Automotive Vloggers (Vol. 5)
Discussion
RacerMike said:
To an extent oil and coolant is an issue, but closing speed does start to become an issue above a certain speed and having the ability to judge when that is tends to take a bit of experience. Mischa’s biggest issue is he’s at this speed in many cars but hasn’t twigged that the risk level has gone up. Or if he has he’s choosing to ignore it which is even worse.
Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
He is racing so he will gain experience, not everyone is fortunate, talented or wealthy enough to race from an early age.Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
I any case, Nurburgring bad behaviour is encouraged more by these kind of channels imo
honda_exige said:
RacerMike said:
To an extent oil and coolant is an issue, but closing speed does start to become an issue above a certain speed and having the ability to judge when that is tends to take a bit of experience. Mischa’s biggest issue is he’s at this speed in many cars but hasn’t twigged that the risk level has gone up. Or if he has he’s choosing to ignore it which is even worse.
Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
He is racing so he will gain experience, not everyone is fortunate, talented or wealthy enough to race from an early age.Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
I any case, Nurburgring bad behaviour is encouraged more by these kind of channels imo
Fact is, lots of people have made their opinions clear (including just regular locals) and he chooses to ignore them and doesn’t adjust his attitude.
honda_exige said:
RacerMike said:
To an extent oil and coolant is an issue, but closing speed does start to become an issue above a certain speed and having the ability to judge when that is tends to take a bit of experience. Mischa’s biggest issue is he’s at this speed in many cars but hasn’t twigged that the risk level has gone up. Or if he has he’s choosing to ignore it which is even worse.
Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
He is racing so he will gain experience, not everyone is fortunate, talented or wealthy enough to race from an early age.Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
I any case, Nurburgring bad behaviour is encouraged more by these kind of channels imo
RacerMike said:
Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Sounds like that would make for incredibly boring YouTube footage. Edited by RacerMike on Monday 17th June 21:30
Sabine has been mentioned a few times. Did anyone at the time cry about how “dangerous” her driving round a track in a van was or that she was arrogant?
The reason Misha’s channel is popular is the same reason that stunt from Top Gear was popular. It is fun watching someone very experienced at one of the most famous tracks in the world, using that experience to push a variety of cars to the limits. Especially if that includes going faster than more impressive cars.
RacerMike said:
honda_exige said:
Kev_Mk3 said:
The issue is as you say Misha never says it is. From what I see on FB etc he's usually the 1st to condemn poor behaviour on public roads. He also condemns poor driving on the track and behaviour on it, next minute you'll see him diving down the inside or nearly losing it as the tyres are not at temp. This is the issue. People think this is how it is try to copy and fail. Other racing drivers who have won and competed more at the ring than Mischa have even got on the "he is dangerous" train on facebook recently.
That says a lot to me.
That's the thing though, there is no 'inside'. It's 2 lanes, keep right at all times, if you change lanes to take the racing line the onus is on you to make sure the left lane is clear of overtaking traffic. It's not a trackday where overtaking in corners isn't allowed.That says a lot to me.
One last point, the main danger on TF isn't the speed differential, it's oil and coolant spills, even worse because the person crashing on that most of the time really had no way of avoiding it, no matter how careful they are.
You want to make TF safer? Ban cars over 10yrs old and make every car have a TUV inspection dated within the last 6 months, foreign cars included.
Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
Bradley Phillpot put it well on the FB group…in his 4 total seasons or VLN he had one accident where he put down the barrier on slicks in the wet and saw that as a huge failure on his part. Crashing 8 times in the first 6 months of a year….
Edited by RacerMike on Monday 17th June 21:30
Munka01 said:
pWe get it you don't like Misha's driving at the ring, not sure you need t keep going on about it, its not going to change anything. Ridiculous with all that is going on in the world, how upset people get on here over some automotive content.
I mean this is the automotive bloggers thread, so talking about Palestine, Ukraine and the cost of living crisis might be a little off topic Honourable Dead Snark said:
Sabine has been mentioned a few times. Did anyone at the time cry about how “dangerous” her driving round a track in a van was or that she was arrogant?
The reason Misha’s channel is popular is the same reason that stunt from Top Gear was popular. It is fun watching someone very experienced at one of the most famous tracks in the world, using that experience to push a variety of cars to the limits. Especially if that includes going faster than more impressive cars.
I never saw driving of hers that was risky or put others in danger during TF. This is exactly the point people are making….its possible to drive fast and be responsible/set a good example and still make interesting videos or give people a good show. Sabine did that. The reason Misha’s channel is popular is the same reason that stunt from Top Gear was popular. It is fun watching someone very experienced at one of the most famous tracks in the world, using that experience to push a variety of cars to the limits. Especially if that includes going faster than more impressive cars.
RacerMike said:
To an extent oil and coolant is an issue, but closing speed does start to become an issue above a certain speed and having the ability to judge when that is tends to take a bit of experience. Mischa’s biggest issue is he’s at this speed in many cars but hasn’t twigged that the risk level has gone up. Or if he has he’s choosing to ignore it which is even worse.
Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
Bradley Phillpot put it well on the FB group…in his 4 total seasons or VLN he had one accident where he put down the barrier on slicks in the wet and saw that as a huge failure on his part. Crashing 8 times in the first 6 months of a year….
You do realise he has raced in the Nurburgring 24H race twice including a second place in class finish earlier this month, in addition to this he's also raced in the VLN series etc. He's more experienced than most racing drivers in the world when it comes to driving that track. How much more actual racing would he have to do before you think he's qualified enough to drive fast on track and post it on Youtube? Without intentionally gatekeeping, some of this experience comes only from actually racing where you have to be able to judge what other people are doing at high speed. Sounds easy, but it’s a mix of natural ability and experience and it says it all that my mate who’s ex American Lemans series and LeMans in GT2 and LMP1 simply won’t drive fast at the Ring in TF. We went in 2019 and he took his 570S and he just trickled it round. He’d like to learn the track properly but says he’ll only do it on a proper track day or instructional day, and most of that is due to the fact you’re out of options in some traffic situations simply by driving the car close to its abilities.
Me and my friend are not the only people expressing this opinion, and the majority of his accidents in the NLS have been as a result of this behaviour….most memorable of which was the crash he had trying to pass an E36 in the 330i Bilstein car after Adenauer Forst.
Bradley Phillpot put it well on the FB group…in his 4 total seasons or VLN he had one accident where he put down the barrier on slicks in the wet and saw that as a huge failure on his part. Crashing 8 times in the first 6 months of a year….
Edited by RacerMike on Monday 17th June 21:30
If he did drive everything with 20% in reserve (which I agree would be better) then he would just get lots of complaints from the armchair experts that he wasn't going that quick/clearly wasn't as good as people say.
I did the ring taxi with Sabine back in the day. It was one lap and 20 years ago almost but it wasn't scary. Great fun and she was very respectful of others.
The M5 they used I seem to recall they said got new tyres every five laps, new brakes every ten and new suspension every fifty.
I did the ring taxi with Sabine back in the day. It was one lap and 20 years ago almost but it wasn't scary. Great fun and she was very respectful of others.
The M5 they used I seem to recall they said got new tyres every five laps, new brakes every ten and new suspension every fifty.
RacerMike said:
Crashing 8 times in the first 6 months of a year….
Yet his 'fans' seem to think he's some kind of driving god, and that you should just expect to crash regularly if you do lots of laps. I've known several people who've had season passes and never crashed once, but then they weren't uploading their laps to chase clout.jayemm89 said:
If he did drive everything with 20% in reserve (which I agree would be better) then he would just get lots of complaints from the armchair experts that he wasn't going that quick/clearly wasn't as good as people say.
I did the ring taxi with Sabine back in the day. It was one lap and 20 years ago almost but it wasn't scary. Great fun and she was very respectful of others.
The M5 they used I seem to recall they said got new tyres every five laps, new brakes every ten and new suspension every fifty.
I've done numerous Ring Taxi laps, in everything from a 991 GT3 down to the Hyundai. Not one of the drivers took the kind of dumb risks I've seen on his videos. It's just bad driving in the pursuit of attention and clicks.I did the ring taxi with Sabine back in the day. It was one lap and 20 years ago almost but it wasn't scary. Great fun and she was very respectful of others.
The M5 they used I seem to recall they said got new tyres every five laps, new brakes every ten and new suspension every fifty.
PinkHouse said:
You do realise he has raced in the Nurburgring 24H race twice including a second place in class finish earlier this month, in addition to this he's also raced in the VLN series etc. He's more experienced than most racing drivers in the world when it comes to driving that track. How much more actual racing would he have to do before you think he's qualified enough to drive fast on track and post it on Youtube?
Out of interest, how is his pace compared to teammates? I'm not on anyone's side here, just curious. I know he was in a car with a pro and Jimmy Broadbent for this years N24 but I never dug into laptimes. I know Jimmy is a quick guy.
BMW Ring Taxi t
tting it into the barriers after trying to show off
BMW Ring Taxi driving on after a crash, could've been leaking fluids, advice is ALWAYS stop and await recovery.
The Apex GT2 driven by Tim Morley almost wiping out about 10 cars, not driver error but a function of just how fast that car is:
https://youtube.com/shorts/LCLBG3Va1s4?si=H8Uaf3Us...
Sabine illegally overtaking a Motorcycle on the wrong side into a corner while trying to keep ahead of a GT3
Again, I'm not really fussed by any of the above, drive fast, st can go wrong. Possibly the most egregious one is Sabine's - highly illegal, fueled by red mist and had the biker turned in, a very high risk of death. In all of Misha's laps I don't think I've seen him pull a similar stunt.
tting it into the barriers after trying to show offBMW Ring Taxi driving on after a crash, could've been leaking fluids, advice is ALWAYS stop and await recovery.
The Apex GT2 driven by Tim Morley almost wiping out about 10 cars, not driver error but a function of just how fast that car is:
https://youtube.com/shorts/LCLBG3Va1s4?si=H8Uaf3Us...
Sabine illegally overtaking a Motorcycle on the wrong side into a corner while trying to keep ahead of a GT3
Again, I'm not really fussed by any of the above, drive fast, s
t can go wrong. Possibly the most egregious one is Sabine's - highly illegal, fueled by red mist and had the biker turned in, a very high risk of death. In all of Misha's laps I don't think I've seen him pull a similar stunt. jon- said:
Out of interest, how is his pace compared to teammates? I'm not on anyone's side here, just curious.
I know he was in a car with a pro and Jimmy Broadbent for this years N24 but I never dug into laptimes. I know Jimmy is a quick guy.
Someone posted a lap chart on FB that admittedly showed him several seconds a Lap slower but the person had no idea of context, where there yellow flags, traffic etc.I know he was in a car with a pro and Jimmy Broadbent for this years N24 but I never dug into laptimes. I know Jimmy is a quick guy.
In the most recent race Misha overtook the class leader on pace - that car had as one of the drivers Timo Glock - yes that Glock, ex F1 driver, so was a proper outfit.
Dave200 said:
I've done numerous Ring Taxi laps, in everything from a 991 GT3 down to the Hyundai. Not one of the drivers took the kind of dumb risks I've seen on his videos. It's just bad driving in the pursuit of attention and clicks.
I can't remember the source but I do recall reading a great article from a chap who was a committed track day fiend and he said as soon as he stopped measuring lap times he stopped crashing.One of the reasons I stopped doing regular track days is in spite of all the briefings telling people that there's no timing etc etc it's always ignored, and I felt like almost nobody was ever there "for fun".
I've been out with drivers who are as quick as Misha and I would agree the scary bit isn't the speed of the car being driven, it is the proximity and closing speed when dealing with other much slower, more inexperienced traffic. I do not like drivers on track who effectively "bully" others, and I've heard all sorts of BS excuses for it ("Got to let them know you're there") but end of the day it's just bad form
Dave200 said:
So you've found a Ring Taxi crash at a tricky corner from a decade ago, and one example of very bad driving from 12 years ago?
I could probably point to substandard driving for TF in almost every single one of Misha's videos, and he's often posting multiple videos a week.
OK go on then. Post 3 examples of excessively poor standards within the past month. Should be easy. I could probably point to substandard driving for TF in almost every single one of Misha's videos, and he's often posting multiple videos a week.
honda_exige said:
Dave200 said:
So you've found a Ring Taxi crash at a tricky corner from a decade ago, and one example of very bad driving from 12 years ago?
I could probably point to substandard driving for TF in almost every single one of Misha's videos, and he's often posting multiple videos a week.
OK go on then. Post 3 examples of excessively poor standards within the past month. Should be easy. I could probably point to substandard driving for TF in almost every single one of Misha's videos, and he's often posting multiple videos a week.
His laptimes being slower than his teammates lacked "context", but him overtaking a team that included "yes that Timo Glock" was presented as evidence without "context".
I hope you get the money you pledged to his GoFundMe grift back when it fails to meet its goal.
Dave200 said:
honda_exige said:
Dave200 said:
So you've found a Ring Taxi crash at a tricky corner from a decade ago, and one example of very bad driving from 12 years ago?
I could probably point to substandard driving for TF in almost every single one of Misha's videos, and he's often posting multiple videos a week.
OK go on then. Post 3 examples of excessively poor standards within the past month. Should be easy. I could probably point to substandard driving for TF in almost every single one of Misha's videos, and he's often posting multiple videos a week.
His laptimes being slower than his teammates lacked "context", but him overtaking a team that included "yes that Timo Glock" was presented as evidence without "context".
I hope you get the money you pledged to his GoFundMe grift back when it fails to meet its goal.
A lot on here pay for DannyDC2s Patreon? Your payments in part fund some of his on track crashes, is there a difference?
People here happily admit they play MA's raffles, not to win but to support the channel - that will also pay to repair the car(s) he's crashed himself. Is that any different?
Only person I pay for/donate to is Rocket Powered Mohawk on the basis that YT constantly demonetises his output.
No extra context is needed, it was on track, for the lead, on pace in the N24. Is he the best 'amateur' Nurburgring driver? Not even close, is he decent? Yes imo.
Does he sometimes take risks? Yes. Is it excessive? Matter of personal opinion.
His worst move imo was the grass overtake last year, he rightly got criticised and has moderated it since then. Perhaps I'm jaded by TF but I see far worse driving on the regular.
One last point : I've passengered both with Misha and with a 'pro' in an official Taxi - the Taxi was closer to the limit imo and more ruthless with overtakes. So take that as you will.
Edited by honda_exige on Tuesday 18th June 09:31
Gassing Station | TV, Film, Video Streaming & Radio | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff