hilux or Dmax?
Discussion
normalbloke said:
I can't believe you've discounted the Great Wall Steed...... It's right up there with the LR product with regards to comfort.....
Must mean it's ahead of most of the others. Do the Jap truck still use leaf suspension on the bed with high spring rates? The Defender is coil all round and has been since circa 1984.300bhp/ton said:
Must mean it's ahead of most of the others. Do the Jap truck still use leaf suspension on the bed with high spring rates? The Defender is coil all round and has been since circa 1984.
So have Unimogs, since long before then, but I wouldn't choose to drive any serious distance in mine and expect to arrive suitably refreshed!Never had any brand loyalty one way or the other(except to get the LR fanboys to bite
), we were in the market for a double cab back in Nov, ended up with a Ranger, I'll let you know how it works out! Yep, it has leafs on the rear, but it drives far far better than it ought to and having a steering rack helps too.300bhp/ton said:
jason61c said:
All things being equal, which would you choose and why? Reviews and reliability point towards the Dmax.
For what use?Personally Land Rover. Better off road and much higher resale value. Either that or look at a US spec truck.
3000 countryside miles including occasional towing a heavy load and carrying heavy stuff
Family use.
jason61c said:
I wouldn't want a land rover. Nothing but trouble, body corrosion, engine issues, rubbish on the motorway.
The hilux and dmax do hold money well without so many of the above issues.
Doesn't sound like you have any first hand experience with Land Rovers. Body is an aluminium alloy called Birmabright and doesn't really corrode. He'll there are still 1948 vehicles about with original bodies. Engines are fine. Even more so for Tdi and Td5 units. Both good enough for military use. The hilux and dmax do hold money well without so many of the above issues.
Motorway they are perfectly fine. I honestly don't believe any worse than any other UK market truck and probably better than most. Puma engine ones with the latest interior are as quiet and comfy as a hatchback and will sit at 80mph all day long.
And as for residuals. Well my uncle has a 3 year old Defender. Just been for its first MoT done by he dealer who sold it. They offered him more money for it now that what he paid new for it. Not sure any Jap truck can claim anything remotely similar.
Btw - we've had approx 50 Land Rovers over the years. All have been fine. I currently own 3, my uncle has 5, brother has 1, Mum has 1, both cousins have LR's.
I have had lots of use of them. I might have just been unlucky. I'm not sure the Defender carries the same 'tax perks' with a capacity of over a tonne etc?
ETA, they're used by the military as they're British and cheap to make, we should have had G-wagons but it wasn't 'British'. I do like them though.
ETA, they're used by the military as they're British and cheap to make, we should have had G-wagons but it wasn't 'British'. I do like them though.
Edited by jason61c on Wednesday 5th August 22:46
Edited by jason61c on Wednesday 5th August 22:53
300bhp/ton said:
Many military's use and have used Land Rovers. From Italian to Australian to American and many parts of the Middle East.
It's all getting a little irrelevant given the O/P dismissed the LR product at the first hurdle. Isn't the Defender just about to become obsolete anyway? UK production will be stopping. Not sure that's the same as being obsolete. Plenty still on the used market and plenty of almost new ones.
On a different forum there is bloke who swapped his 110 for a Jap truck. Because he thought the LR was being unreliable. The new Jap truck he bought has turned out to be more problematic, doesn't tow as well, slightly more noisy at speed and doesn't have the off road capabilities of the LR. The only perks are a more modern radio and air con system and leather seats. You can tell that they feel it was a backwards step.
Now I'm not against the other trucks. Quite a fan of them in fact. But there is a reason the Land Rover has done so well for such a long period of time. It's simply very good at what it does.
The only real reason production is stopping has nothing to do with the vehicle. But the production costs. The Defender line requires lots of people. JLR know they can build things like the Disco Sport for a fraction of the cost, as it's mostly automated. This means bigger profit margin and lower head count.
On a different forum there is bloke who swapped his 110 for a Jap truck. Because he thought the LR was being unreliable. The new Jap truck he bought has turned out to be more problematic, doesn't tow as well, slightly more noisy at speed and doesn't have the off road capabilities of the LR. The only perks are a more modern radio and air con system and leather seats. You can tell that they feel it was a backwards step.
Now I'm not against the other trucks. Quite a fan of them in fact. But there is a reason the Land Rover has done so well for such a long period of time. It's simply very good at what it does.
The only real reason production is stopping has nothing to do with the vehicle. But the production costs. The Defender line requires lots of people. JLR know they can build things like the Disco Sport for a fraction of the cost, as it's mostly automated. This means bigger profit margin and lower head count.
We'll never agree! Obsolete it definitely is, except maybe for third world countries. If it was still a viable product, TATA (or whoever) would just move production offshore, surely. As most of the new double cabs will pull 3.5 tonnes, it's just another nail IMHO. Just for the NCAP rating alone versus the Defender range is an overwhelming argument. As an aside, why did LR fit the wheezy 2.2 to the Defender, and not go straight for the 3.2. It's almost as asthmatic as the VW 2.0 now fitted to everything, and please don't say emissions or economy!
Nobody knows what will happen with production yet. It's not been made public. I'm certainly not saying there aren't some short comings with the design nor areas that could do with updating. But that doesn't mean it isn't capable, very capable.
As for the engine. Who knows. Cost. Avoiding upgrading the axles to heavier duty ones (very likely). And the historic fact LR have never liked or wanted to market the Defender if it could out perform the more expensive models in the range. Hence why they never really used the higher output engines found in the RR and Disco line.
If they put a 3 litre + modern engine in the Defender it'd piss all over the D3/4 or RR's fitted with the V6. As an example note the Td5 Defenders where substantially de-tuned compared to Disco2's, despite using essentially the same drivetrain. As for other reasons, don't know. But it's easy to guess there may be many.
As for the engine. Who knows. Cost. Avoiding upgrading the axles to heavier duty ones (very likely). And the historic fact LR have never liked or wanted to market the Defender if it could out perform the more expensive models in the range. Hence why they never really used the higher output engines found in the RR and Disco line.
If they put a 3 litre + modern engine in the Defender it'd piss all over the D3/4 or RR's fitted with the V6. As an example note the Td5 Defenders where substantially de-tuned compared to Disco2's, despite using essentially the same drivetrain. As for other reasons, don't know. But it's easy to guess there may be many.
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