Production BMW Championship - good entry to club racing?
Discussion
Originally, I had hoped to race my '44 S2 in CSCC Future Classics this year...but the reality of the costs required to get my car up to scratch (and down to a vaguely competitive weight) means that's going to be much more than I can afford.
So, having looked around and flicked through all the old threads on here, the PBMW championship looks like a good, relatively cheap way to get into racing.
I'd like to hear what existing competitors in this championship think? Is it a good place to start?
Also, how do I go about sorting out the car - is it easy to buy an ex-race car, or should I go and find an E30 318/320 and build my own?
So, having looked around and flicked through all the old threads on here, the PBMW championship looks like a good, relatively cheap way to get into racing.
I'd like to hear what existing competitors in this championship think? Is it a good place to start?
Also, how do I go about sorting out the car - is it easy to buy an ex-race car, or should I go and find an E30 318/320 and build my own?
Ok i'm not in the championship but have raced at the same meetings as them several times. It seems to be the usual mix of semi pro and family club racers, and the track action appears clean.
As with most other club race cars, it's usually cheapest to buy a ready prepared car, especially if you want to be competitive. Good E30's are pretty rare to find, but race preparing should be relatively cheap otherwise as they are meant to be fairly unmodifed cars.
I prefer preparing my own cars as its more satisfying and I know i've done a good job with important stuff like safety bits, rather than relying on someone else's 'expertise'.
As with most other club race cars, it's usually cheapest to buy a ready prepared car, especially if you want to be competitive. Good E30's are pretty rare to find, but race preparing should be relatively cheap otherwise as they are meant to be fairly unmodifed cars.
I prefer preparing my own cars as its more satisfying and I know i've done a good job with important stuff like safety bits, rather than relying on someone else's 'expertise'.
An excellent series, full grids and great racing all through the field no matter how quick or how slow you may be. Worth saying though that (although entry fees are probably the most competitive you will find anywhere) at the top end of the field it has moved away from the original budget ethos a bit and has some pretty serious race cars. As in any one make series there is potential for contact so the regs make it clear that a "rubbings racing" attitude is not welcome. Yellow card/red card system in place for driving infringements and the series usually has its own observers to supplement the marshalls reports and avoidable contact is minimised.
The buy/build debate is no different to any other series, by and large will be cheaper to buy and you are track ready immedietly, but if you like garage time and getting to know the car you may find it preferable to build. Good luck if you decide to go for it
The buy/build debate is no different to any other series, by and large will be cheaper to buy and you are track ready immedietly, but if you like garage time and getting to know the car you may find it preferable to build. Good luck if you decide to go for it
http://www.205cup.com/
You could always rally a E30 too
RWD Challenge
much cheaper than something like an Escort, Manta etc
You could always rally a E30 too
RWD Challenge
much cheaper than something like an Escort, Manta etc
I don't understand why you don't run your S2 in Future Classics. ISTR it has the EMC fitted SD weld in cage, EMC/Gaz suspension? etc. I am running my S2 with headlights, leccy windows fully road legal + a couple of other small things because in all honesty I understand at this stage 99% of the performance requirement will be coming from me, a complete novice. Can always spend the time and money chasing lap times when you need it to fight for race wins.
I agree with NJH,
I did 2 seasons with headlights, heater and passenger seat.
only decided to remove weight this year.
leave the weight in the car to start with, have some fun in the midfield and improve your driving, then remove the weight when you'll appreciate it more and can feel the difference it makes.
even with all the weight in a road going s2 you won't be right at the back.
I did 2 seasons with headlights, heater and passenger seat.
only decided to remove weight this year.
leave the weight in the car to start with, have some fun in the midfield and improve your driving, then remove the weight when you'll appreciate it more and can feel the difference it makes.
even with all the weight in a road going s2 you won't be right at the back.
A.Wang said:
I'd like to hear what existing competitors in this championship think? Is it a good place to start?
You'll find most of the drivers on the Championship forum which can be accessed through the PBMWC website http://www.pbmwc.co.uk/I started in PBMW this year as a novice with a 318. I am mixing it in the lower reaches of the grid but still having great fun. The racing couldn't be closer and the full grids mean that we get to race at some pretty big events. When something breaks there is always someone on hand with whatever part you need, and more often than not they are happy to help fit it too. The guys at the front are there because they deserve to be and they have all been very open and helpful to me, and it's very well policed to try to keep a level playing field and avoid it becoming a chequebook series. A top bunch of people, and a great way to go racing. The cars are surprisingly good to drive too. I'm very happy with my choice of series.
Have a look at www.pbmwc.co.uk and come along one weekend to get a feel for it.
HTH.
Have a look at www.pbmwc.co.uk and come along one weekend to get a feel for it.
HTH.
Edited by Birdthom on Monday 21st June 21:49
Thanks for the comments guys, I'm going to have a look through the website and forum there.
Re. my 944 - yes, it's an EMC car (with an EMC welded-in Safety Devices cage and EMC-spec Gaz suspension), however it wasn't stripped and dipped, which means most of the rot that was there 2 years ago is still there.
I have 2 options - re-shell the '44 and race that in 2011, or look into a cheaper race series and keep the '44 as a learning tool/track day toy.
Hence this very public soul-searching, if you can call it that!
Re. my 944 - yes, it's an EMC car (with an EMC welded-in Safety Devices cage and EMC-spec Gaz suspension), however it wasn't stripped and dipped, which means most of the rot that was there 2 years ago is still there.
I have 2 options - re-shell the '44 and race that in 2011, or look into a cheaper race series and keep the '44 as a learning tool/track day toy.
Hence this very public soul-searching, if you can call it that!
A.Wang said:
look into a cheaper race series and keep the '44 as a learning tool/track day toy.
This for me is the key point, surely you want to be learning the circuits and track craft in the car you will race? For me it is simple either sell the 44 and concentrate on something different or get the 44 into a satisfactorily safe condition to race. You have probably seen my car, I couldn't afford to run or keep another track car so I focused my money and attention on the one car. That would be my main advice. Also as a fellow rookie I couldn't imagine trying to learn tracks and race craft in 2 different cars at the same time, this doesn't make any sense to me.BTW my old shell had very visible rust on the back end of the cills on both sides. That shell was raced the other weekend by Pete & Alex up at Oulton, it only required patch pieces about the size of your fist on each side. I can't remember your car does it require a new floor section and a couple of other pieces? I know it might be a good few £K probably to get fully ready but you would probably spend that on another car and still have an S2 sat around that is neither a road car or fully race ready. You won't want to hear it but sounds like you need to bite the bullet on this one.
This is my second season in PBMW and I've really enjoyed it.
Big grids mean the cheapest entry fees and plenty of people to race against whether you're at the front or the back of the grid.
Race cars for this series are always in demand so you have to be fast if you want to buy a ready prepped car. However, there are a number of companies who can build you a good safe car to the regs within a couple of weeks (Raw Motorsport in Southampton, X-Sport racing in Basingstoke to name a couple).
It's a great place to learn your racecraft and when you've had enough you'll always get your money back on the car.
Ben Winrow, the past Clio Cup champion, races his own car in the championship between outings in the Abarth Trofero series. He chose PBMW because he knows he will be pushed hard by the drivers at the front who are a genuinely talented bunch.
The rest of the drivers are very friendly and helpful as has been said. Try and pop down to watch a race meeting - Castle Combe next on July 31st. Aside from getting a good feel for the atmosphere the racing is great to watch and always action packed.Definitely worth a look
Big grids mean the cheapest entry fees and plenty of people to race against whether you're at the front or the back of the grid.
Race cars for this series are always in demand so you have to be fast if you want to buy a ready prepped car. However, there are a number of companies who can build you a good safe car to the regs within a couple of weeks (Raw Motorsport in Southampton, X-Sport racing in Basingstoke to name a couple).
It's a great place to learn your racecraft and when you've had enough you'll always get your money back on the car.
Ben Winrow, the past Clio Cup champion, races his own car in the championship between outings in the Abarth Trofero series. He chose PBMW because he knows he will be pushed hard by the drivers at the front who are a genuinely talented bunch.
The rest of the drivers are very friendly and helpful as has been said. Try and pop down to watch a race meeting - Castle Combe next on July 31st. Aside from getting a good feel for the atmosphere the racing is great to watch and always action packed.Definitely worth a look
A.Wang said:
or look into a cheaper race series
TBH, I don't think that there are many series that are as good value for money as th CSCC Future Classics/ Tin Tops/ Swiging Sixtes etc races. Excellent track time for your money and travelling time & no real "hot rods" to have to race against either.NJH said:
BTW my old shell had very visible rust on the back end of the cills on both sides. That shell was raced the other weekend by Pete & Alex up at Oulton, it only required patch pieces about the size of your fist on each side. I can't remember your car does it require a new floor section and a couple of other pieces? I know it might be a good few £K probably to get fully ready but you would probably spend that on another car and still have an S2 sat around that is neither a road car or fully race ready. You won't want to hear it but sounds like you need to bite the bullet on this one.
You make a good point there. I'd still be spending thousands on another (PBMW-spec) car, and I'll end up with a "track day special" which will never be raced, which is also far too uncomfortable on the road even for a trip down to the supermarket. I just might bite that bullet... Edited by A.Wang on Tuesday 22 June 11:38
Nurburgsingh said:
A.Wang said:
I just might bite that bullet...
FINALLY!! I thought you'd never stop winging like a b*tch 
Now get your entry in for Cadwell or Mallory... Dont worry about being slower than the other cars.. Me and the Beetle OWN the back of the grid!!
I'm a bit broke at the moment, so those bits are the bare minimum I'll need to sort out before racing it in its current form...and that's not counting the heater matrix that's dumping slightly oily and smelly water onto my left leg!
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