More 'Audiophile' bullsh*t
Discussion
gmaz said:
"The Loudspeaker Improver works its magic while connected to the negative terminal of a passive speaker."
Speakers receive AC current. there is no "negative".
Speakers often have a red and black terminal so it's easy to confuse this with positive and negative. It's important to get these right, otherwise you can end up with your speakers being out of phase.Speakers receive AC current. there is no "negative".
The improver still sounds like BS though.
TonyRPH said:
Behold The Speaker Improver
Only a couple of paragraphs in and the bulls
t commences...
Given that 99% of stereo listeners have two speakers....
I'm not sure what you're supposed to do with Meridian speakers that have a digital signal fed straight into the cabinet ?Only a couple of paragraphs in and the bulls
t commences...review said:
The Loudspeaker Improver utilizes crystal patterns and paramagnetic piezoelectric properties of natural raw materials, like minerals and gold, to reduce high-frequency noise in the audio signal fed into passive speakers.
Retail: US$1070 a pair. US$535 for a single.Given that 99% of stereo listeners have two speakers....
TonyRPH said:
Retail: US$1070 a pair. US$535 for a single.
Given that 99% of stereo listeners have two speakers....
Since this single terminal component connects a single node in the system, and claims to reduce noise. Exactly how?Given that 99% of stereo listeners have two speakers....
Does the noise collect in the little box?
Or does it inject anti-noise?
Do they offer a second box to empty the noise out of the first box?
This product can also be marketed as a gullibility detector.
Pistom said:
gmaz said:
"The Loudspeaker Improver works its magic while connected to the negative terminal of a passive speaker."
Speakers receive AC current. there is no "negative".
Speakers often have a red and black terminal so it's easy to confuse this with positive and negative. It's important to get these right, otherwise you can end up with your speakers being out of phase.Speakers receive AC current. there is no "negative".
The improver still sounds like BS though.
The gadget looks like a great way to collect RF noise and inject it into your amp.
njw1 said:
It isn't, but if a bit of Van Damme cable is good enough for the live recording of the instrument that you're going to listen to through your hi-fi then I'm struggling to see how hundreds or even thousands of quids worth of interconnects are going to do any better?
And then you listen to a seriously good system one day, and the owner is kind enough to to a demo with various cables, and you then search in your mind for reasons why the expensive sounds so much better than the cheap.
But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
Edited by Tony1963 on Saturday 29th June 14:37
Tony1963 said:
And then you listen to a seriously good system one day, and the owner is kind enough to to a demo with various cables, and you then search in your mind for reasons why the expensive sounds so much better than the cheap.
But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
It shouldn't take too long to search for "I'm imagining it" surely?But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
Edited by Tony1963 on Saturday 29th June 14:37
gmaz said:
"The Loudspeaker Improver works its magic while connected to the negative terminal of a passive speaker."
Speakers receive AC current. there is no "negative".
I never knew that.Speakers receive AC current. there is no "negative".
I am going to wire mine directly to the mains to see if a veil is lifted for my listening pleasure
Tony1963 said:
And then you listen to a seriously good system one day, and the owner is kind enough to to a demo with various cables, and you then search in your mind for reasons why the expensive sounds so much better than the cheap.
But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
It’s more that some of us understand confirmation bias, and physics.But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
Edited by Tony1963 on Saturday 29th June 14:37
Do you understand confirmation bias, and physics?
911hope said:
OutInTheShed said:
The black terminal is classically a ground or return, but in a bridge amp it's an inverted or 'negative' version of the red output.
The gadget looks like a great way to collect RF noise and inject it into your amp.
Doesn't sound plausible. Please explain.The gadget looks like a great way to collect RF noise and inject it into your amp.
The output of a typical 'classic' hifi amp is fed back to the input for error correction.
When you analyse it beyond the audio spectrum, it get interesting.
The small signal input transistors will typically function to hundreds of MHz
At these frequencies, the 'ground connections' for audio look like complicated inductors.
Many people agree that various amps which measure as being very low distortion etc, 'sound different' in reality,
There is a lot of subtle stuff going on.
Tony1963 said:
And then you listen to a seriously good system one day, and the owner is kind enough to to a demo with various cables, and you then search in your mind for reasons why the expensive sounds so much better than the cheap.
But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
Some people listen to hifi, some people listen to music.But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
Edited by Tony1963 on Saturday 29th June 14:37
Tony1963 said:
And then you listen to a seriously good system one day, and the owner is kind enough to to a demo with various cables, and you then search in your mind for reasons why the expensive sounds so much better than the cheap.
But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
I'll bet, you couldn't tell the difference in a blind test. I have listened to systems from 5K up to 150K, and what defined the components was never the cables, it's a brilliant money maker, but after a certain level, there really is no benefit...apart from the fact you can try and lord it over people by stating how much you paid for something...But, for most, it’s easier to slate things we can’t afford in the first place.
Edited by Tony1963 on Saturday 29th June 14:37
Fits the thread title perfectly
OutInTheShed said:
Which bit doesn't sound plausible?
The output of a typical 'classic' hifi amp is fed back to the input for error correction.
When you analyse it beyond the audio spectrum, it get interesting.
The small signal input transistors will typically function to hundreds of MHz
At these frequencies, the 'ground connections' for audio look like complicated inductors.
Many people agree that various amps which measure as being very low distortion etc, 'sound different' in reality,
There is a lot of subtle stuff going on.
So you think it contributes to the negative feedback architecture of the amplifier? How.The output of a typical 'classic' hifi amp is fed back to the input for error correction.
When you analyse it beyond the audio spectrum, it get interesting.
The small signal input transistors will typically function to hundreds of MHz
At these frequencies, the 'ground connections' for audio look like complicated inductors.
Many people agree that various amps which measure as being very low distortion etc, 'sound different' in reality,
There is a lot of subtle stuff going on.
This "product" is attached to a single node of the system. The ground connection in a single-ended architecture. No current can flow into it, it does not contribute to a feedback topology. It is attached to the node where noise would be filtered to (not from).
Noise present in the ground node of an audio system is present on the output, unless it is a balanced output, in which case it could be common mode noise. The little gizmo would need to be attached to both speaker terminals to do anything, even if it wasn't bs.
Do I need to go on?
The people who buy into this must be utterly ignorant of how ears and brains work.
We can measure the signals going into speakers, and the sounds coming out, and do it orders of magnitude more accurately using the proper equipment than we can hear.
Claims of being able to hear the difference a £10,000 mains cable can make is no different to saying you can see the colour of someone’s aura.
We can measure the signals going into speakers, and the sounds coming out, and do it orders of magnitude more accurately using the proper equipment than we can hear.
Claims of being able to hear the difference a £10,000 mains cable can make is no different to saying you can see the colour of someone’s aura.
911hope said:
So you think it contributes to the negative feedback architecture of the amplifier? How.
This "product" is attached to a single node of the system. The ground connection in a single-ended architecture. No current can flow into it, it does not contribute to a feedback topology. It is attached to the node where noise would be filtered to (not from).
Noise present in the ground node of an audio system is present on the output, unless it is a balanced output, in which case it could be common mode noise. The little gizmo would need to be attached to both speaker terminals to do anything, even if it wasn't bs.
Do I need to go on?
I doubt it reliably does anything useful, but in my world, it's not a single node, it's a transmission line of non-zero length and a body at the end of it with capacitance to ground.This "product" is attached to a single node of the system. The ground connection in a single-ended architecture. No current can flow into it, it does not contribute to a feedback topology. It is attached to the node where noise would be filtered to (not from).
Noise present in the ground node of an audio system is present on the output, unless it is a balanced output, in which case it could be common mode noise. The little gizmo would need to be attached to both speaker terminals to do anything, even if it wasn't bs.
Do I need to go on?
Adding any kind of tat to an audio system can have an effect. If you can find some anoraks who like that effect, you might have a business model.
Otherwise you just have clickbait which certain people on here lap up and direct the rest of us to!
I've said before, many of these esoteric things probably make money as a clickbait scheme without ever selling any hardware.
Does the hardware even need to exist?
Some people love to laugh about gold plated mans plug screws, and some people publish magazines and websites to feed that.
It just the same as we like to spend a bit of time on PH, and that's paying few people's salaries.
Personally, as someone who's bought a few yachts and motorbikes off the back of delving into crackpot electronics problems, I find some of these things to be fun puzzles to think about. I'm also a bit interested in the 'psychoacousitcs' thing, what do people like to hear? ,what makes them prefer various sound systems? Or conversely, what can you get away with?
Even if these things are wind-ups, the best of them often have a smidgen of truth, albeit maybe out of context.
Maybe Tony who brings these things to our attention is in on the clickbait income stream? fair do's, we're all here voluntarily...
Ken_Code said:
The people who buy into this must be utterly ignorant of how ears and brains work.
We can measure the signals going into speakers, and the sounds coming out, and do it orders of magnitude more accurately using the proper equipment than we can hear.
Claims of being able to hear the difference a £10,000 mains cable can make is no different to saying you can see the colour of someone’s aura.
It's just classic snobbery, I was at a show once where the enthusiastic business selling cable was convinced that their use of precious metals was the path to enlightenment. Only about 10K for 3m, absolutely ridiculous. We can measure the signals going into speakers, and the sounds coming out, and do it orders of magnitude more accurately using the proper equipment than we can hear.
Claims of being able to hear the difference a £10,000 mains cable can make is no different to saying you can see the colour of someone’s aura.
carlo996 said:
I'll bet, you couldn't tell the difference in a blind test. I have listened to systems from 5K up to 150K, and what defined the components was never the cables, it's a brilliant money maker, but after a certain level, there really is no benefit...apart from the fact you can try and lord it over people by stating how much you paid for something...
Fits the thread title perfectly
We probably agree more than we disagree!Fits the thread title perfectly
But as you said, “… after a certain level” and that is fairly important.
To others, yeah yeah, I’ve been around long enough to understand testing methods. I’ve also been around long enough to know that I like my system, I love listening to the music, and I don’t have long enough left on this planet to make trying different bits of wire a good use of my remaining years.
Lots of assumptions can be made about anyone who likes to try different things and spend what the rest of us think is an obscene amount of money on items. Who cares? None of the people I know who do that were born into money. They’ve studied hard, generally in science and/or engineering, made good money by being smart, have run successful businesses by being clear-minded and just bloody clever. But yeah, just slag em off as if they’d just left prep school with a £5m inheritance.
Gassing Station | Home Cinema & Hi-Fi | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff