Options after first race car

Options after first race car

Author
Discussion

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Tuesday 9th July
quotequote all
I’ve been racing with a Porsche 924 for a couple of years now. Although there was a lot of mechanical issues at the start I’m starting to get some seat time, with a car that works most of the time.
I like the 924 as far as handling goes (and I like older cars), however one issue I am facing is that it’s really not that competitive against any other car of the period (both heavy and underpowered). I have raced in HSCC 70s and CALM and there are usually 1 to 4 other 924 so it’s not that much close racing. Pretty much everything else is faster (lighter, more power or both).

I’d be interested to hear people’s views on cars or series that will offer close racing (no contact but well matched cars) with relatively low costs (ie not an arms race).
I like classics buts also open to modern machinery. My criteria is:
- car needs to be “affordable”
- needs to be several series where it can race and be competitive in class
- ideally not huge horsepower as then brakes, crashes etc become a lot more expensive. I am thinking up to c.200bhp/ton ish
- needs to be rear wheel drive

Options I can see so far are:
- 116i cup - huge grids, all the cars use control parts and are cheap. Looks very underpowered though
- Porsche boxster - plenty for less than £20k, can race in cscc future classics, calm, Porsche club etc. Parts are not cheap though and they are quite heavy
- MG B historic - lots of classic series, cheap parts. Still looks like you need to spend close to £50k to get a good one though and they are still slow


Any other ideas? I’m definitely looking for something to race in a series with high driving standards/ no contact, but would like to be able to race against more than 1 to 3 other similarly paced cars.

There is a very cool BMW e30 325i on race cars direct. Are there many places these cars can race and be competitive in class?

Any guidance would be much appreciated.
Thanks a lot.

Caterham-Andy

20 posts

58 months

Tuesday 9th July
quotequote all
It really depends on you definition of affordable, but I race in Sports2000 and it’s an excellent championship. These are purpose built race cars, not converted road cars, they are very quick (GT3 pace at some circuits).There are basically two classes, modern and historic. Cars for either start at £20-25k but running costs are very reasonable. In the modern (Duratec) cars the engines are basically factory Ford units with ITBs and a dry sump. New engines can be had £4k and rebuilt for £1k gearbox rebuilds are similar. Should you have a bump bodywork is about £5k (for a set of brand new) but it’s sectional so you only need to fix/replace the bits you break. The paddock is very friendly, racing hard but fair and there is a mix of ability meaning most drivers with some racing experience will have some competition.

ChevronB19

6,162 posts

169 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
james.a.c.911 said:
I’ve been racing with a Porsche 924 for a couple of years now. Although there was a lot of mechanical issues at the start I’m starting to get some seat time, with a car that works most of the time.
I like the 924 as far as handling goes (and I like older cars), however one issue I am facing is that it’s really not that competitive against any other car of the period (both heavy and underpowered). I have raced in HSCC 70s and CALM and there are usually 1 to 4 other 924 so it’s not that much close racing. Pretty much everything else is faster (lighter, more power or both).

I’d be interested to hear people’s views on cars or series that will offer close racing (no contact but well matched cars) with relatively low costs (ie not an arms race).
I like classics buts also open to modern machinery. My criteria is:
- car needs to be “affordable”
- needs to be several series where it can race and be competitive in class
- ideally not huge horsepower as then brakes, crashes etc become a lot more expensive. I am thinking up to c.200bhp/ton ish
- needs to be rear wheel drive

Options I can see so far are:
- 116i cup - huge grids, all the cars use control parts and are cheap. Looks very underpowered though
- Porsche boxster - plenty for less than £20k, can race in cscc future classics, calm, Porsche club etc. Parts are not cheap though and they are quite heavy
- MG B historic - lots of classic series, cheap parts. Still looks like you need to spend close to £50k to get a good one though and they are still slow


Any other ideas? I’m definitely looking for something to race in a series with high driving standards/ no contact, but would like to be able to race against more than 1 to 3 other similarly paced cars.

There is a very cool BMW e30 325i on race cars direct. Are there many places these cars can race and be competitive in class?

Any guidance would be much appreciated.
Thanks a lot.
Monoposto 1800 Zetec. I got this for 8k.



ribiero

588 posts

172 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
Oh I like the hscc 70's roadsport class! and 924 i'd of thought would be fantastic for it

Is there any other car you'd think about moving to that would let you hop up a bit in hscc 70's ?


WombleCate

116 posts

11 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
I'm assuming there's a reason you're ruling out Caterham racing?

At least four series (Official/ MacMillan/ Graduates/ Mag 7s) that offer a sliding scale from expensive to clubman. At c500kg they are light on consumables, easily repaired and hold their values. Some series are true one class racing others less so.

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
Caterham-Andy said:
It really depends on you definition of affordable, but I race in Sports2000 and it’s an excellent championship. These are purpose built race cars, not converted road cars, they are very quick (GT3 pace at some circuits).There are basically two classes, modern and historic. Cars for either start at £20-25k but running costs are very reasonable. In the modern (Duratec) cars the engines are basically factory Ford units with ITBs and a dry sump. New engines can be had £4k and rebuilt for £1k gearbox rebuilds are similar. Should you have a bump bodywork is about £5k (for a set of brand new) but it’s sectional so you only need to fix/replace the bits you break. The paddock is very friendly, racing hard but fair and there is a mix of ability meaning most drivers with some racing experience will have some competition.
Hi have in fact indeed looked into this. Jon H has given me some driver coaching and he races in the historics. The moderns look soooo fast! I love the idea of a Lola with 70s livery but i feel like it would be best enjoyed with a few seasons under my belt in something faster than the 924. I also would like to stick to a closed car. But sports 2000 does look mega.
How long have you been racing for? The pace at the front looks very fast.

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
ChevronB19 said:
Monoposto 1800 Zetec. I got this for 8k.


I wouldn’t be able to get this past my wife on safety grounds. I’m sure it’s a lot of fund but i am looking for a closed wheel car with a roof.

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
ribiero said:
Oh I like the hscc 70's roadsport class! and 924 i'd of thought would be fantastic for it

Is there any other car you'd think about moving to that would let you hop up a bit in hscc 70's ?
HSCC 70s is fantastic. Great group of people, beautiful cars, competitive but clean racing. Can only recommend it. My issue is the 924 is only competitive with the 924’s and a Lancia Beta. And to move up the grid into something faster i think you really need to spend something in the 40s and then it’s still a 40/50 year old car so high maintenance.
If classics i would love a Lotus Elan..

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
WombleCate said:
I'm assuming there's a reason you're ruling out Caterham racing?

At least four series (Official/ MacMillan/ Graduates/ Mag 7s) that offer a sliding scale from expensive to clubman. At c500kg they are light on consumables, easily repaired and hold their values. Some series are true one class racing others less so.
Yes indeed. They tick a lot of boxes but i don’t really want to be in an open car. And for some reason they really don’t appeal to me emotionally. It would probably be the most rational route though.. just can’t get excited.

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
One option someone has suggested is an E46 BMW.

It looks like a 330ci running just around 180bhp/ ton would be competitive in BMW CCRC class 6, 760 Roadsports class C and Club Endury class C. there seems to be plenty of cars in those classes at every event. The car would also have to have a stock engine (well mostly stock everything) to comply with CCRC rules which should also keep it cost effective (no expensive engine rebuilds, brake upgrades, etc.).

Anyone have any experience of these cars?

Dynion Araf Uchaf

4,635 posts

229 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
it sounds like you want to race in the 750MC MR2 series.

geeks

9,517 posts

145 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
ChevronB19 said:
Monoposto 1800 Zetec. I got this for 8k.


While I would like to avoid a thread hijack, tell me more! (or feel free to point me to a thread with more lol)

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
Dynion Araf Uchaf said:
it sounds like you want to race in the 750MC MR2 series.
Maybe i am miss informed but i was under the impression this was a ‘high-contact’ series?
What are driving standards like?

ChevronB19

6,162 posts

169 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
geeks said:
ChevronB19 said:
Monoposto 1800 Zetec. I got this for 8k.


While I would like to avoid a thread hijack, tell me more! (or feel free to point me to a thread with more lol)
No thread sorry! And sorry to the op for continuing hijack. Happy to talk over PM.

ChevronB19

6,162 posts

169 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
HSCC, as you know, is renowned for good driving standards.

How about staying in 70’s road sports with something like a TR7 V8?

WombleCate

116 posts

11 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
james.a.c.911 said:
Yes indeed. They tick a lot of boxes but i don’t really want to be in an open car. And for some reason they really don’t appeal to me emotionally. It would probably be the most rational route though.. just can’t get excited.
The emotional/ excitement is the only part that matters. To me the purity of a low-powered Caterham is the excitement, and, understand (love the fact) we’re all excited by different race cars.

Great friend is going to race a 70’s TVR, that would scare me…

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
ChevronB19 said:
No thread sorry! And sorry to the op for continuing hijack. Happy to talk over PM.
No worries, keep talking about it here. Race car chat is always a good chat and might as well share the info.
I’m a little curious too..

james.a.c.911

Original Poster:

253 posts

74 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
ChevronB19 said:
HSCC, as you know, is renowned for good driving standards.

How about staying in 70’s road sports with something like a TR7 V8?
I would imagine that’s quite expensive to build ? Or do you think they can be found built from time to time?

rallycross

13,204 posts

243 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
Stick a 968 3.0 engine or 944 turbo in that’s a cheap way to go much faster but some series won’t allow that combo as non original.

mattnoss

222 posts

190 months

Wednesday 10th July
quotequote all
rallycross said:
Stick a 968 3.0 engine or 944 turbo in that’s a cheap way to go much faster but some series won’t allow that combo as non original.
I know of a really really nice example of a 924s with 968 running gear, I had the honour of racing it for a season a few years ago and it’s a lovely car and superbly built and maintained.