have as many warnings as when I was there in the new year, but there were a couple of hits this last week. The first was a drone that was shot down, but still hit a university building. The second hit on Saturday morning and hit an electrical sub-station. These hits are the most annoying for most people as they are the cause of the rolling power cuts.
https://x.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1804786710879...
Serbia supplying weapons via third parties to Ukraine.
Serbia supplying weapons via third parties to Ukraine.
borcy said:
https://x.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1804786710879...
Serbia supplying weapons via third parties to Ukraine.
"vunce ze rockets are up, who cares vare zey come down; zat's not my department" Serbia supplying weapons via third parties to Ukraine.
GliderRider said:
Does anyone else thing of Mephisto, the WW1 German A7v, when they see 'turtle tanks'?
Given how virtually every car in Moscow has a dashcam, it is quite incredible that the turtle tank doesn't have any form of CCTV to give the driver and commander situational awareness.
They remind me of the Sandcrawlers from star wars Given how virtually every car in Moscow has a dashcam, it is quite incredible that the turtle tank doesn't have any form of CCTV to give the driver and commander situational awareness.
Edited by GliderRider on Saturday 22 June 15:39
Aren’t the dash cams just for YouTube likes?
We often watch the Russian driver vids at lunch and I am always struck by how so many accidents on their are completely avoidable. You see someone driving on the wrong side of the road just break, or have a massive head on collision. It’s weird and I think very symbolic of the russian mindset.
ecsrobin said:
Pistom said:
What is being done to start peace talks?
Not going to happen any time soon the last attempt this month Russia said they’d only go to the table after they’ve been given areas of Ukraine. So they've said, we'll talk if you give us parts of Ukraine. What have Ukraine offered instead of that?
It seems to be - we're not giving you that.
Isn't that just going to extend the war?
Both sides need to start somewhere.
Pistom said:
So what that means is - we'll start peace talks if you accept we've got part of Ukraine - that's how peace talks start but the other side needs to come back with a counter offer that at least gives the opponent something even if it's nothing of what Russia is asking for.
So they've said, we'll talk if you give us parts of Ukraine. What have Ukraine offered instead of that?
It seems to be - we're not giving you that.
Isn't that just going to extend the war?
Both sides need to start somewhere.
I suspect Ukraines response was probably fSo they've said, we'll talk if you give us parts of Ukraine. What have Ukraine offered instead of that?
It seems to be - we're not giving you that.
Isn't that just going to extend the war?
Both sides need to start somewhere.
k off out of Ukraine and we will talk. ecsrobin said:
Pistom said:
So what that means is - we'll start peace talks if you accept we've got part of Ukraine - that's how peace talks start but the other side needs to come back with a counter offer that at least gives the opponent something even if it's nothing of what Russia is asking for.
So they've said, we'll talk if you give us parts of Ukraine. What have Ukraine offered instead of that?
It seems to be - we're not giving you that.
Isn't that just going to extend the war?
Both sides need to start somewhere.
I suspect Ukraines response was probably fSo they've said, we'll talk if you give us parts of Ukraine. What have Ukraine offered instead of that?
It seems to be - we're not giving you that.
Isn't that just going to extend the war?
Both sides need to start somewhere.
k off out of Ukraine and we will talk. Ukraine are morally right in telling the Russians where they can stick their terms, but strategically, they can't back it up. At the moment anyway.
The obvious question from that is - will that change?
I hope it does, but I have my doubts.
Like many, i suspect a frozen conflict will be the outcome rather than anything tangible coming from a negotiating table.
Edited by TheJimi on Sunday 23 June 10:53
ecsrobin said:
TheJimi said:
Like many, i suspect a frozen conflict will be the outcome rather than anything tangible coming from a negotiating table.
Agreed. TheJimi said:
Like many, i suspect a frozen conflict will be the outcome rather than anything tangible coming from a negotiating table.
Freezing the conflict in itself would be a tangible outcome if it leads to a lower intensity war where mainly it's fought along the line of conflict rather than going after civilian targets deeper in the country though.....isaldiri said:
TheJimi said:
Like many, i suspect a frozen conflict will be the outcome rather than anything tangible coming from a negotiating table.
Freezing the conflict in itself would be a tangible outcome if it leads to a lower intensity war where mainly it's fought along the line of conflict rather than going after civilian targets deeper in the country though.....Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff