Any point in upgrading my speakers?
Discussion
Hey all, been a long time since I've had to ask a hifi related question but here we are.
Recently I've bought a new TV and that includes a new TV bench, which isn't as deep as the one I had, which meant the amplifier (a Marantz PM6006UK) I was using to drive my speakers wouldn't fit in the new cabinet, so I went on the look out for a new, more compact amplifier.
I use a NAD D 3020 in my office so I thought straight away about the NAD D 3045. So I bought one, but disappointingly, not only did it not sound any better than my old Marantz / Beresford Caiman II DAC combo, in fact, probably worse, but I also had some issues with the HDMI connection.
So I sent it back, and I spotted another amp, a Marantz Model M1 which was a fair bit more than I was going to pay originally but it looked good, I was attracted to some of the features, and hoped it might represent an upgrade in sound too...
And it does indeed sound REALLY nice. Definitely the best sound I've had yet.
However, I'm now wondering if I should upgrade my speakers.
I'm currently using Monitor Audio Bronze 5 floorstanders, which I bought as a package deal from Richer Sounds with the original Marantz amp, so I'd guess they were picked as they're complimentary to each other.
Honestly I think they sound pretty nice personally, but I'm wondering if it would elevate my enjoyment even more to upgrade the speakers too? One might say that if I'm happy with how they sound, why change? But then I've spent the money now and want to get the most out of my equipment, and with the amp being a noticeable upgrade, I'm wondering if the speakers are now the weak point.
I'd be after some speakers that are either new or second hand, under £1000, suitable for use in a 4x4m room and used in close proximity to the wall / corners. I listen to mainly 80s, trance, techno, a little bit of indie music and use the speakers for my TV and movies.
Am I really going to get an improvement that would warrant spending the money, or should I just stick with the Monitor Audios, as I say, I think they sound pretty damn good, although I did have to bung the bass ports as they sounded too boomy otherwise, but since then, they've been great really.
Recently I've bought a new TV and that includes a new TV bench, which isn't as deep as the one I had, which meant the amplifier (a Marantz PM6006UK) I was using to drive my speakers wouldn't fit in the new cabinet, so I went on the look out for a new, more compact amplifier.
I use a NAD D 3020 in my office so I thought straight away about the NAD D 3045. So I bought one, but disappointingly, not only did it not sound any better than my old Marantz / Beresford Caiman II DAC combo, in fact, probably worse, but I also had some issues with the HDMI connection.
So I sent it back, and I spotted another amp, a Marantz Model M1 which was a fair bit more than I was going to pay originally but it looked good, I was attracted to some of the features, and hoped it might represent an upgrade in sound too...
And it does indeed sound REALLY nice. Definitely the best sound I've had yet.
However, I'm now wondering if I should upgrade my speakers.
I'm currently using Monitor Audio Bronze 5 floorstanders, which I bought as a package deal from Richer Sounds with the original Marantz amp, so I'd guess they were picked as they're complimentary to each other.
Honestly I think they sound pretty nice personally, but I'm wondering if it would elevate my enjoyment even more to upgrade the speakers too? One might say that if I'm happy with how they sound, why change? But then I've spent the money now and want to get the most out of my equipment, and with the amp being a noticeable upgrade, I'm wondering if the speakers are now the weak point.
I'd be after some speakers that are either new or second hand, under £1000, suitable for use in a 4x4m room and used in close proximity to the wall / corners. I listen to mainly 80s, trance, techno, a little bit of indie music and use the speakers for my TV and movies.
Am I really going to get an improvement that would warrant spending the money, or should I just stick with the Monitor Audios, as I say, I think they sound pretty damn good, although I did have to bung the bass ports as they sounded too boomy otherwise, but since then, they've been great really.
toasty said:
Given your taste in music, you're using it for TV and the M1 has a sub output I'd be tempted to add something like a REL T5x sub for some added depth without too much boom.
That's something I might add later if I feel like it, but in the last 5 years, I've always felt the Bronze 5's to have more than enough deep bass. I know they doesn't go as low as a sub, but in general terms, they still make a satisfying rumble 
toasty said:
Given your taste in music, you're using it for TV and the M1 has a sub output I'd be tempted to add something like a REL T5x sub for some added depth without too much boom.
I agree with the above. I guess from your post, your not listening for every nuance in the music. Add a sub, its make that EDM fill out and give your TV viewing some omph!Interesting review here of my current Monitor Audio Bronze 5 speakers, which makes me seriously question if I'm going to get it to sound much better than it already does, if this review is true, they are genuinely fairly good.
https://www.stereotimes.com/post/monitor-audio-bro...
https://www.stereotimes.com/post/monitor-audio-bro...
Earthboundmisfit said:
toasty said:
Given your taste in music, you're using it for TV and the M1 has a sub output I'd be tempted to add something like a REL T5x sub for some added depth without too much boom.
I agree with the above. I guess from your post, your not listening for every nuance in the music. Add a sub, its make that EDM fill out and give your TV viewing some omph!
So I'm not sure she'll be welcoming to it, but also, I don't really have any space to put one really.I'm a fan of the M.A Bronze 5 floorstanders. In 2013, I bought a system from Richer Sounds based around Marantz 6004 CD player and amplifier with a pair of Tannoy Mercury V4 floorstanders. I always found these to bass-rich and in 2016 I replaced them with The Bronze 5s, and have found these much easier, on my ears at least!, in reducing the excessive bass with an overall balance which is lovely.
My Marantz gear would go before the speakers, but as with hi-fi, we take differing routes to getting the best sound quality for our hard-earned....!
My Marantz gear would go before the speakers, but as with hi-fi, we take differing routes to getting the best sound quality for our hard-earned....!
rjfp1962 said:
I'm a fan of the M.A Bronze 5 floorstanders. In 2013, I bought a system from Richer Sounds based around Marantz 6004 CD player and amplifier with a pair of Tannoy Mercury V4 floorstanders. I always found these to bass-rich and in 2016 I replaced them with The Bronze 5s, and have found these much easier, on my ears at least!, in reducing the excessive bass with an overall balance which is lovely.
My Marantz gear would go before the speakers, but as with hi-fi, we take differing routes to getting the best sound quality for our hard-earned....!
Yeah, I do quite rate the Bronze 5's to be fair, and they've truly improved now that I've replaced the amp. I guess I'm only really thinking about it because I had to replace the amp and ended up spending a lot more on the new one than the one it replaced, so naturally you think about speakers if you see what I mean, but I'm seriously questioning whether to bother.My Marantz gear would go before the speakers, but as with hi-fi, we take differing routes to getting the best sound quality for our hard-earned....!
I have a mate with a old Naim Nait + Arcam DAC hooked up to a pair of B&W 805s and I'm not really sure his setup sounds any better than mine really.
miniman said:
It’s all circular isn’t it? Definitely upgrade the speakers. Then the amp. Then the speakers. Then…
aye, that tends to be true, I used to be a serial upgrader at one time but cured myself of it, so if I did then this would definitely be my last upgrade for a while He says...
This has nudged me to looking at some floorstanders. I’m really happy with my QAcoustics 3020s so had a look at reviews of their 5040 and 5050 range at around the £1,000 mark. The (excellent) reviews suggest care with the amplification.
What HiFi helpfully indicate their reference Burmester amp does nicely. At a modest £36,000 I’d bloody hope so!
What HiFi helpfully indicate their reference Burmester amp does nicely. At a modest £36,000 I’d bloody hope so!
The same era MA RS6 floor standers were a real sweet spot in the range, and often available 2nd hand for 300-400ish.
The next range up again is the GS20s, which looked great and sounded better than their list price would suggest (to me at least). See plenty come up for less than £1k on eBay.
There's also the variant of each with more drivers (RS8, GS60) but I'm not convinced that's necessarily better. Still, any should be a noticeable improvement over the already very good, but budget, bronzes.
The next range up again is the GS20s, which looked great and sounded better than their list price would suggest (to me at least). See plenty come up for less than £1k on eBay.
There's also the variant of each with more drivers (RS8, GS60) but I'm not convinced that's necessarily better. Still, any should be a noticeable improvement over the already very good, but budget, bronzes.
miniman said:
This has nudged me to looking at some floorstanders. I’m really happy with my QAcoustics 3020s so had a look at reviews of their 5040 and 5050 range at around the £1,000 mark. The (excellent) reviews suggest care with the amplification.
What HiFi helpfully indicate their reference Burmester amp does nicely. At a modest £36,000 I’d bloody hope so!
The thought of driving a £1k pair of speakers with a £36K amp is hilarious! Only in the hifi world eh? What HiFi helpfully indicate their reference Burmester amp does nicely. At a modest £36,000 I’d bloody hope so!
blindspot said:
The same era MA RS6 floor standers were a real sweet spot in the range, and often available 2nd hand for 300-400ish.
The next range up again is the GS20s, which looked great and sounded better than their list price would suggest (to me at least). See plenty come up for less than £1k on eBay.
There's also the variant of each with more drivers (RS8, GS60) but I'm not convinced that's necessarily better. Still, any should be a noticeable improvement over the already very good, but budget, bronzes.
Thanks for the suggestions The next range up again is the GS20s, which looked great and sounded better than their list price would suggest (to me at least). See plenty come up for less than £1k on eBay.
There's also the variant of each with more drivers (RS8, GS60) but I'm not convinced that's necessarily better. Still, any should be a noticeable improvement over the already very good, but budget, bronzes.
I did read something about the Silver range where it was said they much prefer being away from walls, but I'll do some more reading.I think the bigger variants like the RS8, GS60 are probably overkill for my space.
It all comes down to the minimum speaker impedance, your speakers seem to be 5ohms minimum.
From an amplifier view, it needs to be able to source the current demanded by the speaker. If the amp can't keep up then it will sound awful. I would guess the 2nd amp you tried is better at providing the current.
I bought some Focal speakers with minimum impedance of 2.8ohms and the existing amp really struggled, replaced the amp with a Hegel h190 that is good down to 2ohms and wow!
From an amplifier view, it needs to be able to source the current demanded by the speaker. If the amp can't keep up then it will sound awful. I would guess the 2nd amp you tried is better at providing the current.
I bought some Focal speakers with minimum impedance of 2.8ohms and the existing amp really struggled, replaced the amp with a Hegel h190 that is good down to 2ohms and wow!
markiii said:
Going from MA Silver (which I really liked)!to MA Gold of the same era was a huge improvement.
So I'd stick with MA if you like them
I'm not particularly brand loyal but I've had no complaints really about the MAs. Would definitely consider getting some again from one of the higher range.So I'd stick with MA if you like them
FMOB said:
It all comes down to the minimum speaker impedance, your speakers seem to be 5ohms minimum.
From an amplifier view, it needs to be able to source the current demanded by the speaker. If the amp can't keep up then it will sound awful. I would guess the 2nd amp you tried is better at providing the current.
I bought some Focal speakers with minimum impedance of 2.8ohms and the existing amp really struggled, replaced the amp with a Hegel h190 that is good down to 2ohms and wow!
They've never sounded bad, not sure amp power was really a limiting factor, I would guess that the new amp has a better DAC in it, and better processing. Although my new amp is 100 wpc whereas the NAD 3045 was 60 wpc and the PM6006UK is 40-55 wpc, none of them really struggled to drive the speakers.From an amplifier view, it needs to be able to source the current demanded by the speaker. If the amp can't keep up then it will sound awful. I would guess the 2nd amp you tried is better at providing the current.
I bought some Focal speakers with minimum impedance of 2.8ohms and the existing amp really struggled, replaced the amp with a Hegel h190 that is good down to 2ohms and wow!
I'm quite impressed that an amp the size of a shoe box can output 100 watts per channel though.
TameRacingDriver said:
markiii said:
Going from MA Silver (which I really liked)!to MA Gold of the same era was a huge improvement.
So I'd stick with MA if you like them
I'm not particularly brand loyal but I've had no complaints really about the MAs. Would definitely consider getting some again from one of the higher range.So I'd stick with MA if you like them
FMOB said:
It all comes down to the minimum speaker impedance, your speakers seem to be 5ohms minimum.
From an amplifier view, it needs to be able to source the current demanded by the speaker. If the amp can't keep up then it will sound awful. I would guess the 2nd amp you tried is better at providing the current.
I bought some Focal speakers with minimum impedance of 2.8ohms and the existing amp really struggled, replaced the amp with a Hegel h190 that is good down to 2ohms and wow!
They've never sounded bad, not sure amp power was really a limiting factor, I would guess that the new amp has a better DAC in it, and better processing. Although my new amp is 100 wpc whereas the NAD 3045 was 60 wpc and the PM6006UK is 40-55 wpc, none of them really struggled to drive the speakers.From an amplifier view, it needs to be able to source the current demanded by the speaker. If the amp can't keep up then it will sound awful. I would guess the 2nd amp you tried is better at providing the current.
I bought some Focal speakers with minimum impedance of 2.8ohms and the existing amp really struggled, replaced the amp with a Hegel h190 that is good down to 2ohms and wow!
I'm quite impressed that an amp the size of a shoe box can output 100 watts per channel though.
The 8ohm amps will struggle if you turn the wick up.
Anyway that is a big TV.
Find a shop that will let you demo some speakers at home, so you aren't buying blind.
I wouldn't bother with a sub, as that Marantz amp only has a high pass filter @40hz. So you'd just be getting more bass, rather than handing the bass off to the sub and letting the speakers concentrate on the mids and highs.
I wouldn't bother with a sub, as that Marantz amp only has a high pass filter @40hz. So you'd just be getting more bass, rather than handing the bass off to the sub and letting the speakers concentrate on the mids and highs.
TEKNOPUG said:
Find a shop that will let you demo some speakers at home, so you aren't buying blind.
I wouldn't bother with a sub, as that Marantz amp only has a high pass filter @40hz. So you'd just be getting more bass, rather than handing the bass off to the sub and letting the speakers concentrate on the mids and highs.
Aye that would be a good idea, but I half figured I might get something better second hand, which might be harder work to get demos of. If I decide to go new then I probably will do that.I wouldn't bother with a sub, as that Marantz amp only has a high pass filter @40hz. So you'd just be getting more bass, rather than handing the bass off to the sub and letting the speakers concentrate on the mids and highs.
Aye, probably wont be getting the sub anyway in all honesty, I prefer the idea of speakers that can handle a decent range of frequencies on their own.
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