Drummers of PH - Explain something to me

[theboyfold]

I'm not that musical in terms of being able to play anything at all, so I don't understand drumming at all. Out of all the bands I love, the only drummer I could pick out of a crowd is Phil Selway from Radiohead, allegedly he's the 26th best drummer of all time!

So what makes a good drummer? Who are the greats and what makes them great? And what's so different about Mr Selway's drumming that a Luddite like me can pick it out?

[monthefish]

I think, like many instruments, speed of play marks out the 'great' from the 'good'.

[garycat]

monthefish said:

I think, like many instruments, speed of play marks out the 'great' from the 'good'.

Only for a death thrash metal band maybe.

I don't rate Phil Selway that much. Try listening to Gavin Harrison (Porcupine Tree), Danny Carey (Tool) or Neil Peart (Rush)

Gavin H's work with 'rhymic illusions' and odd time sigs are fantastic - lots of stuff on youtube.

[Obiwonkeyblokey]

hmmmm Neil Peart, listen to some rush and then listen to "Burning for Buddy" demonstrating incredibale variety and technique in various styles.

[monthefish]

garycat said:

monthefish said:

I think, like many instruments, speed of play marks out the 'great' from the 'good'.

Only for a death thrash metal band maybe.

Rubbish.

A talented drummer will be able to play faster (whilst retaining precision) than an average drummer. Whether they choose to do so, or whether their prefferrred style of music lends itself to fast druming, is a seperate matter.

Look up any video on 'Youtube' etc with a title "great drumming" (or similar) and 99% of the clips will include some very quick sections (even if the overall piece isn't particularly quick).

Edited by monthefish on Tuesday 13th July 13:20

[james_gt3rs]

theboyfold said:

I'm not that musical in terms of being able to play anything at all...

Me neither, but I can still tell a good drummer. Favourites include Dave Lombardo (Slayer), Bill Ward (Black Sabbath), and Nick Menza (Megadeth).

And the sound of the drums is as important as how they're played for me.

[HereBeMonsters]

There are a lot of different styles, and different masters of each.

My favourites are John Bonham, Tré Cool and Dave Grohl, but mainly because I like the style of music they play. Travis Barker is also amazing.

[KB_S1]

Watch this

Great drummers know what to play, when to play it and how loud to play it.
They also know when to not play something.

Technical rudimentary stuff like consistent meter, consistent striking of the drums and correct patterns are important.
Bending and improvising around that is what makes great drummers.

Look up guys like Bobby Graham and Bernard Purdie for some amazing stuff.


edited for formatting numptiness

Edited by KB_S1 on Tuesday 13th July 14:39

[FasterFreddy]

KB_S1 said:

Watch [this|http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVGotpIxkGU&feature=related[/url]

Great drummers know what to play, when to play it and how loud to play it.
They also know when to not play something.

Technical rudimentary stuff like consistent meter, consistent striking of the drums and correct patterns are important.
Bending and improvising around that is what makes great drummers.

Look up guys like Bobby Graham and Bernard Purdie for some amazing stuff.

Ah, Joe Morello. Everything seems so effortless when you watch him play.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzL7_P1_2qE&NR=...

Edited by FasterFreddy on Tuesday 13th July 14:40

[Asterix]

As with a lot of musicians, the very good ones know when 'less is more'.

A solid rhythm section often holds the band together - the very best drummers are vital to the overall sound of the band and can be irreplacable - Led Zeppelin is possibly the most obvious example.

[HereBeMonsters]

Asterix said:

As with a lot of musicians, the very good ones know when 'less is more'.

A solid rhythm section often holds the band together - the very best drummers are vital to the overall sound of the band and can be irreplacable - Led Zeppelin is possibly the most obvious example.

Look at how many bands hit the big time when they got a decent drummer: Nirvana, Green Day and Blink 182 are just three I can think of this second.

[Asterix]

HereBeMonsters said:

Asterix said:

As with a lot of musicians, the very good ones know when 'less is more'.

A solid rhythm section often holds the band together - the very best drummers are vital to the overall sound of the band and can be irreplacable - Led Zeppelin is possibly the most obvious example.

Look at how many bands hit the big time when they got a decent drummer: Nirvana, Green Day and Blink 182 are just three I can think of this second.

Agreed - back in the day, when my old band started out, we tried a number of drummers, mates and aquaintances etc.. and they never really worked out. Something was always lacking. We decided to do a formal audition and because there was already a bit of a buzz we had a pretty good turnout. Over two days we auditioned loads. Most lasted around 15 minutes as we knew they weren't right and then on the 2nd afternoon this guy turns up and we jammed for over 2 hours - there you go! Re-recorded some demos and 3 months later got signed.

[Nom de ploom]

I thought Cozy Powell was right up there, but with so many genres it's difficult to say who is good v great,

great jazz drummers v great rock drummers - hard to judge.

my genre will obviously lead to rock / metal - Lars Ulrich on Justice for all is 10 times better than Lars on St. Anger.

nicko mcbrain is apparently underrated - check out infinite dreams for the whole shabang or techniques.

the drummers for Vai (can't remember his name) and Satriani (jeff campitelli) have to cope with intricacy, timing changes etc... technically difficult stuff I would say

[300bhp/ton]

theboyfold said:

I'm not that musical in terms of being able to play anything at all, so I don't understand drumming at all. Out of all the bands I love, the only drummer I could pick out of a crowd is Phil Selway from Radiohead, allegedly he's the 26th best drummer of all time!

So what makes a good drummer? Who are the greats and what makes them great? And what's so different about Mr Selway's drumming that a Luddite like me can pick it out?

I may go against the grain, but being great is often a mix of different things. On one hand you have pure technical ability. With drumming that would be a mix of speed and complex beats and rhythms.

However there's that other element which requires the person to be able to actually write and create music. This is possible more leveled at other instruments than drums, but it still applies. While gigging I've seen and heard some superb, totally brilliant musicians. Able to cover stuff from bands like Gun's N' Roses, Led Zep, Hendrix and many others you usually don't hear covered. Yet as soon as they played an original track they pretty much sucked by comparison.

Being a drummer you also need to work with a band and other people more so than some other instruments, you are the core of the music, get it wrong and everyone else will get it wrong too.


As for favourite drummers, well I'd have to go for the likes of Mitch Michell, John Bonham, Ginger Baker and Keith Moon.

Although on a personal note I'm a huge fan of the music and drums of Patrick Carney from the fabulous "The Black Keys" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_Keys

[Stablelad]

The key is how easy they make it look.......

http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=UJsybbSHfx4&fe...

[GoBig]

Bill Bruford.

[Z06George]

In my eyes these are some of the greatest drummers ever in varying genres..
Gene Krupa
Buddy Rich
Alan Ganley
Andy Leask-The best drumer in the world for learning the moellar method
Jim Chapin
Nicko McBrain
Travis Barker
Keith Moon
Ralph Salmons
Aaron Spears
Thomas Lang
There are quite a lot more greats, but I felt a lot of these are unknown and should be known if your a drummer. Also as previously said playing as a band member is crucial, this is why I've gotten into the American drumlines and bands as they as so together physically and musically.

Edited by Z06George on Tuesday 13th July 20:17

Edited by Z06George on Thursday 18th April 10:33

[Durruti]

GoBig said:

Bill Bruford.

Agreed. And don't forget Ginger Baker.

[kiteless]

Z06George said:

In my eyes these are some of the greatest drummers ever in varying genres..
Gene Krupa
Buddy Rich

Proper, fully paid up, skin-bashing legends those two IMHO.

[theboyfold]

garycat said:

I don't rate Phil Selway that much.

Why don't you rate him much? That's what I can't quantify at the moment, what is it that you don't like about him?

KB_S1 said:

Watch this

Great drummers know what to play, when to play it and how loud to play it.
They also know when to not play something.

Technical rudimentary stuff like consistent meter, consistent striking of the drums and correct patterns are important.
Bending and improvising around that is what makes great drummers.

Look up guys like Bobby Graham and Bernard Purdie for some amazing stuff.


edited for formatting numptiness

Edited by KB_S1 on Tuesday 13th July 14:39

Interesting reply, thanks for that. I have to say the style in your link is much more appealing, rather than some of the ultra fast stuff. There seems to be much more 'craft' in what he's doing. Like you said, he seems to have a really good control and sense of level. The way he seems to change the timing, is that a particular skill or one that's pretty much fundamental to drumming? That might sound like a silly question, but I'm pretty much a novice when it comes to music!

Edited by theboyfold on Tuesday 13th July 22:54