Harness Changes 2018

[smiles1]

I was chatting to a retailer earlier today and he mentioned that the rules on harnesses were changing and although phased in, as from next year they would no longer be supplying 4 point harnesses for MSA/FIA use as all need to be 6 point, and will be going to 2 inch shoulder and 2 inch waist straps, rather than the current 3 inch shoulder/waist straps.

This is the first I have heard of this. Can anybody confirm?

Thanks

Edited by smiles1 on Thursday 30th November 22:09

[fat80b]

smiles1 said:

will be going to 2 inch shoulder and 2 inch waist straps, rather than the current 3 inch shoulder/waist straps

For this bit, I did hear that there was rumour of a change to this effect because of hans devices - ie with a hans, you should have the 2 inch shoulder straps and not the wider ones as the work better with the hans.

I didn’t know that this was going to happen in 2018.

If you compete, a new set of belts costs less than a tyre or 2 so it’s hardly the end of the world

[88racing]

Why 2” waist straps? Can’t see the reasoning behind that.

[Trev450]

I have also heard that 2" shoulder straps are to be introduced for the reason already given, but likewise was not aware it was for 2018. I guess we will have to wait on the MSA rule changes updates!!

[88racing]

There’s been no mention of it in MSA News so surely is can’t be for next season?

[megamaniac]

Maybe they have realised the Hans isn't as effective with a four point. As for 2" waist belts seems a backwards step.

[dunc_sx]

88racing said:

Why 2” waist straps? Can’t see the reasoning behind that.

No idea about the MSA requirements but taken from the Schroth website an explanation on 2" vs 3" waist straps. The harness shown in the diagram to accompany the text is a 5 point harness.

"To explain why 2" webbing is more effective than 3" webbing, one needs to look at the shape of the human body. The Iliac Crest is the part of the pelvic bone that sticks out above the hips. 2" webbing fits entirely within that crest, where 3" webbing rides over the tips of the crest. The 3" webbing has less surface area by percentage than the 2" webbing which will cause more bruising on impact as "hot-spots" of force develop where the belt is making contact with the pelvic bone. Since the 2" webbing rides inside the crest it can be worn as much as 1" to 2" tighter and at the same time is more comfortable.

Since the 2" webbing fits well within the Iliac Crest of the pelvis, it is less likely to slide up above the crest and cause submarining - a condition where the body slides down below the lap belt possibly causing internal organ damage.

Research shows that the faster the pelvis is captured, the lower the resultant loads on the chest, head, and neck. There is no difference in the strength of the 2" webbing. All webbing (2" or 3") must meet the same load tests."

[stevieturbo]

So they said you must use 3", 2" are not acceptable everyone has to buy new 3" harnesses. Now they say you must use 2"

Load of nonsense.

[Richair]

stevieturbo said:

So they said you must use 3", 2" are not acceptable everyone has to buy new 3" harnesses. Now they say you must use 2"

Load of nonsense.

It's frustrating yes, but safety research is improving all the time and I doubt they'd bring this in unless there are clear benefits. But on the surface it does look a bit silly admittedly!!

At least it sounds like a phased approach and will probably only apply to expired harnesses, but that's simply a guess...

[dunc_sx]

Yes if it's phased so it's when you are replacing an out of date harness anyway there is no extra cost, in fact you might save money because a 2" should be cheaper.

Dunc.

[Weslake-Monza]

If 2 inch waist belts are less likely to cause submarining than a 3 inch belt isn't it simpler to get a 5/6 point set with a crotch strap that prevents submarining anyway?

So the 2 inch belts are as strong as the 3 inch belts (tested to the same standard etc) but of course they don't spread the restraining load over as wide an area as 3 inch belts (same force but spread over an inch less) so are more likely to create a restraining injury (Mmm seatbelt rash).

Finally, where exactly does it say that 3 inch belts are no longer going to be homologated on the MSA's website or is this thread simply idle rumour and mis-informed opinion?

[smiles1]

Weslake-Monza said:

Finally, where exactly does it say that 3 inch belts are no longer going to be homologated on the MSA's website or is this thread simply idle rumour and mis-informed opinion?

See my original post. I only posted after being told the above buy a well known supplier and wondered how much truth there was in it

Edited by smiles1 on Thursday 30th November 22:11

[Weslake-Monza]

Perhaps you can tell us who that well know retailer/supplier is?

This is a link to the MSA page on updates to regulations and I found nothing about even proposed harness changes:

https://www.msauk.org/The-Sport/Regulations/Propos...

[smiles1]

It was demon tweeks if that helps.

[Dan BSCS]

There is nothing in the proposed changes documents or the 2018 Blue Book so I'm guessing they were talking nonsense.

Dan

[Jerry Can]

smiles1 said:

It was demon tweeks if that helps.

i also heard from DT today that the expiry date on the harness was going to be based on date of purchase.... when I asked how I'd prove that in front of a scrutineer he said he needed to ask his manager. Didn't help that the belts I had ordered were made in 2016 with an expiry of 2021. reckon they might have some stock issues...

[dunc_sx]

Jerry Can said:

i also heard from DT today that the expiry date on the harness was going to be based on date of purchase.... when I asked how I'd prove that in front of a scrutineer he said he needed to ask his manager. Didn't help that the belts I had ordered were made in 2016 with an expiry of 2021. reckon they might have some stock issues...