Mercedes ML270 vs Jeep Grand Cherokee 2.7 CRD?
Discussion
No idea about the Merc, I would have thought it would suffer the same injector seal issue as the engine is (as you state) the same.
It's could be worth looking around for a Jeep which has had the work done if you're that concerned. The parts are a few pence, it's just the time taken to replace 5 copper washers and 5 bolts that's the problem.
I've had mine for a couple of months now and have to say I'm very impressed, it's a 53(04 face lift) 2.7 Limited, I think I also got quite lucky managing to find a quadradrive model as most 2.7's seem to be quadratrac.I was going to get another discovery, but happy I've made the change.
This one did have a leaking injector seal but this was fixed prior to being sold.
It's could be worth looking around for a Jeep which has had the work done if you're that concerned. The parts are a few pence, it's just the time taken to replace 5 copper washers and 5 bolts that's the problem.
I've had mine for a couple of months now and have to say I'm very impressed, it's a 53(04 face lift) 2.7 Limited, I think I also got quite lucky managing to find a quadradrive model as most 2.7's seem to be quadratrac.I was going to get another discovery, but happy I've made the change.
This one did have a leaking injector seal but this was fixed prior to being sold.
Edited by Ledaig on Friday 9th December 11:30
Thx for that, how do find the fuel economy of the 2.7? I used to run a Jeep Cherokee 4.0L 1996 petrol for a couple of years but found I'd spend about £80 filling it up with petrol only to do around 270 mile a tank!!! I think it was about about 17 / 18mpg! Where my deisel VW 1.9GT golf cost £70 to fill up & would do around 500 miles!! I still want a 4x4 but after researching I thought the Merc 2.7CRD looked favourite.
One other thing, how do you spot a leaking injector seal? Is it a loss of power, lumpy drive or do you see surplus liquid around the injectors?
One other thing, how do you spot a leaking injector seal? Is it a loss of power, lumpy drive or do you see surplus liquid around the injectors?
Edited by 97BlackC5 on Friday 9th December 12:57
Economy wise I'm putting about £94 in at a time and getting 400-450 from it depending on what I'm doing. Most of this is to and from work which given the short distance and roads could really be considered urban driving so it seems acceptable to me and not far off what the book states.
A leaking injector can be seen from what is generally called 'the black death' apparently
If you remove the top engine cover and look around the area of the injectors you will see a hard black carbon deposit which resembles coal or hard tar. Depending on the level and length of time of a leak this could be a small amount or quite large pile of the stuff on top of the engine. It really is quite easy to spot.
ETA - I'm not trying to put you off the Merc as I've never had or driven one, just giving you my real world opinion on the GC.
A leaking injector can be seen from what is generally called 'the black death' apparently
If you remove the top engine cover and look around the area of the injectors you will see a hard black carbon deposit which resembles coal or hard tar. Depending on the level and length of time of a leak this could be a small amount or quite large pile of the stuff on top of the engine. It really is quite easy to spot.
ETA - I'm not trying to put you off the Merc as I've never had or driven one, just giving you my real world opinion on the GC.
I am with SCRW (morning mate),
My mother in law has the 2.7 CRD Jeep, and although a nice motor it has had the injector issues.
Plus we both went away last yr, I am running a 4.7V8 H.O (now on LPG but not then), both sat at 65mph on a motorway run for over an hour, she averaged 32mpg I averaged 34mpg.
SCRW has just become a fan of LPG and it seriously does give you diesel economy and petrol power.
If looking at a V8 (especially a high output) on LPG insure it has Flashlude additive installed, on the 4litre it isn't a must.
My mother in law has the 2.7 CRD Jeep, and although a nice motor it has had the injector issues.
Plus we both went away last yr, I am running a 4.7V8 H.O (now on LPG but not then), both sat at 65mph on a motorway run for over an hour, she averaged 32mpg I averaged 34mpg.
SCRW has just become a fan of LPG and it seriously does give you diesel economy and petrol power.
If looking at a V8 (especially a high output) on LPG insure it has Flashlude additive installed, on the 4litre it isn't a must.
97BlackC5 said:
After your thoughts on the above looking to spend about £5000 - £6000 so would realisticly be looking at an '02 - '03 Merc or an '03 - '04 Jeep. Just wondered what were to pros & cons as they both have the same engine & gearbox & both built in America!
Got my 2004 GC Overland with 55K on the clock about 2 months ago. Its a 2.7 crd and I gave under £7K for it, but that included a lot of work done before collection (new disc's and pads, bumper respray, engine and gearbox oil change, new bonnet struts etc). Dont be put off by internet horror stories. All cars will develope faults as they get old. There is no such thing as a perfect car that never wears out or cost you anything to run. Just do you research and go with what you want.
The 2.7 is pretty bullit proof, and if you got a good spanner man and dont pay main dealer costs (my guy is £40/hr) then mainteneance aint so bad.
Opinion is they wobble a bit on the suspension, but you can improve that with an aftermarket rear anti sway bar apparently.
Im enjoying mine, getting about 22mpg (acording to the onboard display)when commuting, as my trip is stop/start all the way in the rush hour
But cruzin'on the M4 at a steady 60 the display says 30mpg 
Cant comment on the merc as I dont know anything about them. But I think the Jeeps give good VFM when compared with a lot of other brands when used. They dont seem to have the snob appeal of the European makes.
Also there are some decent forums, US based but with a diesel communtiy on them for tech help.
Good luck.
Further update of 2.7 crd Auto MPG.
Did a steady 62mph @ 2100 rpm on the M4 and saw 32.5 mpg on the display.
If I knew/understood LPG and its pro's and cons (some say yes, others wont touch a car thats had it. I asked before on this forum) then maybe I would also consider a petrol that someone else has blown £1k to £2K on conversion.
Im a big V8 fan at heart
Just seems the 2.7crd is a simple/safe route to Jeep ownership (barring any major problems !)Also Ive never owned a diesel before so the chance to experience that was tempting.
Did a steady 62mph @ 2100 rpm on the M4 and saw 32.5 mpg on the display.
If I knew/understood LPG and its pro's and cons (some say yes, others wont touch a car thats had it. I asked before on this forum) then maybe I would also consider a petrol that someone else has blown £1k to £2K on conversion.
Im a big V8 fan at heart
Just seems the 2.7crd is a simple/safe route to Jeep ownership (barring any major problems !)Also Ive never owned a diesel before so the chance to experience that was tempting.
Hi, new on here but loads of experience with a Merc ML270 cdi. Ran a 53 reg from new upto 170k with little or no trouble, apart from the dreaded black death injector seal issue at around 110k miles. This is caused by Mercs wisdom to only use one bolt per injector, which then stretches allowing hot exhaust gasses past the copper seal leading to its failure. They can be a nightmare to change just from the amount of gunge that can accumulate around the injectors. A give away is a wheeze/hiss in time with the engine strokes from the head area when on tickover. A job most accomplished DIY mechanics can undertake, and no dropping the engine to get injector 5 on the Merc
Tip 1: Before starting the job take the motor for a good hours thrash and get that engine nice and hot, this softens up the gunge and enables it to be carved and peeled away rather than having to chip it out with a hammer and chisel
.
Tip 2: The injectors can be a pig to extract with all that gunk cementing the injector body into the deep injector well. Slacken the injector bolts of a couple of turns then give the engine a good rev, this will help unseat the injectors making their extraction easier, otherwise trying to extract them with brute force can damage/destroy them, and they're £180 a pop
A set of new bolts and copper washers are from memory £20 from the main dealer.
One injectors internals did fail, no start on cold mornings, diagnosed by monitoring flow from all the return ports at the same time (massive amount from any injector = failure)
Only other thing was an oil leak from around the gearbox just before I swapped, this galvanised me into swapping but further investigation revealed a failed wiring loom plug seal, another £20 and a 15 minute job on the ramp
but still felt it was time to change, so 
Tip 1: Before starting the job take the motor for a good hours thrash and get that engine nice and hot, this softens up the gunge and enables it to be carved and peeled away rather than having to chip it out with a hammer and chisel
.Tip 2: The injectors can be a pig to extract with all that gunk cementing the injector body into the deep injector well. Slacken the injector bolts of a couple of turns then give the engine a good rev, this will help unseat the injectors making their extraction easier, otherwise trying to extract them with brute force can damage/destroy them, and they're £180 a pop
A set of new bolts and copper washers are from memory £20 from the main dealer.
One injectors internals did fail, no start on cold mornings, diagnosed by monitoring flow from all the return ports at the same time (massive amount from any injector = failure
)Only other thing was an oil leak from around the gearbox just before I swapped, this galvanised me into swapping but further investigation revealed a failed wiring loom plug seal, another £20 and a 15 minute job on the ramp
but still felt it was time to change, so Edited by middlewichjoe on Friday 23 December 09:22
Bought it new in 1998,for £850 IIRC. Swore Id never sell it and I wont !
Its more of an urban commute bike these days running semi slicks. I have a nice 7 mile ride along the Jubilee river from Maidenhead to Slough when I ride to work.
Its had some replacement parts along the way, but I do find the lack of rebound control on the rear shock a pain as I bounce a few times after every bump !
Its more of an urban commute bike these days running semi slicks. I have a nice 7 mile ride along the Jubilee river from Maidenhead to Slough when I ride to work.
Its had some replacement parts along the way, but I do find the lack of rebound control on the rear shock a pain as I bounce a few times after every bump !
As for the jeep, my advice is sit on your hands till the right one comes along. I did for a long time, I wanted a Overland as Im a tart for creature comforts 
.
I also wanted the grey one with not to many miles and due to home and work commitments I just cant travel across the country to check every one that came up for sale.
As Luck would have it, the perfect jeep came up for sale 20 mins form home
.I also wanted the grey one with not to many miles and due to home and work commitments I just cant travel across the country to check every one that came up for sale.
As Luck would have it, the perfect jeep came up for sale 20 mins form home
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