Replacement for Denon X2200W?
Discussion
My X2200W has now lost its HDMI Monitor 2 output, so my projector doesn't work unless you swap the HDMI cable into HDMI Monitor 1. It has shown signs of being wobbly for ages - total loss of picture until you power cycle the amp - used to happen once per movie. Now its dead (monitor 2 output)
Any pointers on a replacement? It lasted 8 years.
Needs to have dual HDMI outputs, controllable/selectable from Harmony, 6.1, powerful, good with music too. I'd rather it wasn't bigger as I had a custom cabinet made! - though the CD player on top could get moved if I have to.
Not keen on spending £1000 on something that means I dont have to swap an HDMI cable over once in a blue moon for movie nights. I'm also getting the impression that AV amp manufacturers are shifting dual monitor outputs to their higher end (£700+) amps as a differentiator...
Any pointers on a replacement? It lasted 8 years.
Needs to have dual HDMI outputs, controllable/selectable from Harmony, 6.1, powerful, good with music too. I'd rather it wasn't bigger as I had a custom cabinet made! - though the CD player on top could get moved if I have to.
Not keen on spending £1000 on something that means I dont have to swap an HDMI cable over once in a blue moon for movie nights. I'm also getting the impression that AV amp manufacturers are shifting dual monitor outputs to their higher end (£700+) amps as a differentiator...
More of the same. The latest Denon X2800H is £729 at Peter Tyson. They also have the outgoing model (X2700H at £499 while stocks last.) Weigh up whether that meets your needs.
Incidentally, the CD player on top of the amp could be the reason why your HDMI output failed. Denons run hot, and so restricting the airflow is like putting a winter shield over your Griffith rad when you're running in summer. You wouldn't be surprised if that overheated, would you?
Incidentally, the CD player on top of the amp could be the reason why your HDMI output failed. Denons run hot, and so restricting the airflow is like putting a winter shield over your Griffith rad when you're running in summer. You wouldn't be surprised if that overheated, would you?
Cheers, can't quite believe the jump in prices. Missed out on the 2700s but am in touch with Hyperfi who had some , and have more coming in. I really don't weant to spend £699 on a box that doesn't seem to offer anything more to me than I already have. The price of the 2700 is more palatable as a "fix".
Its a shame, I still have a lovely gold 3802 that i only retired due to wanting HDMI switching (loved the musicality of that amp). I think for now I might just live with manually swapping out the projector HDMI cable at movie time.
I MAY.... get a new amp if it's a major jump . I'm currently running Mirage OM9s with matching surrounds and centre (and a B&W 1000W 12" sub) and I'd entertain the idea of spending, say. a grand to £1500 if it was also a big musical jump, as I never felt the AVR X2200W was a patch on the 3802 in terms of musicality.
Not my actual speakers - but the same.
Its a shame, I still have a lovely gold 3802 that i only retired due to wanting HDMI switching (loved the musicality of that amp). I think for now I might just live with manually swapping out the projector HDMI cable at movie time.
I MAY.... get a new amp if it's a major jump . I'm currently running Mirage OM9s with matching surrounds and centre (and a B&W 1000W 12" sub) and I'd entertain the idea of spending, say. a grand to £1500 if it was also a big musical jump, as I never felt the AVR X2200W was a patch on the 3802 in terms of musicality.
Not my actual speakers - but the same.
Lucid - what direction would you point me in for around £1500 ish? / decent stup up from the 2200. Been reading reviews but fairly lost. (I thought I liked the sound of DIRAC Live until I saw it's another $500 on top!!).
Some of the big Marantz stuff looks nice like the SR8015 (can be got for £1500)
Onkyo - are they still a thing?
Sony's latest gets great reviews.
Most of the review sites now just seem to be sponsored...
Yeah, I've gone ffrom cheap/maybe to, f
k it. Lets' go bigger....
Some of the big Marantz stuff looks nice like the SR8015 (can be got for £1500)
Onkyo - are they still a thing?
Sony's latest gets great reviews.
Most of the review sites now just seem to be sponsored...
Yeah, I've gone ffrom cheap/maybe to, f
k it. Lets' go bigger....Edited by Griffith4ever on Monday 22 April 22:42
Lucid will obviously advise, but I'd also suggest reading & / or posting on AV Forums . . .
https://www.avforums.com/forums/av-receivers-ampli...
https://www.avforums.com/forums/av-receivers-ampli...
X3800 or Cinema 50. You can get X6700 from RS for less than £1500, which is a step above the other 2 mentioned, albeit a previous model.
They all have pre-outs that switch off the internal amps, so it gives you the option of connecting a hifi power amp that more suits your musical taste.
They all have pre-outs that switch off the internal amps, so it gives you the option of connecting a hifi power amp that more suits your musical taste.
Edited by TEKNOPUG on Tuesday 23 April 13:17
Cheers. the Marantz SR8015 offers more than the 50 in terms of performance as far as I can tell, more than the 40 in fact. I'm not fussed about advanced features, and I like the idea ofa 6 year warranty - seriously leaning that way, especially for the power. Shame I have nowhere local to audition. Regarding Denon - I feel kind of pissed that my 2200w failed, and I never "loved" it, so am reluctent to "Denon" again for a while, even though the very bland looking X6700 seems to get godo reviews.
Wondering what the Marantz will sound like with music compared to teh Denon.
Wondering what the Marantz will sound like with music compared to teh Denon.
No help at all but I installed a 2800 for a relative in a cupboard the previous owners had kitted out and I was surprised how hot it got.
Due to that I have told them to a) not put anything on top and b) leave the cupboard open when using.
OP - you could get a lower spec twin HDMI receiver and a separate power amp for better musicality if there is room?
Due to that I have told them to a) not put anything on top and b) leave the cupboard open when using.
OP - you could get a lower spec twin HDMI receiver and a separate power amp for better musicality if there is room?
Digger said:
Not the highest spec but has anyone tried one of the slimline Marantz Cinema 70S AVR's?
Sorry for going slightly off tangent OP
If you treat it as a processor and use it to drive a separate power amp then yes. It doesn't get good reviews as a standalone AVR. Has reliability issues (heat due to the form factor). There are better options unless size is the priority.Sorry for going slightly off tangent OP
TEKNOPUG said:
Digger said:
Not the highest spec but has anyone tried one of the slimline Marantz Cinema 70S AVR's?
Sorry for going slightly off tangent OP
If you treat it as a processor and use it to drive a separate power amp then yes. It doesn't get good reviews as a standalone AVR. Has reliability issues (heat due to the form factor). There are better options unless size is the priority.Sorry for going slightly off tangent OP
Griffith4ever said:
Cheers, can't quite believe the jump in prices.
Yeah, it's significant. A few factors; the increase in popularity of higher-end sound bars causing a decline in demand for AVRs. The global silicon shortage. Manufacturing disruption due to COVID. Trade war between US and China putting large Chinese fab' plants on a restricted list. Earthquakes, factory fires, and even the crazy for Bit Coin data mining. The other consideration is the rapidly changing HDMI specs and feature sets. 1080p became 4K, but on top of that 25/30Hz became 60Hz support, then 120Hz for gaming, and of course a couple of variable refresh rate features. Then there's HDR10, HDR10+, Dolby Vision. ARC becoming eARC. Add in the drive for more audio channels to support two or four overhead speakers on top of the 5 or 7 ground channels, dual subs, more advanced room EQ, streaming support, app control, multiroom audio, yadda yadda yadda.
There are quite a few brands that either had a serious wobble or dropped out of making AVRs completely. Pioneer and Onkyo merged, then 18 months later, filed for bankruptcy. (They're sort of sort of emerging from the ashes.) ARCAM became part of Harman International, which was then bought by Samsung(!) Harman stopped making Harman Kardon AV receivers and Lexicon AV processors. They folded some of the tech into ARCAM products. Cambridge Audio, NAD, Sherwood, all no longer in the AVR game; some a while ago, but it all puts pressure on the remaining brands.
Griffith4ever said:
I still have a lovely gold 3802 that i only retired due to wanting HDMI switching (loved the musicality of that amp).
That must have sounded very different from the 3801 I had. Great for movies. Hated it for music. I moved on to pre-power with a TAG AV32r192bp. That was better, but still not a patch on the more basic Roksan. Griffith4ever said:
I never felt the AVR X2200W was a patch on the 3802 in terms of musicality.
The model ranges have shifted around a bit so it's not easy to make a direct comparison, but the 3802 is the historical equivalent of the current X4800 in terms of range positioning. That makes the X2200 look like two models lower, but in reality it's about three pegs down because of Denon shuffling model ranges around. Griffith4ever said:
I MAY.... get a new amp if it's a major jump . I'm currently running Mirage OM9s with matching surrounds and centre (and a B&W 1000W 12" sub) and I'd entertain the idea of spending, say. a grand to £1500 if it was also a big musical jump, as I never felt the AVR X2200W was a patch on the 3802 in terms of musicality.
I'll be honest and tell you that I've never been impressed by Denon AVRs for music. Even the older AVR4000-series /AVC-A1 kind of left me cold. They were better than the new big Pioneers with the Class D amps though until throwing a bunch of MCACC at the sound. Everyone has their own idea of what's right though. Lots of people love B&W speakers. I'm more a Focal fan. If you're going to chuck a wedge of cash at an upgrade amp, then I'd definitely go to the trouble of finding somewhere to audition. You need to her watch the more advanced versions of Audyssey can do for room EQ. DIRAC moves that on much further, particularly for EQing subs. Also consider a MiniDSP just for the sub out channels.
Above all of this though is ventilation. Onkyo offered more features than the rivals but ran hot, and so HDMI boards and DD/DTS processing chips melted their solder. It almost killed the brand reputation in the trade. When Denon pulled the same trick we all looked and went "are you serious?" There's even a small community of people discussing various makes of cooling fans. Marantz is based on the same architecture, but they don't push the envelope quite as much.
Lucid_AV said:
I'll be honest and tell you that I've never been impressed by Denon AVRs for music. Even the older AVR4000-series /AVC-A1 kind of left me cold. They were better than the new big Pioneers with the Class D amps though until throwing a bunch of MCACC at the sound. Everyone has their own idea of what's right though. Lots of people love B&W speakers. I'm more a Focal fan.
If you're going to chuck a wedge of cash at an upgrade amp, then I'd definitely go to the trouble of finding somewhere to audition. You need to her watch the more advanced versions of Audyssey can do for room EQ. DIRAC moves that on much further, particularly for EQing subs. Also consider a MiniDSP just for the sub out channels.
Above all of this though is ventilation. Onkyo offered more features than the rivals but ran hot, and so HDMI boards and DD/DTS processing chips melted their solder. It almost killed the brand reputation in the trade. When Denon pulled the same trick we all looked and went "are you serious?" There's even a small community of people discussing various makes of cooling fans. Marantz is based on the same architecture, but they don't push the envelope quite as much.
I've got/still use a 3803 and it's never been great with music. I did replace it with an ex-display Anthem MRX500 at the start of lockdown as it had a good reputation for being as adept with music as it was with movies, and it certainly was, the ARC room compensation was excellent, then the right channel started going after 18 months so the Denon was resurrected, but with a separate hi-fi system!If you're going to chuck a wedge of cash at an upgrade amp, then I'd definitely go to the trouble of finding somewhere to audition. You need to her watch the more advanced versions of Audyssey can do for room EQ. DIRAC moves that on much further, particularly for EQing subs. Also consider a MiniDSP just for the sub out channels.
Above all of this though is ventilation. Onkyo offered more features than the rivals but ran hot, and so HDMI boards and DD/DTS processing chips melted their solder. It almost killed the brand reputation in the trade. When Denon pulled the same trick we all looked and went "are you serious?" There's even a small community of people discussing various makes of cooling fans. Marantz is based on the same architecture, but they don't push the envelope quite as much.
Anthem stuff is really good but the prices have gone way, way up so it'd be second hand/ex-demo for £1500.
Thanks all, will continue to scratch my chin. Accepted that my CD player will have to go on top of my hifi unit to let whatever lives below breathe properly. I'm wondering if my fond memories of my 3803 are biased as I last heard it in a different house and the room acoustics were perfect. My current place is square with high ceilings...
Watched Dune Part 2 last night on the 2200 and it was superb (less so the movie - I fell asleep towards the end!).
Interesting tsuff from Lucid, thanks.
Watched Dune Part 2 last night on the 2200 and it was superb (less so the movie - I fell asleep towards the end!).
Interesting tsuff from Lucid, thanks.
Regarding the heat problem, a few years ago one of the guys I worked with had to go to a customer's house to do some work (I think it was to calibrate an Anthem AVR).
He found all the equipment in a cupboard, but the customer had cut a small hole in the wall between the cupboard and the kitchen next to it and installed a USB powered fan in the hole (it was one of the flat square ones so it fitted neatly).
Whenever he switched the equipment on, the USB on the Blu-ray player would power the fan and keep the cupboard cool (and also helped to heat the kitchen).
Should also work with units in a rack.
He found all the equipment in a cupboard, but the customer had cut a small hole in the wall between the cupboard and the kitchen next to it and installed a USB powered fan in the hole (it was one of the flat square ones so it fitted neatly).
Whenever he switched the equipment on, the USB on the Blu-ray player would power the fan and keep the cupboard cool (and also helped to heat the kitchen).
Should also work with units in a rack.
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