Dispatches - NHS in Crisis
Discussion
Megaflow said:
The irony of having a panel of 5 people, of which only one had anything to do with actual patient care, yet they are all likely to be funded from the health care budget was not lost on me.
Also, can someone tell me why the system has gone to s
t in the last ~10 years. The population of the country has not changed significantly in that time, so in theory at least the physical capacity of the system should be ok, so why is it struggling so much with actual capacity?
It strikes me the problem is not the hospitals, but getting people out of hospital who do not need to be there, but there is nowhere else to put them.
I'd guess we have an ageing population which puts more strains on the NHS and I also feel that we use the NHS more than we used to - a lower barometer of discomfort before visiting and also bloat in the number of services offered. Also, can someone tell me why the system has gone to s
t in the last ~10 years. The population of the country has not changed significantly in that time, so in theory at least the physical capacity of the system should be ok, so why is it struggling so much with actual capacity?It strikes me the problem is not the hospitals, but getting people out of hospital who do not need to be there, but there is nowhere else to put them.
Couple that with below inflation investment (?) and chronic inefficiency.
It's a huge melting pot of significant factors that are going to make it harder and harder to manage over time.
Something drastic needs to happen, and i'm glad it isn't me who has to figure out what it is.
When has the NHS not actually been in a "crisis"?
The whole thing is an utter shambles. Recent experience of it over a 12 month period has confirmed every thought I had about it and more. Amazingly poor coordination, communication, zero leadership, a hell of a lot of the "angels" don't actually care at all.
We had to use a brand new casualty department, new built last year. Spent about 7 hours observing it all. Even that, the design and layout and organisation was appalling. Simple example, the electric door frame created a lip, so when a wheelchair was pushed through the entrance the patient would be tipped out as the wheels caught on it. Everyone had to turn round and carefully reverse in.
The NHS was built in the post war period for a population of 50 million providing essential care.
The same model is now used to provide for 70 million and growing using the same principals albeit now with vastly more expensive care, equipment and drugs.
I will be raising a formal complaint against the trust as it was all so bad.
The whole thing is an utter shambles. Recent experience of it over a 12 month period has confirmed every thought I had about it and more. Amazingly poor coordination, communication, zero leadership, a hell of a lot of the "angels" don't actually care at all.
We had to use a brand new casualty department, new built last year. Spent about 7 hours observing it all. Even that, the design and layout and organisation was appalling. Simple example, the electric door frame created a lip, so when a wheelchair was pushed through the entrance the patient would be tipped out as the wheels caught on it. Everyone had to turn round and carefully reverse in.
The NHS was built in the post war period for a population of 50 million providing essential care.
The same model is now used to provide for 70 million and growing using the same principals albeit now with vastly more expensive care, equipment and drugs.
I will be raising a formal complaint against the trust as it was all so bad.
Megaflow said:
The irony of having a panel of 5 people, of which only one had anything to do with actual patient care, yet they are all likely to be funded from the health care budget was not lost on me.
Also, can someone tell me why the system has gone to st in the last ~10 years. The population of the country has not changed significantly in that time, so in theory at least the physical capacity of the system should be ok, so why is it struggling so much with actual capacity?
It strikes me the problem is not the hospitals, but getting people out of hospital who do not need to be there, but there is nowhere else to put them.
You're not putting ANY blame on the population increase?Also, can someone tell me why the system has gone to s
t in the last ~10 years. The population of the country has not changed significantly in that time, so in theory at least the physical capacity of the system should be ok, so why is it struggling so much with actual capacity?It strikes me the problem is not the hospitals, but getting people out of hospital who do not need to be there, but there is nowhere else to put them.
It's climbed 4-5m in the last 10 years, 10m in the last 20 years. And this doesn't include the 'lost' number.
10 million extra people is the equivalent to 4x Birmingham's population.
Fastchas said:
Megaflow said:
The irony of having a panel of 5 people, of which only one had anything to do with actual patient care, yet they are all likely to be funded from the health care budget was not lost on me.
Also, can someone tell me why the system has gone to st in the last ~10 years. The population of the country has not changed significantly in that time, so in theory at least the physical capacity of the system should be ok, so why is it struggling so much with actual capacity?
It strikes me the problem is not the hospitals, but getting people out of hospital who do not need to be there, but there is nowhere else to put them.
You're not putting ANY blame on the population increase?Also, can someone tell me why the system has gone to s
t in the last ~10 years. The population of the country has not changed significantly in that time, so in theory at least the physical capacity of the system should be ok, so why is it struggling so much with actual capacity?It strikes me the problem is not the hospitals, but getting people out of hospital who do not need to be there, but there is nowhere else to put them.
It's climbed 4-5m in the last 10 years, 10m in the last 20 years. And this doesn't include the 'lost' number.
10 million extra people is the equivalent to 4x Birmingham's population.
ETA: Another thought has just occurred to me. Fit to Sit areas, if you are fit enough to sit in an area for 15 hours, you are fit enough not to be in A&E and should be seeing your GP, which is where I suspect the other half of the problem, along with not being able to discharge people who shouldn't be in hospital, but have nowhere else to go.
Edited by Megaflow on Wednesday 26th June 12:59
It's a combination of a lack of funding (yes even with the increase we are behind similar countries and they are struggling as well) and poor management.
For example short-termism in not keeping up with repair and replacement of estate and equipment leading to things breaking leading to service interruption and higher costs. Happens all the time in the NHS.
Another example, our trust has a special panel scrutinising job appointments, fair enough you woudl think, but it means that when someone leaves (and staff turnover is high) the necessary replacement is delayed and the whole service suffers in the meantime. Other staff get pressured to do more and more people leave etc etc.
For example short-termism in not keeping up with repair and replacement of estate and equipment leading to things breaking leading to service interruption and higher costs. Happens all the time in the NHS.
Another example, our trust has a special panel scrutinising job appointments, fair enough you woudl think, but it means that when someone leaves (and staff turnover is high) the necessary replacement is delayed and the whole service suffers in the meantime. Other staff get pressured to do more and more people leave etc etc.
740EVTORQUES said:
It's a combination of a lack of funding (yes even with the increase we are behind similar countries and they are struggling as well) and poor management.
For example short-termism in not keeping up with repair and replacement of estate and equipment leading to things breaking leading to service interruption and higher costs. Happens all the time in the NHS.
Another example, our trust has a special panel scrutinising job appointments, fair enough you woudl think, but it means that when someone leaves (and staff turnover is high) the necessary replacement is delayed and the whole service suffers in the meantime. Other staff get pressured to do more and more people leave etc etc.
Our trust has this with HR but like for like replacements go through a different panel to others to streamline it a little more. For example short-termism in not keeping up with repair and replacement of estate and equipment leading to things breaking leading to service interruption and higher costs. Happens all the time in the NHS.
Another example, our trust has a special panel scrutinising job appointments, fair enough you woudl think, but it means that when someone leaves (and staff turnover is high) the necessary replacement is delayed and the whole service suffers in the meantime. Other staff get pressured to do more and more people leave etc etc.
Budgets all over the shop for 24/25 since the inflationary budget uplift is less than a quarter of what was expected
I haven't been able to get up the courage to watch the programme yet.
This is because I have direct experience of this. My late mum was admitted to that hospital last year and we spent 14 hours in that room from hell before she got a bed. By the time she got to see a doctor, Mum was in a desperate state I was shaking with frustration and worry.
This is because I have direct experience of this. My late mum was admitted to that hospital last year and we spent 14 hours in that room from hell before she got a bed. By the time she got to see a doctor, Mum was in a desperate state I was shaking with frustration and worry.
Edited by paulguitar on Wednesday 26th June 16:15
Tory legacy 100 billion down the drain, plus 1.4 billion on wasted PPE. NHS in a mess. Yet people still think they do a good job. Dentists can't even get one. Long waiting times for most NHS services. Millions on waiting lists for surgery .Crazy really. All while their pals get richer.
Re dentist
I haven't seen an NHS dentist since before covid. We also moved 150 miles away and had not been able to find a new one locally. Even some of the private ones have waiting lists.
Today I had a phonecall from our old dentist offering both of us an NHS appointment on Monday.
We are going. I did say we had moved out of the area, but they're not bothered.
I haven't seen an NHS dentist since before covid. We also moved 150 miles away and had not been able to find a new one locally. Even some of the private ones have waiting lists.
Today I had a phonecall from our old dentist offering both of us an NHS appointment on Monday.
We are going. I did say we had moved out of the area, but they're not bothered.
Yeh on ph people say they have no issues but that is the head in the sand, loads millions struggling and best thing only a third of population actually goes to the dentist. There is a direct link between poor dental hygiene and depression but nothing ever done. Crazy how st healthcare has got in the last 14 years.
I honestly think the Tory party as syphoned billions of for personal gain, NHS a prime example forcing drugs onto people when loads of alternative therapies. Drug companies pay them off. A few years back found they were paying off Tory MPs. It is no wonder generations hooked on pills.
t healthcare has got in the last 14 years. I honestly think the Tory party as syphoned billions of for personal gain, NHS a prime example forcing drugs onto people when loads of alternative therapies. Drug companies pay them off. A few years back found they were paying off Tory MPs. It is no wonder generations hooked on pills.
Edited by mickythefish on Wednesday 26th June 18:30
mickythefish said:
Tory legacy 100 billion down the drain, plus 1.4 billion on wasted PPE. NHS in a mess. Yet people still think they do a good job. Dentists can't even get one. Long waiting times for most NHS services. Millions on waiting lists for surgery .Crazy really. All while their pals get richer.
It’s a sieve, it doesn’t matter who’s in charge, as you’ll find out quite soon. Tom8 said:
When has the NHS not actually been in a "crisis"?
The whole thing is an utter shambles. Recent experience of it over a 12 month period has confirmed every thought I had about it and more. Amazingly poor coordination, communication, zero leadership, a hell of a lot of the "angels" don't actually care at all.
We had to use a brand new casualty department, new built last year. Spent about 7 hours observing it all. Even that, the design and layout and organisation was appalling. Simple example, the electric door frame created a lip, so when a wheelchair was pushed through the entrance the patient would be tipped out as the wheels caught on it. Everyone had to turn round and carefully reverse in.
The NHS was built in the post war period for a population of 50 million providing essential care.
The same model is now used to provide for 70 million and growing using the same principals albeit now with vastly more expensive care, equipment and drugs.
I will be raising a formal complaint against the trust as it was all so bad.
THIS!The whole thing is an utter shambles. Recent experience of it over a 12 month period has confirmed every thought I had about it and more. Amazingly poor coordination, communication, zero leadership, a hell of a lot of the "angels" don't actually care at all.
We had to use a brand new casualty department, new built last year. Spent about 7 hours observing it all. Even that, the design and layout and organisation was appalling. Simple example, the electric door frame created a lip, so when a wheelchair was pushed through the entrance the patient would be tipped out as the wheels caught on it. Everyone had to turn round and carefully reverse in.
The NHS was built in the post war period for a population of 50 million providing essential care.
The same model is now used to provide for 70 million and growing using the same principals albeit now with vastly more expensive care, equipment and drugs.
I will be raising a formal complaint against the trust as it was all so bad.
Its the closest thing to a religion in the UK
It can NEVER be seen as anything other than "world best" or "run by amazing staff"
When anyone whose had more than a few GP appointments will know its useless most of the time. Staffed by a million "computer says no" types who seem to outnumber the people who give a s
t by 10K to 1! And that's before we even get anywhere near the malpractice! But mention changing the system or introducing any form of health insurance and people assume you mean the USA model.
When what they actually mean is the French or German systems (Small stuff is Private funded either patient or insurance. Big stuff like Cancer is funded by taxation
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