Sbach 342. Stunning.
Discussion
http://www.xtremeair.de/web/342.php
I finally got my flight in the 342 at Waltham on Saturday. The previous day the 420 degrees a second roll rate took one of my mates by surprise, and he cracked the canopy with his head, which delayed things a bit.
Philipp Steinbach (hence the 'Sbach') and the rest of the XtremeAir people have just raised the bar in Unlimited aerobatic flying by about 20%, IMHO. They've been flying the type for three years or so, but have just achieved EASA certification, which will open the floodgates in terms of orders and aircraft sold.
It completely eclipses the Extra 300 in every respect. The owner of the only Zivko Edge 450 on the UK register flew in the Sbach just after I did, and I think he'll be after one before too long. Gerald Cooper, long time Cap 232 driver, is now the Sbach UK sales agent, and is itching to get his single seat Sbach 300 up and running. He says the 342 will do pretty much everything the Cap 232 will do, without worrying about tearing the tail off - and this is the two-seat version.
I've been lucky enough to have experienced what the 300 is ultimately capable of with some of the best competition and display pilots in the UK, so I asked Philipp to demonstrate precisely why the 342 is superior to the Extra, without knowing quite what I was letting myself in for. He did exactly what I asked him to do.
Full deflection rolls at 225kts would have things start to fall off the Extra - perfectly safe in the Sbach (provided you're expecting it, see above). The vertical rolling performance is stunning - 7g pull up from 220kts, we started rolling and I simply lost count of the rotations - just became a blur.
Flick rolls at 160kts, but after the Vne full deflection rolls that almost seemed tame.
But isn't simply about the brute strength and efficiency of the airframe (more slippery than greased racing weasle pooh off a polished teflon shovel) - Philipp has designed some form of voodoo into the performance of the wing which means it remains controllable at practically zero airspeed. Flat spin recovery was simply a matter of applying opposite rudder, and flying horizontally out of it. Ditto tumble recovery. Try that in anything else, flick city. Utterly, utterly gob-smacking.
Now that the Sbach is certified, there will be a *lot* of used Extra 300s on the market, and I can see the Sbach having a major impact on the prospect of new sales for Extra. They had the opportunity of building the Sbach themselves, and they blew it. The busted canopy this weekend might have cost 3k Euros, but I reckon they generated three or four firm sales from Waltham alone, and at 320K Euros a pop, that's good business.
The certification aspect is crucial. It means you can operate these things for commercial flight training. For years the Extra was the only certified platform even vaguely approaching Unlimited perfomance that the general public could experience, and they've rested on their laurels for far too long. The Sbach completely changes the game. The issue becomes how fast the orders can be confirmed and the production slots booked.
I think inside of the year at least one Sbach 342 will be operating on a commercial basis in the UK, not a million miles from where I'm typing this. If you've ever tried the Extra 300 experience, and enjoyed it, then get yourself in an Sbach. Trust me, you won't regret it.
I finally got my flight in the 342 at Waltham on Saturday. The previous day the 420 degrees a second roll rate took one of my mates by surprise, and he cracked the canopy with his head, which delayed things a bit.
Philipp Steinbach (hence the 'Sbach') and the rest of the XtremeAir people have just raised the bar in Unlimited aerobatic flying by about 20%, IMHO. They've been flying the type for three years or so, but have just achieved EASA certification, which will open the floodgates in terms of orders and aircraft sold.
It completely eclipses the Extra 300 in every respect. The owner of the only Zivko Edge 450 on the UK register flew in the Sbach just after I did, and I think he'll be after one before too long. Gerald Cooper, long time Cap 232 driver, is now the Sbach UK sales agent, and is itching to get his single seat Sbach 300 up and running. He says the 342 will do pretty much everything the Cap 232 will do, without worrying about tearing the tail off - and this is the two-seat version.
I've been lucky enough to have experienced what the 300 is ultimately capable of with some of the best competition and display pilots in the UK, so I asked Philipp to demonstrate precisely why the 342 is superior to the Extra, without knowing quite what I was letting myself in for. He did exactly what I asked him to do.
Full deflection rolls at 225kts would have things start to fall off the Extra - perfectly safe in the Sbach (provided you're expecting it, see above). The vertical rolling performance is stunning - 7g pull up from 220kts, we started rolling and I simply lost count of the rotations - just became a blur.
Flick rolls at 160kts, but after the Vne full deflection rolls that almost seemed tame.
But isn't simply about the brute strength and efficiency of the airframe (more slippery than greased racing weasle pooh off a polished teflon shovel) - Philipp has designed some form of voodoo into the performance of the wing which means it remains controllable at practically zero airspeed. Flat spin recovery was simply a matter of applying opposite rudder, and flying horizontally out of it. Ditto tumble recovery. Try that in anything else, flick city. Utterly, utterly gob-smacking.
Now that the Sbach is certified, there will be a *lot* of used Extra 300s on the market, and I can see the Sbach having a major impact on the prospect of new sales for Extra. They had the opportunity of building the Sbach themselves, and they blew it. The busted canopy this weekend might have cost 3k Euros, but I reckon they generated three or four firm sales from Waltham alone, and at 320K Euros a pop, that's good business.
The certification aspect is crucial. It means you can operate these things for commercial flight training. For years the Extra was the only certified platform even vaguely approaching Unlimited perfomance that the general public could experience, and they've rested on their laurels for far too long. The Sbach completely changes the game. The issue becomes how fast the orders can be confirmed and the production slots booked.
I think inside of the year at least one Sbach 342 will be operating on a commercial basis in the UK, not a million miles from where I'm typing this. If you've ever tried the Extra 300 experience, and enjoyed it, then get yourself in an Sbach. Trust me, you won't regret it.
Edited by eharding on Monday 18th April 22:51
Simpo Two said:
Does this mean it will become the weapon of choice in the Red Bull Air Races or is that a different thing altogether?
They would be, but for the fact, IMHO, that the Red Bull races are dead.Once it got to the point people were so far over the ragged edge that they started hitting the water, the writing was on the wall. The sponsor's feet got very cold, and so did the manufacturers. XtremeAir, I understand, became very reluctant to get involved even before the crashes in the final season.
Red Bull are still involved with display teams, though, and the Red Bull Matadors - Bonhomme and Jones, the best formation display duo anywhere - are sacking the Sukhois and going Sbach.
XtremeAir ceased trading during covid.
Liftify have taken over the type certificate. What are the risks of buying a used one?
https://liftify.aero
Liftify have taken over the type certificate. What are the risks of buying a used one?
https://liftify.aero
Gunso said:
XtremeAir ceased trading during covid.
What are the risks of buying a used one?
For the XA42, risk of positive elevator control restriction if there is someone of enjoys their food in the front seat? To be fair, that was a risk when buying new as well.What are the risks of buying a used one?
You'd have to take a view on the long term viability of the new type certificate holder - and, I'd guess given the relatively small size of the fleet they're supporting - 3 in the UK - and no prospect of that there will be any more quite how much of a margin they're going to have to make on supporting the type to stay in business, but spares and support for anything comparable are never going to be cheap.
As an aside, I'm wondering how 12 years went past so quickly. Things looked a lot different for XtremeAir back then, but after Philipp Steinbach went off to start Game Composites they'd basically lost their engineering and development talent, and were surviving on supporting the existing aircraft. Still stunning bits of kit though, but the world has moved on in a decade and there are now equally capable types in current production from other manufacturers.
eharding said:
Still stunning bits of kit though, but the world has moved on in a decade and there are now equally capable types in current production from other manufacturers.
Yes - but at x3 the price! I appreciate your thoughts.Hoping to increase the number registered in the UK soon.
There's an airworthiness directive to be aware of regarding cracking engine mounts. From my understanding, replacement of the mount doesn't fix the risk of cracks, so again you'd be reliant on the continued existence of the type certificate holder - https://ad.easa.europa.eu/ad/2019-0239R1
Gassing Station | Boats, Planes & Trains | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff