Vauxhall Frontera - good idea?
Discussion
For some unknow reason I have a hankering for a cheap 4x4.
Living in Staffordshire there's plenty of places to go included some guided wildlife tours on Cannock Chase.
Thing is I don't want to spend a fortune. My Dad had a Frontera about 10 years ago and it seemed quite capable.
Looking on Autotrader I could get one for under 1k. They have a proper box with low and hi ratio. Guessing the Isuzu diesel is the one to go for instead of the petrol.
Am I mad or should I look at something else?
How capable off road are they - I know they don't have a diff lock, but iirc you can lock the hubs manually - is this a problem?
Thanks
Chris
Living in Staffordshire there's plenty of places to go included some guided wildlife tours on Cannock Chase.
Thing is I don't want to spend a fortune. My Dad had a Frontera about 10 years ago and it seemed quite capable.
Looking on Autotrader I could get one for under 1k. They have a proper box with low and hi ratio. Guessing the Isuzu diesel is the one to go for instead of the petrol.
Am I mad or should I look at something else?
How capable off road are they - I know they don't have a diff lock, but iirc you can lock the hubs manually - is this a problem?
Thanks
Chris
I had a 2.8TDI fronty, that has the Isuzu engine, never got to use it off road unfortunately, do be aware of the dual mass flywheels/clutch, when ours went it cost £1500 to replace,£750 for the flywheel alone!! Though I do believe there is some where/some one who can now recondition old flywheels or supply new ones for about half the price of originals. I believe the ground clearance and overhangs on fronteras are not great for off roading (I'm sure some one will correct me if I am wrong). Having said that I did enjoy driving our while we had it.
P.S
our frontera went up in flames while we were parked up outside the local paper shop
!!
P.S
our frontera went up in flames while we were parked up outside the local paper shop
!!I had a 2.2 Isuzu Amigo, (basically a Frontera Sport), and it was a great 4x4. Used it in the blistering heat of Upstate NY, and the freezing winters, (more snow than another metropolitan area in the contiguous US). Used to take it all the time up into the Adirondacks along trails, cut throughs, through icy water, and so on. It never missed a beat. Whether the Isuzu had a different engine to the Vauxhall, I've no idea, but it was reliable for me.
Woody said:
For some unknow reason I have a hankering for a cheap 4x4.
Living in Staffordshire there's plenty of places to go included some guided wildlife tours on Cannock Chase.
Thing is I don't want to spend a fortune. My Dad had a Frontera about 10 years ago and it seemed quite capable.
Looking on Autotrader I could get one for under 1k. They have a proper box with low and hi ratio. Guessing the Isuzu diesel is the one to go for instead of the petrol.
Am I mad or should I look at something else?
How capable off road are they - I know they don't have a diff lock, but iirc you can lock the hubs manually - is this a problem?
Thanks
Chris
Personally I think they look really good. We had a 2.2 petrol 3 door sport in blue.Living in Staffordshire there's plenty of places to go included some guided wildlife tours on Cannock Chase.
Thing is I don't want to spend a fortune. My Dad had a Frontera about 10 years ago and it seemed quite capable.
Looking on Autotrader I could get one for under 1k. They have a proper box with low and hi ratio. Guessing the Isuzu diesel is the one to go for instead of the petrol.
Am I mad or should I look at something else?
How capable off road are they - I know they don't have a diff lock, but iirc you can lock the hubs manually - is this a problem?
Thanks
Chris
But in all honesty I thought it was shockingly awful off road. And not very good on it either.
Bit of a shame. It wasn't a bad car, and don't think I didn't like it. But I hail from a Land Rover back ground and the Frontera is many leagues lower in ability.
Locking front hubs I think is the earlier Frontera only, I think they are auto on latter ones. This has no affect on their off road ability, as all this does is reduce rotating mass on the road to try and improve mpg.
-IFS at the front means limited wheel travel and poor flex.
-Low range that really isn't low enough.
For gentle laning or mild off roading they are probably fine, and with all vehicles you can mod them. But there are better off roaders.
This was our one:
As I say I really loved the look of it. It wasn't bad to sit in either and the controls all felt good.
But the engine was truly gutless yet somehow also hated to rev.
Despite IFS it rode far worse than a classic Range Rover does and also didn't handle as well.
Off road it just didn't have the flex and would far too easily lift a wheel off the ground. It also had limited ground clearance by comparison to other 4x4's.
The Frontera was replaced with a 1.8 Freelander. The Freelander despite no low range is far supeiror off road due to TCS and HDC. It also felt more grunty with better low end torque, would rev, was faster and handled a lot better with a far superior ride.
If you want a cheap off roader my advice would be to look at these:
-Land Rover Discovery
-Suzuki Jimny
-Land Rover Series 3 88"
-Jeep Cherokee (XJ)
All of them are far superior off road to the Frontera. The Jeep you'll want a 2" lift kit though. I paid £80 for the kit on my Cherokee and fitted it myself in a couple of hours.
Woody said:
I like the Jeep - how essential is the lift though?
It isn't 100% essential, but Jeeps tend to ride lower than Landy's do in stock trim. In the US you could option an off road package (called up country) which came with a lift.Standard tyres on a Cherokee are only 28-29" tall. A lift will allow bigger tyres and improve ground clearance and approach/departure angles.
A budget boost kit is all you need, which is extended shackles for the rear springs and a plastic spacer that fits on top of the front coil springs. It won't really affect the handling much but will allow you to fit some 31.10.50R15 tyres.
Stock rims can be retained although you'll want spacers on the front to stop the tyres rubbing on lock. Either that or some aftermarket rims.
This was my Cherokee that I foolishly sold, although another PH'er now has it.
This is with the lift and the 31" mud terrains:
In this guise it'll go anywhere a Land Rover will and is very capable. If you want more extreme then the Cherokee XJ is a good platform to build on too.
Mine was the 4.0 petrol, a bit juicy. High teens most of the time and low 20's on a run (suspect a diesel Frontera would only be mid/high 20's though).
The 4.0 is the one to get, the 2.5TD is prone to HG issues. The 2.5 petrol is ok, more powerful than a Tdi Land Rover, but lacks a bit of low end grunt and isn't much better on fuel than the 4.0 but it is a viable option.
The 4.0 has a centre diff so you can run in 4wd on the road or 2wd. The 2.5's don't have a centre diff so are RWD only on road.
Woody said:
The jimmy look like it could be fun though - and quite small so won't take up too much space on the drive lol.
These are very very capable little machines. A mild lift is sensible to get some bigger tyres on them, but they are good right out of the box.The 1.3 is also quite frugal and cheap to tax. These are very much an original Series 1 Land Rover but with better suspension and more water tight.
300bhp/ton said:
It isn't 100% essential, but Jeeps tend to ride lower than Landy's do in stock trim. In the US you could option an off road package (called up country) which came with a lift.
Standard tyres on a Cherokee are only 28-29" tall. A lift will allow bigger tyres and improve ground clearance and approach/departure angles.
A budget boost kit is all you need, which is extended shackles for the rear springs and a plastic spacer that fits on top of the front coil springs. It won't really affect the handling much but will allow you to fit some 31.10.50R15 tyres.
Stock rims can be retained although you'll want spacers on the front to stop the tyres rubbing on lock. Either that or some aftermarket rims.
This was my Cherokee that I foolishly sold, although another PH'er now has it.
This is with the lift and the 31" mud terrains:
In this guise it'll go anywhere a Land Rover will and is very capable. If you want more extreme then the Cherokee XJ is a good platform to build on too.
Mine was the 4.0 petrol, a bit juicy. High teens most of the time and low 20's on a run (suspect a diesel Frontera would only be mid/high 20's though).
The 4.0 is the one to get, the 2.5TD is prone to HG issues. The 2.5 petrol is ok, more powerful than a Tdi Land Rover, but lacks a bit of low end grunt and isn't much better on fuel than the 4.0 but it is a viable option.
The 4.0 has a centre diff so you can run in 4wd on the road or 2wd. The 2.5's don't have a centre diff so are RWD only on road.
The 1.3 is also quite frugal and cheap to tax. These are very much an original Series 1 Land Rover but with better suspension and more water tight.
Thanks for the info - what about bump-stops - do those need increasing?Standard tyres on a Cherokee are only 28-29" tall. A lift will allow bigger tyres and improve ground clearance and approach/departure angles.
A budget boost kit is all you need, which is extended shackles for the rear springs and a plastic spacer that fits on top of the front coil springs. It won't really affect the handling much but will allow you to fit some 31.10.50R15 tyres.
Stock rims can be retained although you'll want spacers on the front to stop the tyres rubbing on lock. Either that or some aftermarket rims.
This was my Cherokee that I foolishly sold, although another PH'er now has it.
This is with the lift and the 31" mud terrains:
In this guise it'll go anywhere a Land Rover will and is very capable. If you want more extreme then the Cherokee XJ is a good platform to build on too.
Mine was the 4.0 petrol, a bit juicy. High teens most of the time and low 20's on a run (suspect a diesel Frontera would only be mid/high 20's though).
The 4.0 is the one to get, the 2.5TD is prone to HG issues. The 2.5 petrol is ok, more powerful than a Tdi Land Rover, but lacks a bit of low end grunt and isn't much better on fuel than the 4.0 but it is a viable option.
The 4.0 has a centre diff so you can run in 4wd on the road or 2wd. The 2.5's don't have a centre diff so are RWD only on road.
Woody said:
The jimmy look like it could be fun though - and quite small so won't take up too much space on the drive lol.
These are very very capable little machines. A mild lift is sensible to get some bigger tyres on them, but they are good right out of the box.The 1.3 is also quite frugal and cheap to tax. These are very much an original Series 1 Land Rover but with better suspension and more water tight.
Was yours a manual or auto box?
Hadn't thought about the tax on the Jimny - possibly another reason to look at one!
Chris
Woody said:
Thanks for the info - what about bump-stops - do those need increasing?
Was yours a manual or auto box?
Nope, no need to change these. If it's off road most of the time you could remove the rear anti roll bar and get some disconnects for the front. I didn't bother as it'd go anywhere I needed it too as it was.Was yours a manual or auto box?
All 4.0's in the UK are auto, although in the US you could get them with a 5 speed manual.
I'm not the biggest auto fan, but all I can is, it does work and work very well. Almost enough to convince me auto is the way to go off road. If you've not driven an auto off road don't let this put you off.
If you really want a manual then look for a 2.5 petrol as almost all are 5 speeders.
Woody said:
Hadn't thought about the tax on the Jimny - possibly another reason to look at one!
Chris
Tax on the Jeep is the same as any other pre 2001 vehicle with 1.6 litres or bigger engine (think about £220/year). Or the same as a 1.6 Corsa would be.Chris
The Jimny for an earlier model will fall in the sub 1.4 bracket for tax and be about half the cost. Post 2001 Jimny's are on the Co2 scale and cost slightly more to tax, but not by much.
The transfer box works the same with an auto as it does in a manual, so yep you still get high and low range and all 4 gears + reserve in each.
Low range is selected by a 2nd lever, this is the same with a manual or auto.
Many, or at least many older school UK off roaders prefer manuals, as arguably you get slightly more low speed control. But I think this mostly extends from the fact that in the UK we've had very few automatic off roaders to actually choose from and almost none from Land Rover until the recent Discovery 3 generation (note all new Land Rover's are now automatics pretty much
).
The biggest advantage with an auto is you can change gear without needing to lift of the throttle and don't lose momentum. The torque converter is also handy for not riding the clutch. Lock it in low 1st and it'll be perfectly happy on steep downhill slopes too.
Low range is selected by a 2nd lever, this is the same with a manual or auto.
Many, or at least many older school UK off roaders prefer manuals, as arguably you get slightly more low speed control. But I think this mostly extends from the fact that in the UK we've had very few automatic off roaders to actually choose from and almost none from Land Rover until the recent Discovery 3 generation (note all new Land Rover's are now automatics pretty much
).The biggest advantage with an auto is you can change gear without needing to lift of the throttle and don't lose momentum. The torque converter is also handy for not riding the clutch. Lock it in low 1st and it'll be perfectly happy on steep downhill slopes too.
300bhp/ton said:
The transfer box works the same with an auto as it does in a manual, so yep you still get high and low range and all 4 gears + reserve in each.
Low range is selected by a 2nd lever, this is the same with a manual or auto.
Many, or at least many older school UK off roaders prefer manuals, as arguably you get slightly more low speed control. But I think this mostly extends from the fact that in the UK we've had very few automatic off roaders to actually choose from and almost none from Land Rover until the recent Discovery 3 generation (note all new Land Rover's are now automatics pretty much ).
The biggest advantage with an auto is you can change gear without needing to lift of the throttle and don't lose momentum. The torque converter is also handy for not riding the clutch. Lock it in low 1st and it'll be perfectly happy on steep downhill slopes too.
Reat - thanks again.Low range is selected by a 2nd lever, this is the same with a manual or auto.
Many, or at least many older school UK off roaders prefer manuals, as arguably you get slightly more low speed control. But I think this mostly extends from the fact that in the UK we've had very few automatic off roaders to actually choose from and almost none from Land Rover until the recent Discovery 3 generation (note all new Land Rover's are now automatics pretty much
).The biggest advantage with an auto is you can change gear without needing to lift of the throttle and don't lose momentum. The torque converter is also handy for not riding the clutch. Lock it in low 1st and it'll be perfectly happy on steep downhill slopes too.
What about recovery points on the Cherokee? I'm guessing that if you have a tow bar then that'd work fine for the rear, but what about the front?
There is a standard front recovery point, although I don't know what it's rated too but it worked fine for my use. I had a rear tow bar on mine too.
If the Jeep appeals you might want to have a look here:
http://www.birtydastards.com/frm/
Or more info on this US based forum: http://www.jeepforum.com/
For the Jimny:
http://www.bigjimny.com/
If the Jeep appeals you might want to have a look here:
http://www.birtydastards.com/frm/
Or more info on this US based forum: http://www.jeepforum.com/
For the Jimny:
http://www.bigjimny.com/
Woody said:
Cheers guys.
Off to look at a couple of Cherokee XJ's when I get back from hols.
Chris
Good choice. Better than a Vauxhall - these are not great off-road, and basically are a rust-prone saloon car body with basic saloon-car mechanicals! Off to look at a couple of Cherokee XJ's when I get back from hols.
Chris
All I can say is, in all my time serious off-roading, I have NEVER come across anyone in a Vauxhall!
I have a Jeep YJ with a lot of extra kit - it's basically unstoppable, but something like this would be outside your budget. However, a 4.0 litre auto XJ Cherokee shares a lot of the running gear with my Wrangler - same motor, box and axles, albeit bolted to a unitary bodyshell and not a proper separate chassis a la Wrangler.
But, for the money, a great idea and introduction to what's possible - and I see other XJ's on the trails when I'm out, which do very well indeed, especially with a bit of a suspension-lift, and are cheap and easy to fix and maintain, and basically bulletproof.
My Jeep's mechanicals have had a lot of serious abuse, and so far, nothing has broken or failed.
And just because, in a sense of showing-off, here's a picture of mine...are you sure you can't stretch your budget to a Wrangler??!!
Ray Luxury-Yacht said:
Good choice. Better than a Vauxhall - these are not great off-road, and basically are a rust-prone saloon car body with basic saloon-car mechanicals!
All I can say is, in all my time serious off-roading, I have NEVER come across anyone in a Vauxhall!
I have a Jeep YJ with a lot of extra kit - it's basically unstoppable, but something like this would be outside your budget. However, a 4.0 litre auto XJ Cherokee shares a lot of the running gear with my Wrangler - same motor, box and axles, albeit bolted to a unitary bodyshell and not a proper separate chassis a la Wrangler.
But, for the money, a great idea and introduction to what's possible - and I see other XJ's on the trails when I'm out, which do very well indeed, especially with a bit of a suspension-lift, and are cheap and easy to fix and maintain, and basically bulletproof.
My Jeep's mechanicals have had a lot of serious abuse, and so far, nothing has broken or failed.
And just because, in a sense of showing-off, here's a picture of mine...are you sure you can't stretch your budget to a Wrangler??!!
Thanks for the input.All I can say is, in all my time serious off-roading, I have NEVER come across anyone in a Vauxhall!
I have a Jeep YJ with a lot of extra kit - it's basically unstoppable, but something like this would be outside your budget. However, a 4.0 litre auto XJ Cherokee shares a lot of the running gear with my Wrangler - same motor, box and axles, albeit bolted to a unitary bodyshell and not a proper separate chassis a la Wrangler.
But, for the money, a great idea and introduction to what's possible - and I see other XJ's on the trails when I'm out, which do very well indeed, especially with a bit of a suspension-lift, and are cheap and easy to fix and maintain, and basically bulletproof.
My Jeep's mechanicals have had a lot of serious abuse, and so far, nothing has broken or failed.
And just because, in a sense of showing-off, here's a picture of mine...are you sure you can't stretch your budget to a Wrangler??!!
Love the Wrangler but not sure that I'd fit the Mrs & kids in there lol!
The Jeep (if that's what I get...) will be used as a second car for Winter and carting the bikes around etc. and a bit of off-road fun for me!
Your Wrangler look awesome! bet it's great fun.
Chris
I had a £1500 1.8 Freelander 5 door for a year or so - I loved driving it, it was amazing in the snow on all-season tyres - getting my new born son home from a flooded hospital at 2 in the morning when nothing much else would have managed it! I did have a couple of issues with it, but surprisingly not the common headgasket or diff problems.
Freelanders so have a bad rep, but a well looked after diesel may be worth considering as long as it was cheap! When they are running they are great, when they break at least most problems are well known - but mine was off the road for a couple of months with a problematic fuel pump electrical connection and a timing issue which took 3 garages to trace.
I wouldn't run one as an only car, but as a second car I'd have one again.
My 9 year old son misses it the most!!!
Freelanders so have a bad rep, but a well looked after diesel may be worth considering as long as it was cheap! When they are running they are great, when they break at least most problems are well known - but mine was off the road for a couple of months with a problematic fuel pump electrical connection and a timing issue which took 3 garages to trace.
I wouldn't run one as an only car, but as a second car I'd have one again.
My 9 year old son misses it the most!!!
Ray Luxury-Yacht said:
Good choice. Better than a Vauxhall - these are not great off-road, and basically are a rust-prone saloon car body with basic saloon-car mechanicals!
Puts his hand up.Not sure about the saloon car body, and saloon car mechanicals! They have a Dana 44 rear diff, fully boxed frame, low range, etc. Never had any issues with articulation, and stock the clearance was no worse than any others to be honest.
As I said, they won the stock Baja500.
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