Recommend me a full AV system
Discussion
I'm soon to be moving into a new house, a doer-upper with a lounge of about 5m x 4m and I have about £1750 to spend on a budget AV system. This is what I'm thinking of, please let me know if you have any other recommendations.
TV - Panasonic TH42PZ80 - £750
Sky HD upgrade
DVD - Denon DVD-1940 £150 (I considered blu-ray, but this one plays the DVD-Audio discs I collect)
Amp - Denon AVR-1509 £265
Speakers - Q Acoustics 1010i 5.1 package £411
cables, stands, brackets etc - £150
TV - Panasonic TH42PZ80 - £750
Sky HD upgrade
DVD - Denon DVD-1940 £150 (I considered blu-ray, but this one plays the DVD-Audio discs I collect)
Amp - Denon AVR-1509 £265
Speakers - Q Acoustics 1010i 5.1 package £411
cables, stands, brackets etc - £150
A couple of things I would consider.
Firstly, maybe a PS3 as your disc player. Plays Blu-ray well and is a good upsampling DVD player. I also use it for DVDA playback too. It also plays games, if you are interested in that type of thing. If nothing else I would certainly go for blu-ray. If you like listening to DVDA then blu-ray music is like that and then some!
The other thing is if you are doing it from scratch I would consider going straight to a 7.1 system. Instead of having two rear speakers pointing in from the 'corners' behind you, you have one pair pointing in from the side of the room at ear level, and the second pair behind.
It is good not just for movies but also great for DVDA. With 5.1 I found that a lot of material was 'hard mixed' to the rear speakers and it sound like the audio is coming from the speaker. 7.1 gives the impression that the sound is coming from a circle around you rather than the individual points.
Firstly, maybe a PS3 as your disc player. Plays Blu-ray well and is a good upsampling DVD player. I also use it for DVDA playback too. It also plays games, if you are interested in that type of thing. If nothing else I would certainly go for blu-ray. If you like listening to DVDA then blu-ray music is like that and then some!
The other thing is if you are doing it from scratch I would consider going straight to a 7.1 system. Instead of having two rear speakers pointing in from the 'corners' behind you, you have one pair pointing in from the side of the room at ear level, and the second pair behind.
It is good not just for movies but also great for DVDA. With 5.1 I found that a lot of material was 'hard mixed' to the rear speakers and it sound like the audio is coming from the speaker. 7.1 gives the impression that the sound is coming from a circle around you rather than the individual points.
JustinP1 said:
a PS3 as your disc player. Plays Blu-ray well and is a good upsampling DVD player. I also use it for DVDA playback too. It also plays games, if you are interested in that type of thing. If nothing else I would certainly go for blu-ray. If you like listening to DVDA then blu-ray music is like that and then some!
Didn't know the PS3 played DVD-Audio discs, thought it just did SACD.I haven't got any of either so I have no idea one way or the other, just something I thought I read?
Mr_Yogi said:
JustinP1 said:
a PS3 as your disc player. Plays Blu-ray well and is a good upsampling DVD player. I also use it for DVDA playback too. It also plays games, if you are interested in that type of thing. If nothing else I would certainly go for blu-ray. If you like listening to DVDA then blu-ray music is like that and then some!
Didn't know the PS3 played DVD-Audio discs, thought it just did SACD.I haven't got any of either so I have no idea one way or the other, just something I thought I read?
It is a real real shame DVDA was not pursued. The only titles out there are mostly the back catalogue type issues.
That said, Fleetwood Mac 'Rumours' and the best of Seal sound absolutely awesome. 'Killer' draws you in before literally shaking the room when the bass comes in. The dynamic range really makes a difference.
PS3 is a great suggestion, but according to this site it doesn't support DVD-A
http://www.edepot.com/playstation3.html#PS3_Audio
http://www.edepot.com/playstation3.html#PS3_Audio
garycat said:
PS3 is a great suggestion, but according to this site it doesn't support DVD-A
http://www.edepot.com/playstation3.html#PS3_Audio
"DVD-Audio is not supported in the PS3. However, if the DVD-Audio has a DVD-Video section, the PS3 can play the Dolby Digital, dts Digital Surround, or Linear PCM from it."http://www.edepot.com/playstation3.html#PS3_Audio
All of my DVDAs have a video section, and work very well.
Whitey said:
Is TrueHD worth it with a 5.1 system, or is it necessary to go to 7.1 ? I'm getting itchy about upgrading my amp. I could have the two extra speakers but really don't want them from an asthetic and soundfield point of view (ie where I sit)
The difference in the fidelity between the standard flavour DD and DTS and their HD counterparts is in most practical situations like living rooms with standard kit is quite small.If you have a blu-ray player which takes the HD sound and plays it at full bitrate DD and DTS then this brings the fidelity to practically the HD standard though.
In a recent article reviewers went to both Dolby and DTS to sit in their ultra high end listening rooms to check the difference between this standard and the new HD standards. They found the difference to be almost imperceptible.
I would suggest that it wouldn't be worth buying an amp for the HD sound alone.
However, my experience of the difference between 5.1 and 7.1 is much more worthwhile. As I mentioned before, with 5.1 I found that the surround channels just sounded like they were coming from the speakers. With the two extra speakers it sounds a lot more like a 'surround' soundfield, which is what it is supposed to be. It really makes the difference between sitting in the centre of a soundfield and the sound coming from two points behind you somewhere.
Thanks for your reply JustinP1. I've done a bit of reading up on TrueHD etc here http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/1064
I will be upgrading my receiver in due course combined with redecoration and hiding cables etc. My speakers and sub are pretty good quality, so I should notice a small quality increase. I don't think the compromised listening position I have really warrants adding 2 more speakers, but I will look into this more. Getting suitable matching speakers may be the issue!
cheers
Whitey
I will be upgrading my receiver in due course combined with redecoration and hiding cables etc. My speakers and sub are pretty good quality, so I should notice a small quality increase. I don't think the compromised listening position I have really warrants adding 2 more speakers, but I will look into this more. Getting suitable matching speakers may be the issue!
cheers
Whitey
I would actually say that if your listening position is compromised, for example if the other half won't let your living room become a cinema, that actually gives more of a case for 7.1
With 5.1 if you don't get a lot of space between the rear speakers and your listening position - like less than a few metres, the surround effects don't make a 'rear soundstage' they just sound like they are coming from the speaker. The extra two speakers really help with spreading the sound out to have the same overall 'volume' from the rear speakers but of course this is spread over 4 and not two.
With regard to what is encoded, it is true there is not much material out there with discrete channels for the extra speakers. In those situations where there is no specific channels encoded, your 7.1 amp works out should be there in the DTS or DD format in a similar way that ProLogic works to get surround out of a stereo signal.
The majority of sound content seems to be spread more toward the side speakers than the rears. This is because our hearing is less accurate for sounds directly behind you. For example, for things like a film score, it lifts the soundstage forward if the side speakers are also utilised. More obvious examples are with something like any of the Star Wars films where there is always a spacecraft flying from front to back.
All I can say is I set it up as more of an experiment and was very surprised how much difference it made. When I reworked our lounge and went back to 5.1 I realised how much difference it made and had to rework it again to keep the extra two speakers.
With 5.1 if you don't get a lot of space between the rear speakers and your listening position - like less than a few metres, the surround effects don't make a 'rear soundstage' they just sound like they are coming from the speaker. The extra two speakers really help with spreading the sound out to have the same overall 'volume' from the rear speakers but of course this is spread over 4 and not two.
With regard to what is encoded, it is true there is not much material out there with discrete channels for the extra speakers. In those situations where there is no specific channels encoded, your 7.1 amp works out should be there in the DTS or DD format in a similar way that ProLogic works to get surround out of a stereo signal.
The majority of sound content seems to be spread more toward the side speakers than the rears. This is because our hearing is less accurate for sounds directly behind you. For example, for things like a film score, it lifts the soundstage forward if the side speakers are also utilised. More obvious examples are with something like any of the Star Wars films where there is always a spacecraft flying from front to back.
All I can say is I set it up as more of an experiment and was very surprised how much difference it made. When I reworked our lounge and went back to 5.1 I realised how much difference it made and had to rework it again to keep the extra two speakers.
Cheers JustinP1, don't worry Mrs Whitey does not have a say in the matter! With your comments and what else I have read, I think I will go for 7.1, just need to do some research into two extra matching Mission speakers. My Missions are circa year 2000, front floor standers, centre and rears, with an Rel sub. The room is an ok size at 5 x 4m, but my main viewing position(s) are against the back and side wall, I have mission rears designed to go above high on the back wall, so will look into putting the two extra ones at maybe ear level, about 1.5 metres infront of these.
I'd suggest something totally different - ebay an older, much higher speced amp and dvd player, making sure that dvda is covered well. A good older setup will still annihilate a new fully HD'd up audio system on sound quality, since at the budget you're looking you simply can't get decent amps now that the market expects all this video trickery and extra processing at the same price points.
Also, if you are planning to "do up" the place, spend some time thinking about surround placement / wiring - speakers in the corners etc are not nearly as ideal as proper placement to the sides and about 2 feet behind you. If you're struggling to get the wife acceptance side going, maybe you could go in ceiling for rears - works well and if you're clever, you can run single point stereo in ceilings and make 7.1 with 5 visible speakers (i.e run 2 channels through each stereo in ceiling).
Finally, if dvd-a is your thing, don't use something naff or comprimised as a source - which totally rules out ps3. If HD vision is your thing, plotloss and derestrictor tend to offer good advice, the vision side isn't my forte.
Also, if you are planning to "do up" the place, spend some time thinking about surround placement / wiring - speakers in the corners etc are not nearly as ideal as proper placement to the sides and about 2 feet behind you. If you're struggling to get the wife acceptance side going, maybe you could go in ceiling for rears - works well and if you're clever, you can run single point stereo in ceilings and make 7.1 with 5 visible speakers (i.e run 2 channels through each stereo in ceiling).
Finally, if dvd-a is your thing, don't use something naff or comprimised as a source - which totally rules out ps3. If HD vision is your thing, plotloss and derestrictor tend to offer good advice, the vision side isn't my forte.
I sure can tell the difference between 5.1 and TrueHD it is immense detail clarity and very precise with the right kit. Going on to 7.1 I only know to 2 films on Bluray with this sound track 3.10 to Yuma and Bank Job its gonna take a while to happen with all releases so not a priority IMO
FrankDrebbin said:
I'd suggest something totally different - ebay an older, much higher speced amp and dvd player, making sure that dvda is covered well. A good older setup will still annihilate a new fully HD'd up audio system on sound quality, since at the budget you're looking you simply can't get decent amps now that the market expects all this video trickery and extra processing at the same price points.
Also, if you are planning to "do up" the place, spend some time thinking about surround placement / wiring - speakers in the corners etc are not nearly as ideal as proper placement to the sides and about 2 feet behind you. If you're struggling to get the wife acceptance side going, maybe you could go in ceiling for rears - works well and if you're clever, you can run single point stereo in ceilings and make 7.1 with 5 visible speakers (i.e run 2 channels through each stereo in ceiling).
Finally, if dvd-a is your thing, don't use something naff or comprimised as a source - which totally rules out ps3. If HD vision is your thing, plotloss and derestrictor tend to offer good advice, the vision side isn't my forte.
Thanks. There's no problem with the wife - she is a film fan so any AV upgrade is welcome. The place is a bungalow so running cables shouldn't be a problem provided the walls are plasterboarded with room to run wires behind. I have plans for cat5e, speaker, aerial, projector and satellite sockets so hopefully the installation side is sorted.Also, if you are planning to "do up" the place, spend some time thinking about surround placement / wiring - speakers in the corners etc are not nearly as ideal as proper placement to the sides and about 2 feet behind you. If you're struggling to get the wife acceptance side going, maybe you could go in ceiling for rears - works well and if you're clever, you can run single point stereo in ceilings and make 7.1 with 5 visible speakers (i.e run 2 channels through each stereo in ceiling).
Finally, if dvd-a is your thing, don't use something naff or comprimised as a source - which totally rules out ps3. If HD vision is your thing, plotloss and derestrictor tend to offer good advice, the vision side isn't my forte.
Ebay is a good idea, I'll check out some previous generation AV amps.
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