Audiophiles. Yep we need them

[telecat]

Why Even those with Cheap MP3 players need the Audiophile

http://i.gizmodo.com/5213042/why-we-need-audiophil...

[JustinP1]

What a great article!

This is the bit that I always have to explain to aquintances who wonder how conceptually hi-fi can be 'that good' to spend £20k on it:

"We play my solid 256kbps VBR MP3 of "Heroes" off my iPod; it sounds like st. Free of pops and crackles, yes, but completely lifeless, flat in every way. This is the detail that matters: Audiophiles are basically synesthesiacs. They "see" music in three-dimensional visual space. You close your eyes in Fremer's chair, and you can perceive a detailed 3D matrix of sound, with each element occupying its own special space in the air. It's crazy and I've never experienced anything like it."

When I have had mates around and they wanted a demo they spend the first ten minutes speechless and just getting used to the experience, then they start asking if they can listen to their favourite songs and have them fill the room in the same way.

[Plotloss]

Of course they're neccessary.

I heard what is probably the best stereo and home cinema systems in the world earlier this week, it has entirely recalibrated my ears and outlook towards audio reproduction both two channel and multi-channel.

Such systems would not exist if it wasnt for dedicated engineers searching flawless reproduction.

In short, I'm in love with it all over again.

[JustinP1]

The problem is in the recording and engineering world even though we are a set of perfectionists there is a growing trend of:

"I am going to spend weeks getting the last 5% out of this just for 95% of listeners to compress it down to mp3 - WTF?"

Full steam ahead to where portable storage is cheap enough where you may as well have the audio as CD quality and the mp3 is lost in history like the 8-track or betamax as a blip rather than a trend.

[clonmult]

Plotloss said:

Of course they're neccessary.

I heard what is probably the best stereo and home cinema systems in the world earlier this week, it has entirely recalibrated my ears and outlook towards audio reproduction both two channel and multi-channel.

Such systems would not exist if it wasnt for dedicated engineers searching flawless reproduction.

In short, I'm in love with it all over again.

+1

A few weeks back I connected up my old vinyl kit (Sondek, Electrostatic Headphones, etc) before selling it.

After a few years of listening to music via the iPod I'd totally forgotten just how damn good a decent system can sound.

I could hear damn near everything that the artists put onto the disc. Whereas with an MP3 - not a chance, half of what the artists/musicians/producers put on there gets sucked away.

[telecat]

JustinP1 said:

The problem is in the recording and engineering world even though we are a set of perfectionists there is a growing trend of:

"I am going to spend weeks getting the last 5% out of this just for 95% of listeners to compress it down to mp3 - WTF?"

Full steam ahead to where portable storage is cheap enough where you may as well have the audio as CD quality and the mp3 is lost in history like the 8-track or betamax as a blip rather than a trend.

I rather like the sound of 24/192 PCM stereo audio. Shame there isn't more recorded in that format.

[navier_stokes]

I agree with the above. However I think the article in particular was with an audiophile who basically implied you can't get the same quality of music from digital sources as you can vinyl... which is rubbish, although one may prefer one sound over the other.

Part of the problem is also the artists/producers themselves though... good B&W article about it here, although I think it basically reiterates what has been said before about the "loudness wars".

http://blog.bowers-wilkins.com/lab/?p=132

[RedLeicester]

Plotloss said:

Of course they're neccessary.

I heard what is probably the best stereo and home cinema systems in the world earlier this week, it has entirely recalibrated my ears and outlook towards audio reproduction both two channel and multi-channel.

Such systems would not exist if it wasnt for dedicated engineers searching flawless reproduction.

In short, I'm in love with it all over again.

Where have you been Plotty?

[WZC1]

Plotloss said:

Of course they're neccessary.

I heard what is probably the best stereo and home cinema systems in the world earlier this week, it has entirely recalibrated my ears and outlook towards audio reproduction both two channel and multi-channel.

Keen to hear where you were - with Rob?

Nick

[Plotloss]

WZC1 said:

Plotloss said:

Of course they're neccessary.

I heard what is probably the best stereo and home cinema systems in the world earlier this week, it has entirely recalibrated my ears and outlook towards audio reproduction both two channel and multi-channel.

Keen to hear where you were - with Rob?

Nick

That obvious eh?

If you've not been over yet make haste, its utterly astonishing. Makes everything else I've come into contact with seem dull. Highly recommended.

[RedLeicester]

You ought to come on a trip or two with me Master Plottage.

[WZC1]

Plotloss said:

WZC1 said:

Plotloss said:

Of course they're neccessary.

I heard what is probably the best stereo and home cinema systems in the world earlier this week, it has entirely recalibrated my ears and outlook towards audio reproduction both two channel and multi-channel.

Keen to hear where you were - with Rob?

Nick

That obvious eh?

If you've not been over yet make haste, its utterly astonishing. Makes everything else I've come into contact with seem dull. Highly recommended.

Yeah I am hoping to make the trip down there later this year. Looks amazing.
Nick

[custardkid]

thats why my CD player takes pride of place, and every thing is 'singed' at 912k (does any one know how to get more?) on to the Ipod.

depth and punch are every thing.

a great song is crap if badly produced. a medium song is fantastic song is well produced.

listen to madonna the immaculate collect and you can tell the different producers on the album just from the clarity and production of the tunes!



custard
(can't believe i just admitted to listening to madonna )

[Pooh]

navier_stokes said:

I agree with the above. However I think the article in particular was with an audiophile who basically implied you can't get the same quality of music from digital sources as you can vinyl... which is rubbish,

He did not imply anything of the sort, he said that SACD was very good, his problem is with the sound quality of normal Cds not digital itself.

[Scraggles]

nice article, records are ok for the house, but if want to play music from the pc or streaming radio like shoutcast.com, then there is little choice

[tank slapper]

custardkid said:

thats why my CD player takes pride of place, and every thing is 'singed' at 912k (does any one know how to get more?) on to the Ipod.

You could use the Apple lossless encoder if you don't need to use the files outside of itunes. That will give the same quality as uncompressed audio.

[Ecurie Ecosse]

Flac is also a good lossless format.

I use that through the computer using an audiophile soundcard, butcit is always a joy to use the Sondek - it's like a ceremony taking the record out of the sleeve and starting it up.

I'm getting excited as I will shortly have two more Net Audio Quad 405 power amps so I can tri-amp my Kabers.

[PJR]

Thats a great article. But it has to be said, that Fremer chap is clearly mad. None the less I admire his passion for music. And music in a decent format at that..
Still, he bought into (quite literally) things like silly mains cables that cost more than a good car believing that it makes a difference, when it is not really possible.

The sound of accuracy and the sound of money are not especially the same thing... You'd think that if you wanted to get as close to the sound that the recording engineer intended, then you'd use playback equipment more akin to what a modern sound engineer might use. A sizeable pair of PMC monitors and a hefty Bryston amp perhaps.. Still lots of money, but would likely still cost less than a pair of that nutters speaker cables alone.
Not to mention acoustic treatment for the room.. A couple of crudely tacked up acoustic tiles doesn't really cut it for $350k's worth of audio gear... 'Audiophiles' give very little consideration to the sound of the room itself, and acoustic treatment makes a bigger difference than any amount of expensive boutique cabling ever could.....

P,

[GnuBee]

PJR said:

Thats a great article. But it has to be said, that Fremer chap is clearly mad. None the less I admire his passion for music. And music in a decent format at that..
Still, he bought into (quite literally) things like silly mains cables that cost more than a good car believing that it makes a difference, when it is not really possible.

The sound of accuracy and the sound of money are not especially the same thing... You'd think that if you wanted to get as close to the sound that the recording engineer intended, then you'd use playback equipment more akin to what a modern sound engineer might use. A sizeable pair of PMC monitors and a hefty Bryston amp perhaps.. Still lots of money, but would likely still cost less than a pair of that nutters speaker cables alone.
Not to mention acoustic treatment for the room.. A couple of crudely tacked up acoustic tiles doesn't really cut it for $350k's worth of audio gear... 'Audiophiles' give very little consideration to the sound of the room itself, and acoustic treatment makes a bigger difference than any amount of expensive boutique cabling ever could.....

P,

Have to agree; in fact if you really want to hear it the way the engineer/producer did then hit eBay get yourself some NS10s :-)

[Plotloss]

PJR said:

Not to mention acoustic treatment for the room.. A couple of crudely tacked up acoustic tiles doesn't really cut it for $350k's worth of audio gear... 'Audiophiles' give very little consideration to the sound of the room itself, and acoustic treatment makes a bigger difference than any amount of expensive boutique cabling ever could.....

You try telling that to people though and getting them to believe it, it is nigh on impossible.

As technology advances there are some clever electronic solutions to the room problem, Audessey type products are getting very very good indeed and will even improve the sound quality in a properly acoustically treated room though there will always be requirements for background noise control (the so called NC-17 classification in THX speak) which will require an element of mechanical treatment.