Manual hub locks

[52classic]

At my geat age you'd think I would know the answer to this question!

Today I'm using my son's Isuzu Mu for work to make the most of the snow.

His previous Frontera had Auto Hubs but this one has hubs which need to be locked manually. Question is whether the hubs need to be locked to use the 4WD. In other words, if you leave the hubs in unlocked position and engage 4H do you have 4 wheel drive?

I wondered if the hub lock is just an extra facility for worst terrain.

[Rum Runner]

If the hubs are unlocked the shafts will spin but no power to the front wheels. When in lock it connects the shaft to the hub.
Lock the hubs for 4 wheel drive

Edited by Rum Runner on Wednesday 6th January 11:13

[52classic]

Thanks Andy,

I did lock them but I was worried that if the action was like a diff lock I could be doing some harm using it on good roads.

Off to enjoy the snow then!

[Rum Runner]

Try and only use 4 wheel drive on slippy sufaces and especailly if doing and tight turns/ full lock on none slippy surface in 4x4 mode, (not sure on the Isuzu system but in most cases) otherwise you will get trans windup. You will feel it .
Ok to use 2 wheel and lockers on for short distance on good tarmac and tight turns to stop windup.

Edited by Rum Runner on Wednesday 6th January 12:04

[Kermit power]

Rum Runner said:

Try and only use 4 wheel drive on slippy sufaces and especailly if doing and tight turns/ full lock on none slippy surface in 4x4 mode, (not sure on the Isuzu system but in most cases) otherwise you will get trans windup. You will feel it .
Ok to use 2 wheel and lockers on for short distance on good tarmac and tight turns to stop windup.

Are you sure you're not confusing engaging 4WD with locking the centre diff?

I can drive my Shogun around in 4WD whenever and wherever I like with no impact other than to fuel economy. It's not until I lock up the centre diff that I'm running the risk of transmission wind up if the two drive shafts want to travel at different speeds and can't.

[bigblock]

Rum Runner said:

Ok to use 2 wheel and lockers on for short distance on good tarmac and tight turns to stop windup.

Edited by Rum Runner on Wednesday 6th January 12:04

Are you sure this is what you meant to say?

I think that this advice would almost certainly cause the opposite effect. Locking the diffs on tarmac and carrying out tight turns is asking for windup and subsequent damage. The very reason for open diffs is to prevent this type of strain on the drive components.

[rhinochopig]

Are they hub locks or free-wheeling hubs as per on a series landy. FWHs disconnect the shafts so that they don't rotate and increase fuel consumption.

ETA Having them engaged (i.e. connected to the shafts) does no damage - on a landy anyway.

Edited by rhinochopig on Thursday 7th January 14:02

[Rum Runner]

Kermit power said:

Rum Runner said:

Try and only use 4 wheel drive on slippy sufaces and especailly if doing and tight turns/ full lock on none slippy surface in 4x4 mode, (not sure on the Isuzu system but in most cases) otherwise you will get trans windup. You will feel it .
Ok to use 2 wheel and lockers on for short distance on good tarmac and tight turns to stop windup.

Are you sure you're not confusing engaging 4WD with locking the centre diff?

I can drive my Shogun around in 4WD whenever and wherever I like with no impact other than to fuel economy. It's not until I lock up the centre diff that I'm running the risk of transmission wind up if the two drive shafts want to travel at different speeds and can't.

Quite a lot of 4x4 don't have center diff, when you put engage 4 wheel drive the front and rear are locked. So yes the same as driving you shogun with center diff lock on.

Edited by Rum Runner on Sunday 10th January 17:42

[Arif110]

Rum Runner said:

Quite a lot of 4x4 don't have center diff, when you put engage 4 wheel drive the front and rear are locked. So yes the same as driving you shogun with center diff on.

Bluddy hell! As long as the owner's manual covers that point, I guess it's not just a formula for expensive disaster! I'd always assumed that any '4x4' vehicle would have a centre differential as standard, but indeed, if the front prop can in effect be disconnected, then there's no need as long as the driver's warned about where and how wind-up would occur when in 4x4 mode.

[Rum Runner]

If you read some of the manuals it will state (and on the sun visor) only engage 4 wheel drive on slippy surfaces.Known as ''part time 4 wheel drive''.
I had to explain this to my father-in-law only the other day when he we went from snow covered road to making a full lock turn into a parking space on just wet tarmac as the car(Mitsu shogun Sport/same as L200) hopped into the space. Big shogun Warrior has a center diff from what I remember.
My Suzuki Vitara and Jeep Wrangler are as Shogun Sport. My long term leased Terios had a center diff and was locking ( Much better car than you would give it credit for especially given the lack of roads in the Caribbean which also tend to be mostly very narrow tracks even worse in rainy season).
Latest vitara has center diff.

Edited by Rum Runner on Sunday 10th January 10:50

[normalbloke]

Arif110 said:

Rum Runner said:

Quite a lot of 4x4 don't have center diff, when you put engage 4 wheel drive the front and rear are locked. So yes the same as driving you shogun with center diff on.

Bluddy hell! As long as the owner's manual covers that point, I guess it's not just a formula for expensive disaster! I'd always assumed that any '4x4' vehicle would have a centre differential as standard, but indeed, if the front prop can in effect be disconnected, then there's no need as long as the driver's warned about where and how wind-up would occur when in 4x4 mode.

Not the case,most part time 4x4s do not have a centre diff and and/or associated locking mech.Usually,only permanent 4x4s have a centre difflock/viscous coupling to avoid transmission wind up.
If the O/P vehicle is a part time 4x4,there is absolutely no harm in engaging the freewheeling hubs on tarmac, PROVIDED that he does not engage the transfer box into 4x4 mode until he is onto the slippier stuff.

[Rum Runner]

My quote should say, 'same as driving a shogun with the center diff on lock'

Edited by Rum Runner on Sunday 10th January 17:45

[Kermit power]

Rum Runner said:

If you read some of the manuals it will state (and on the sun visor) only engage 4 wheel drive on slippy surfaces.Known as ''part time 4 wheel drive''.

Again not the correct terminology, I don't think.

My Shogun has what I understand to be part-time 4WD, or, in other words, doesn't have 4x4 engaged all the time. It has the following settings on the transfer box (give or take, from memory):

2H - Rear wheel drive and high ratio gears. What you use most of the time.

4H - 4WD and high ratio gears with open centre diff. What you use in conditions like now with a bit of snow/ice/mud on top of a hard surface such as tarmac.

4HC - 4WD and high ratio with the centre diff locked. What you use on loose, slippery but generally relatively flat, moderately high speed surfaces.

4LC - 4WD, low ratio gears and centre diff locked. Crawling up and down the steep and slippery stuff.

[Rum Runner]

Yes that's a shogun, it has a center diff most part time old school 4 wheel drive vehicles don't have a center diff so nothing to lock. When you put it in 4 wheel drive the transfer box engages the foward prop shaft and the system is locked front and back.
Yes your is full-time/Par-time (because of center diff) with some of the advantages of part-time 4 wheel drive i.e ability to not have to turn the front wheel when in 2H and when in 4H/L the ability to not get wind up i.e like driving a Audi Quattro. Shogun From 1992 on
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_Pajero#His...

I had Pinn here for a while and from what remeber that was the same as your shogun (centre diff) and a late Warrior. The shogun sport is old school part-time

Edited by Rum Runner on Sunday 10th January 21:02

[Rum Runner]

bigblock said:

Rum Runner said:

Ok to use 2 wheel and lockers on for short distance on good tarmac and tight turns to stop windup.

Edited by Rum Runner on Wednesday 6th January 12:04

Are you sure this is what you meant to say?

I think that this advice would almost certainly cause the opposite effect. Locking the diffs on tarmac and carrying out tight turns is asking for windup and subsequent damage. The very reason for open diffs is to prevent this type of strain on the drive components.

Big block I am talking about locking the hubs not diffs as there is no talk about locking axle diffs i.e the thread title

Edited by Rum Runner on Sunday 10th January 21:08

[Rum Runner]

rhinochopig said:

Are they hub locks or free-wheeling hubs as per on a series landy. FWHs disconnect the shafts so that they don't rotate and increase fuel consumption.

ETA Having them engaged (i.e. connected to the shafts) does no damage - on a landy anyway.

Edited by rhinochopig on Thursday 7th January 14:02

Hub locks / feewheeling hubs are the same thing, basically engaging the wheel hub splines to the splines on the half shaft/drive shaft to contect drive to wheel or disengage turning the drive train if not needed.Landie has a center diff which is lockable (think from memory its the red topped forward lever not the yellow low range lever)so ok in 4 wheel on tarmac without it locked.

TIME for me to Butt out one tinks ...............

Edited by Rum Runner on Sunday 10th January 21:27

[normalbloke]

You must be getting lonely in here talking to yourself....

[Gorvid]

Thread hijack....(sorry)

I've got a ratty old L200 for work and filthy use... (mud and snow filthy).

It has AUTO HUBS on the front wheels, which I assume are free wheeling hubs, probably aftermarket. It is not permanent 4WD, instead it has a shifter for 2WD / 4WDH / 4WDL.

When I bought it I was told you stop, engage 4WD..then you might hear the clunk as the hubs lock (?) and you are in 4WD. I have been using it in fields and on snow and it is definitely driving on all 4 wheels

I was also told that when you want out, you select 2WD and then reverse 20 yards with the wheels straight to unlock.

Now here is the thing:

I am doing that - but not sure if I am doing it right or if it is working correctly. Because after 4WD use (and a couple of times just randomly) it has made a grinding noise and felt like I was driving on rumble strips - the whole cab juddering.

It did it for a bit then stopped - something was grinding - the engine carried on fine throughout.

I must say - it does make a few rattles and rubbing noises from the wheels, it is a beaten up old thing.

Anyone got any idea what might be wrong?

Where to get a super cheap fix for an old boot?

[Rum Runner]

It maybe the hubs are not disengaging. Maybe worth starting a fresh thread as there are probably a few L200 experts on here.

[Eggman]

Does the rattling/juddering thing happen on hard surfaces or seem related to going round corners? Could be that 4WD isn't disengaging cleanly due to wear in the linkages or something. If you didn't have power steering under these conditions it would weight up quite a bit as soon as you applied any lock - but since you probably do, the only clue might be the pump groaning (or the belt slipping if it's a real heap!). Try disengaging 4WD on a loose surface and getting someone to observe whilst you try to spin a wheel.