eARC audio woes with Sony A80J

[Timothy Bucktu]

I have just bought a new Sony A80J
Other equipment...
Xbox one
Nvidia Shield pro
Yamaha RX-V379 (supports 4k60hz passthrough, DTS-HD/True HD but not Atmos. Not eARC, only ARC)

Amp is plugged into HDMI 3 eARC port on the TV. Xbox or Shield tested on the other HDMI 2.1 port
The first dumb thing is that eARC can't pass DTS-HD/True HD to the amp unless the amp is also eARC compatible it seems. What kind of nonsense is this? ARC is perfectly happy playing HD audio when the device is connected directly to the amp.

Second issue is with the TV. I set the audio mode to Dolby Digital plus so I can at least get DTS when the Shield or xbox are connected to the TV. A DTS-HD track will now play and the amp switches to DTS mode...fine I guess.
But when I try and play non-DTS stuff like Netflix with Dolby Digital plus (5.1), I only get audio when I switch the TV to 'Dolby Digital' which only gives me stereo.

Ugh...why is buying new tech so annoying.
How are other people doing things? Do you connect everything to your AV receivers and use that as the hub, or do you connect them to the TV and rely on ARC?

[stevoknevo]

Timothy Bucktu said:

I have just bought a new Sony A80J
Other equipment...
Xbox one
Nvidia Shield pro
Yamaha RX-V379 (supports 4k60hz passthrough, DTS-HD/True HD but not Atmos. Not eARC, only ARC)

Amp is plugged into HDMI 3 eARC port on the TV. Xbox or Shield tested on the other HDMI 2.1 port
The first dumb thing is that eARC can't pass DTS-HD/True HD to the amp unless the amp is also eARC compatible it seems. What kind of nonsense is this? ARC is perfectly happy playing HD audio when the device is connected directly to the amp.

Second issue is with the TV. I set the audio mode to Dolby Digital plus so I can at least get DTS when the Shield or xbox are connected to the TV. A DTS-HD track will now play and the amp switches to DTS mode...fine I guess.
But when I try and play non-DTS stuff like Netflix with Dolby Digital plus (5.1), I only get audio when I switch the TV to 'Dolby Digital' which only gives me stereo.

Ugh...why is buying new tech so annoying.
How are other people doing things? Do you connect everything to your AV receivers and use that as the hub, or do you connect them to the TV and rely on ARC?

All of this carry on moved me away from AV despite being into it since the mid 90s, it's absolutely infuriating - I'd connect everything to your AVR, it's what it's really intended for, then on to the TV.

[Timothy Bucktu]

Yeah it's a nightmare.
Trouble is, unless I upgrade the amp I'll loose Dolby Vision and HDR. Time to save some more pennies I guess.

[Murph7355]

The problem is that the standards aren't really standard.

I had headaches with my Sony AF9 passing through digital streams to my Denon receiver.

You have to make sure the settings are right on the Sony. The final thing for me, however, was making sure the Denon wasn't set to a "fancy" audio mode (theatre/movie/game etc etc). As soon as I switched the receiver to "Pure" in Denon speak, it all finally worked.

Worth looking at the Sony user forum too. Some useful input on there for these sorts of problemIf I had a number of devices to connect I'd do it through the receiver. Fortunately everything I need is built into the TV.

[SwissJonese]

Yep its all a nightmare.

I have a brand new Panasonic OLED TV with Dolby Vision/Atmos + 120hz. I bought a new Panasonic Atmos sound-bar to go with it. However the sound-bar doesn't allow 120hz or Dolby Vision passthrough (like really?). So the Xbox Series X has to use HDMI into the TV, then TV eARC back to the Soundbar. 90% of the time the sound doesn't work especially switching between Dolby Atmos and normal.

Luckily the OLED TV has a very good app system with netflix etc which works perfectly with eARC for Dolby Atmos + Vision.

[stevoknevo]

Timothy Bucktu said:

Yeah it's a nightmare.
Trouble is, unless I upgrade the amp I'll loose Dolby Vision and HDR. Time to save some more pennies I guess.

Ooft, canny be losing HDR for Forza 5 on the Xbox! My last TV was a Sony, 2014 model IIRC, and it was one of very few available that output 5.1 over optical - had to choose between headphone out or AV out I think? Alternatively, HDMI from Xbox to TV and optical out on Xbox to receiver that's the way I'm running the boy's Xbox set-up currently as its a pre-HDMI receiver, however if I take the optical output from the TV to the receiver there's massive sound lag...)
I don't get why ARC needs to be two way, surely it should recognise when it's only going one way and act as an output to a receiver!

And whilst I said HDMI to the receiver is what it was meant for, TV's now do the hub/switching job that was the preserve of the receiver previously...

[Timothy Bucktu]

I connected everything back to the receiver and I'm happy again for now.
No DD Vision or HDR...but to be honest the picture is so amazing I'm not sure how it could be better!

My wish list is now a Sony AV amp which can take advantage of Bravia link and everything 'should' be fine.

I was trying to explain it to my wife...My analogy is:
I've bought a new wizbang Apple iPhone, but I want to use my Android headphones. Although the headphone work, the buttons don't work now, and I can only listen to songs that are played through a basic app.
The solution is to buy some new Apple headphones (Sony AV amp with Bravia link) where both devices speak the same language and will work perfectly together in harmony ...maybe.

I think she gets it, cos I certainly don't

[Lucid_AV]

Timothy Bucktu said:

The first dumb thing is that eARC can't pass DTS-HD/True HD to the amp unless the amp is also eARC compatible it seems. What kind of nonsense is this? ARC is perfectly happy playing HD audio when the device is connected directly to the amp.

BIB ARC doesn't do anything of the sort.

ARC stands for Audio Return Channel. It's simply the sound from the TV and any sources connected directly to the TV. It's an alternative to connecting the TV to the amp via Optical.

Just like Optical, ARC does not support HD Audio, so you can't get "HD audio when ARC is connected directly to the amp" because (a) ARC isn't a standard source input - it's not like your Shield or Xbox - it isn't a full AV source in its own right, and (b) the ARC connection hasn't ever supported HD audio anyway.

eARC is the evolution of ARC to include HD audio, but it's still subject to what the TV will pass. It's also subject to what the sound system will accept. There has to be like-for-like common ground. This is nothing unusual. If your source is 4K UHD but the TV maxes out at 1080p then despite both having HDMI you can't watch 4K UHD content, but you can still view anything up to and including 1080p. Why would it be any different with sound via an eARC-equipped TV in to an ARC equipped amp? You can't play HD audio in to an ARC equipped amp, but you can still play through Dolby Digital with Atmos.

ARC came about because of the desire to have a single cable connection for video monitoring and passing back audio when the TV is the source and for HDMI control. For the most part it works pretty well, even across brands.

The reason you get full HD audio from your sources when connected to the amp is simply because they're connected directly. That's all it is. It is nothing whatsoever to do with ARC or eARC.

Timothy Bucktu said:

Second issue is with the TV. I set the audio mode to Dolby Digital plus so I can at least get DTS when the Shield or xbox are connected to the TV. A DTS-HD track will now play and the amp switches to DTS mode...fine I guess.
But when I try and play non-DTS stuff like Netflix with Dolby Digital plus (5.1), I only get audio when I switch the TV to 'Dolby Digital' which only gives me stereo.

Dolby Digital Plus is so that Atmos sound gets from the TV to an Atmos-compatible audio system. You say your Yamaha doesn't do Atmos, so it might be an idea to switch to just DD / DTS on the TV. It may not make a difference, but removing unknowns is generally a good plan when trying to troubleshoot audio set-up issues.

I don't quite follow the logic that enabling DD+ gives you DTS. They're two different (rival) systems.

The communication via the handshake between the TV and the console or Shield sets a common denominator set of standards. When you're playing something from the Shield with DTS-HD Master Audio, it's the Shield that is sending plain DTS to the TV, and through the TV to the Yamaha. In effect the TV is saying to the Shield "I can only do DTS 5.1 and Dolby Digital 5.1 and PCM audio because the audio pass-thru is via ARC" to which the Shield responds by adjusting its output.

You may find it useful to force the TV to initiate a new HDMI handshake to refresh the common denominators. Holding down the power key on the Sony TV remote whilst it's pointing at the telly will do this I think.

Timothy Bucktu said:

Ugh...why is buying new tech so annoying.
How are other people doing things? Do you connect everything to your AV receivers and use that as the hub, or do you connect them to the TV and rely on ARC?

ARC only gives DD5.1 and (if supported by the particular model of TV) DTS which could be simple stereo or 5.1 depending on the TV manufacturer's whim.

There is a certain simplicity in using ARC, and for some of my customers that's the most important thing. They watch Sky or Virgin which is stereo PCM / DD / DD+ Atmos, and they stream which is mostly still DD/DD+. ARC will take care of all of that.

Unless someone has the money to continually change their AV receiver to keep up with Atmos and DolbyVision 120Hz and 8K and VRR and Imax Enhanced and the next thing and the next thing then some kind of compromise is inevitable. eARC adds the support for the HD audio formats which leaves the TV to deal with resolution, refresh rate and wider dynamic range.

If you're making these purchasing decisions on your own - even with the help of forum advice - then you have to take responsibility for your own choices. Going through a dealer puts that responsibility on their shoulder if you ask them for their recommendations to build you a working system.

Oh, and the idea of buying a Sony AV receiver just to get Bravia Link to work correctly is a bit of a joke. Bravia Link/Sync is just Sony's trade name for CEC; HDMI control. It's also known by Anynet+ (Samsung), Aquos Link (Sharp), Regza Link (Toshiba), EasyLink (Philips) and SimpLink (LG). It's all the same thing.

Edited by Lucid_AV on Wednesday 12th January 06:49

[Tlandcruiser]

There’s input settings within the main menu, change the settings of the hdmi ports to allow dolby play through

[Timothy Bucktu]

Lucid_AV said:

Good advice

Thanks Lucid - you're right. I was annoyed when I first made the post and made some mistakes especially with regards to what ARC can offer. Fact is, the TV really wasn't working as I wanted with my devices connected to it. If I set the TV to output to support up to Dolby Digital plus, the TV would pass DTS down ARC to the amp, brilliant...but then if I switched to a non-DD stereo broadcast, I got no sound. Then sometimes going back to DTS is would work, other times not. It was just being a right pain in the ass.

Now I've had a cup of tea or two and calmed down a bit, I have a setup that works.

Devices are connected to the AV amps HDMI inputs as before, so I now get my 5.1 DTS-HD/True-HD/DTS/DD+/Stereo etc. Downside is that the Shield now only displays up to what the amp is capable of, i.e 4k 60hz (it's dropped the Dolby Vision and 4k HDR options etc) but to be fair...the picture is pretty damn amazing even without HDR (do you even need HDR with OLED?).

I'll be keeping the amp for now as it's a good amp and seems silly to get rid just for the sake of some display format limitations that I might not even make use of. The only reason I liked Bravia is because several years ago I had a Sony TV and Sony amp, and the two just worked perfectly. It was only when I switched to an LG TV that the headache of switching formats and no audio issues started happening.