A good intermediate violin?
Discussion
My better half has been playing the violin for a couple of years now and has started dropping hints that she could do with a new instrument. We don't have a violin shop anywhere near us, but I would like to surprise her. I know these things can be very subjective, so I probably intend on asking her music teacher to let her try a couple during a lesson so she can pick one, but I'd like to at least have a couple of models in mind to ask him about.
I know these things can get very expensive, but she's still learning, so I think something between £500-£1000 would suit. I don't know if new or old is the best way to go. I know good quality 'old' violins can cost a fortune, but would a second hand instrument be better value, or is a new instrument likely to offer better performance and long term value?
Any advice or links to recommended violins for sale would be great.
I know these things can get very expensive, but she's still learning, so I think something between £500-£1000 would suit. I don't know if new or old is the best way to go. I know good quality 'old' violins can cost a fortune, but would a second hand instrument be better value, or is a new instrument likely to offer better performance and long term value?
Any advice or links to recommended violins for sale would be great.
This is a nice idea, but every violin is unique - she should really try before she buys. The more you spend the more future-proof (in terms of her abilities) the instrument will be, so I would spend as much as you can afford, basically. There will be quite a difference between a £1000 and a £500 violin, and £1000 is a lot of money to spend on something that's not as good for her as it could be.
New violins tend to be either cheap student models (~£100) or rather more expensive (several thousand upwards). An old violin will be absolutely fine in terms of performance - a new violin needs to be played in over a period of several years, and will improve with age. Violins don't really depreciate if treated well. Bear in mind that plenty of people are playing violins that are 200 years old and still sound fantastic.
Best thing to do is go to a good violin shop, or a very good general music shop and ask advice. They should be able to let her try one she likes for a few weeks. They can also help with setting it up well - leave £50 - £100 in the budget for strings etc.
Does she have a good bow, or would that be another purchase? They're normally bought separately.
Cheers,
Nick
New violins tend to be either cheap student models (~£100) or rather more expensive (several thousand upwards). An old violin will be absolutely fine in terms of performance - a new violin needs to be played in over a period of several years, and will improve with age. Violins don't really depreciate if treated well. Bear in mind that plenty of people are playing violins that are 200 years old and still sound fantastic.
Best thing to do is go to a good violin shop, or a very good general music shop and ask advice. They should be able to let her try one she likes for a few weeks. They can also help with setting it up well - leave £50 - £100 in the budget for strings etc.
Does she have a good bow, or would that be another purchase? They're normally bought separately.
Cheers,
Nick
Thanks for the reply Nick. I think the point you made about price is very valid. Spending closer to £500 would probably be the better option for now, unless I fork out a couple of grand and get something that will see her right though, which I'm happy to do - if it's the right/sensible thing to do. However, would it be almost pointless at this stage?
She currently has a pretty good bow. I got her one as a surprise before her last grade exam. Her music teacher got a couple in, then she was able to try them and pick the one she liked best. I was hoping to do a similar thing with a violin because there aren't any good/specialist shops anywhere near us. Our closes good music shop is in Chester, but they only really do starter kits up to around £200. Our closest specialist is over 75 miles away.
She currently has a pretty good bow. I got her one as a surprise before her last grade exam. Her music teacher got a couple in, then she was able to try them and pick the one she liked best. I was hoping to do a similar thing with a violin because there aren't any good/specialist shops anywhere near us. Our closes good music shop is in Chester, but they only really do starter kits up to around £200. Our closest specialist is over 75 miles away.
A £1000 - £2000 violin should last someone who has been playing for two years a long time - potentially the rest of their life, if it's reasonable value. Would a £500 violin be much of an upgrade on what she has now?
That's good, that she's got a bow - violins are a bit more involved though, and deserve a longer selection process. Her music teacher may be able to offer some more advice.
On a personal note - I started playing the violin when I was nine, on a beginners violin. I upgraded to a half decent full size one when I was about thirteen, and it made a real difference to my playing. Then I was given my grandads* violin (which is excellent) when I was seventeen, and it made all the difference in the world - it allowed me to play in half decent ensembles, it made me more enthusiastic, it made me feel like this was something worth doing well. So getting (relative) beginners good violins is a very good thing to do.
Cheers,
Nick
That's good, that she's got a bow - violins are a bit more involved though, and deserve a longer selection process. Her music teacher may be able to offer some more advice.
On a personal note - I started playing the violin when I was nine, on a beginners violin. I upgraded to a half decent full size one when I was about thirteen, and it made a real difference to my playing. Then I was given my grandads* violin (which is excellent) when I was seventeen, and it made all the difference in the world - it allowed me to play in half decent ensembles, it made me more enthusiastic, it made me feel like this was something worth doing well. So getting (relative) beginners good violins is a very good thing to do.
Cheers,
Nick
- My grandad was dead by then, I didn't deprive an old man of his only pleasure, or anything!
The violin she has was bought as part of a student kit (Andreas Zeller - Stentor). Her teacher was quite impressed with the sound initially, but she has really moved on from that and it's quite 'bright'. Would moving up to something double the value not really make that much difference then?
I really don't know much about violins at all. I have been trying to learn a bit stealthily. Unlike me, where I always want to get the best I can afford, my wife is quite humble and I know that she wouldn't suggest something expensive if I left it up to her. But if getting a good one is the thing to do, then I'd love to get her one.
I'll no doubt speak to her teacher, but I'd like to be armed with a few examples.
I have been reading contradictory opinions on Chinese makers (mostly American). Some people say they offer better value up to £1000 and other people advise steering well clear. My initial thoughts were that I would prefer European, but now I am unsure! Any thoughts?
I really don't know much about violins at all. I have been trying to learn a bit stealthily. Unlike me, where I always want to get the best I can afford, my wife is quite humble and I know that she wouldn't suggest something expensive if I left it up to her. But if getting a good one is the thing to do, then I'd love to get her one.
I'll no doubt speak to her teacher, but I'd like to be armed with a few examples.
I have been reading contradictory opinions on Chinese makers (mostly American). Some people say they offer better value up to £1000 and other people advise steering well clear. My initial thoughts were that I would prefer European, but now I am unsure! Any thoughts?
£250 violin --> £500 violin, a noticeable but not massive difference.
For the £1000+ range, it doesn't really matter where the maker is from - you just need your wife to fall in love with that particular violin. (She may like a certain £1000 violin more than a different instrument valued at £5000.) A guy might make three violins in one month, and they could all be quite different. So you can't really say "these models might be appropriate" because models of handmade violins don't exist in the same way as, say, Porsche sell a number of different models of car. It's more like buying a vintage car, where each one is now one of a kind, and the purchase is made more with the heart than the head. Or a better analogy might be buying a horse.
My advice is - talk to her teacher, as they may know of some for sale, and will certainly be able to offer advice. Don't worry about not knowing what you are talking about re models etc. If I was buying a violin for myself I wouldn't have a clue what might be appropriate before I got to the shop and I don't think many of my musical friends would either.
Then go to a violin/music shop, and spend a very happy afternoon talking to a nice chap there and find something appropriate for her to try for a few weeks.
Couple of other thoughts - you might need to buy a case as well, and she'll be able to sell her old violin (presumably) to take the sting out of the cost. They may well trade it in at the shop, in which case(!) you can keep the old case probably.
Cheers,
Nick
For the £1000+ range, it doesn't really matter where the maker is from - you just need your wife to fall in love with that particular violin. (She may like a certain £1000 violin more than a different instrument valued at £5000.) A guy might make three violins in one month, and they could all be quite different. So you can't really say "these models might be appropriate" because models of handmade violins don't exist in the same way as, say, Porsche sell a number of different models of car. It's more like buying a vintage car, where each one is now one of a kind, and the purchase is made more with the heart than the head. Or a better analogy might be buying a horse.
My advice is - talk to her teacher, as they may know of some for sale, and will certainly be able to offer advice. Don't worry about not knowing what you are talking about re models etc. If I was buying a violin for myself I wouldn't have a clue what might be appropriate before I got to the shop and I don't think many of my musical friends would either.
Then go to a violin/music shop, and spend a very happy afternoon talking to a nice chap there and find something appropriate for her to try for a few weeks.
Couple of other thoughts - you might need to buy a case as well, and she'll be able to sell her old violin (presumably) to take the sting out of the cost. They may well trade it in at the shop, in which case(!) you can keep the old case probably.
Cheers,
Nick
Lots of violin threads here at the mo!
As said on the other thread, my wife is a professional violinist / teacher so I've asked her for her opinion!
£50 should see you into a perfectly good case.
Stentor do many different models of violin - generally their top of the range violins are very good and make excellent intermediate instruments. Arcadia or Elysia, or at a pinch Messina.
http://www.stentor-music.com/stentor%20violins.htm...
As said on the other thread, my wife is a professional violinist / teacher so I've asked her for her opinion!
EliseNick said:
New violins tend to be either cheap student models (~£100) or rather more expensive (several thousand upwards). An old violin will be absolutely fine in terms of performance - a new violin needs to be played in over a period of several years, and will improve with age. Violins don't really depreciate if treated well. Bear in mind that plenty of people are playing violins that are 200 years old and still sound fantastic.
There's no real cutoff point with new violins - you can buy them at any price point. They do need to be played in of course - but there is no guarantee that an older violin is any good! If it hasn't been played for a few years it will have gone backwards in terms of performance and playability - they need to be played! Having said that, I know violinists who play on 10 year old instruments who sound great, just like those who play on much older instruments. A new instrument can be a bit of a gamble though.EliseNick said:
Best thing to do is go to a good violin shop, or a very good general music shop and ask advice. They should be able to let her try one she likes for a few weeks. They can also help with setting it up well - leave £50 - £100 in the budget for strings etc.
If you're spending that sort of money you need to be going to a violin shop rather than general music shops - it may be 75 miles away but it's your only option I'm afraid! A general music shop just won't know enough. Generally you can get an instrument on approval for a week or two but probably no more. Budget £40 for a top of the range set of strings. New strings on her current violin could make it sound a lot better too, helping with the bright sound.EliseNick said:
That's good, that she's got a bow - violins are a bit more involved though, and deserve a longer selection process. Her music teacher may be able to offer some more advice.
Bows are no easier to choose than violins, it's a very personal thing and she'll need to spend some time making up her own mind, with guidance from her teacher. Try to play it in different places too, not just in your living room or wherever! Generally the bow should be around 1/4 - 1/3 of the value of the violin.£50 should see you into a perfectly good case.
Stentor do many different models of violin - generally their top of the range violins are very good and make excellent intermediate instruments. Arcadia or Elysia, or at a pinch Messina.
http://www.stentor-music.com/stentor%20violins.htm...
Again, thanks for the tips guys. Manchester is about 85 miles from me, so it's probably worth a trip over one day (without the kids!)
The first thing Mrs AJ's violin teacher did was replace her strings with the ones he uses, so there should be no problem there, I just think she has outgrown her starter violin.
The first thing Mrs AJ's violin teacher did was replace her strings with the ones he uses, so there should be no problem there, I just think she has outgrown her starter violin.
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