Any pilots in the house?
Discussion
My son (now 17) is keen on looking at a career in aviation, namely being a pilot. Google has thrown up some useful advice, but its mostly made up of various flight schools flogging their wares. He's keen on going down the commercial route rather than RAF and we are aware of the huge costs involved. I suppose it's these large fees that are making us very cautious as to where we focus our attention - so any real world advice would be very much appreciated.
Hi, there are quite a few of us. I'm flying shortly but someone will come and add more I'm sure.
Due to the big investments it's a good idea to start with getting a Class 1 medical. This avoids the disaster of spending money on training to then find you can't pass the medical.
The pilot demand is very cyclical. There appears to be a world shortage beginning now. Things change fast of course with global events.
I suspect big airlines will be setting up schemes to help recruit. Hard to say how good they'll be but may help a fair bit with loans etc.
Best of luck.
Mabbs
Due to the big investments it's a good idea to start with getting a Class 1 medical. This avoids the disaster of spending money on training to then find you can't pass the medical.
The pilot demand is very cyclical. There appears to be a world shortage beginning now. Things change fast of course with global events.
I suspect big airlines will be setting up schemes to help recruit. Hard to say how good they'll be but may help a fair bit with loans etc.
Best of luck.
Mabbs
I'm not a pilot, but I did once chance my luck at getting a place on the BA Pilot Scholarship. Airlines do run schemes where they fund the training on a loan basis. Basically it ties you in to them on a reduced salary until the loan is re-paid. Although having given up on that particular career dream a number of years ago I'm not sure what the current situation is. I know that the competition for the BA scheme was fierce (6,500 applicants for 74 places on mine).
Try googling all of the UK based airlines and include words like 'pilot training scholarship scheme'.
I do occasionally see the Bristow course advertised if he fancies helicopters.
Also worth understanding the recent news articles about a number of flight training schools collapsing taking student down payments (Mum & Dad's remortgage) with them!
Good luck.
Try googling all of the UK based airlines and include words like 'pilot training scholarship scheme'.
I do occasionally see the Bristow course advertised if he fancies helicopters.
Also worth understanding the recent news articles about a number of flight training schools collapsing taking student down payments (Mum & Dad's remortgage) with them!
Good luck.
LimaDelta said:
I'm sure there will be better qualified contributors, but I'd echo the comments above. Medical first (class 1), be wary of paying large amounts upfront, and finally - is this just something he fancies, or does he have any flying experience yet?
No real world experience per se, just a couple of professional simulators (737) and a full MS Flight Simulator set up at home (curved monitor / Boeing controls etc) he was / is phenominal on both, and was since he was 14. The MS set up is unreal.I've flown several planes, including an RAF Chipmunk in my cadet days
Sim75 said:
LimaDelta said:
I'm sure there will be better qualified contributors, but I'd echo the comments above. Medical first (class 1), be wary of paying large amounts upfront, and finally - is this just something he fancies, or does he have any flying experience yet?
No real world experience per se, just a couple of professional simulators (737) and a full MS Flight Simulator set up at home (curved monitor / Boeing controls etc) he was / is phenominal on both, and was since he was 14. The MS set up is unreal.I've flown several planes, including an RAF Chipmunk in my cadet days
Many years ago, when I had aspirations to be a pilot (until I realised I would be useless at it) I was told that it would be worthwhile to take up gliding as a relatively cheap way of learning basic handling and airmanship etc. The Pilots on here will offer better advice but at the time I thought it sounded like a good idea to see if I had any basic aptitude (I didn’t) and whether I actually liked flying or not.
I would echo gliding - I am not a pilot but I did buy my GF a gliding lesson and half the chaps there were current or retired pilots. I hear its good fun, and the networking must be worth while. Its also relatively cheap. Certainly it was a pleasant place to be whilst she was up; everyone was nice etc.
The other thing I might venture is; is he sure he doesn't fancy the RAF? An old boy I was talking to at the gliding club reckoned it was more fun than his airline days; the aircraft and the flying is much more exciting. It will also save you a lot of money.....
The other thing I might venture is; is he sure he doesn't fancy the RAF? An old boy I was talking to at the gliding club reckoned it was more fun than his airline days; the aircraft and the flying is much more exciting. It will also save you a lot of money.....
Definitely Class 1 medical first. Then some trial lessons and then, I’d argue, at least up to first solo to see whether he has the aptitude and ability.
Sounds harsh but some people just aren’t very good at it, sometimes due to ability and sometimes due to personality! Some of them make it through with determination but are destined to being a lifelong First Officer - which is fine, but not really what you go into this for. I do know a few guys who did their licences but never flew professionally which always seemed like a waste to me.
What type of flying does he want to do? Everyone’s different but I can’t see why anyone would aspire to bashing about in a Ryanair 737, good money but would be soul crushing for me!
Edit: Oh and you definitely need to have him speak to someone about the negatives and downsides, there are quite a lot of those!
Sounds harsh but some people just aren’t very good at it, sometimes due to ability and sometimes due to personality! Some of them make it through with determination but are destined to being a lifelong First Officer - which is fine, but not really what you go into this for. I do know a few guys who did their licences but never flew professionally which always seemed like a waste to me.
What type of flying does he want to do? Everyone’s different but I can’t see why anyone would aspire to bashing about in a Ryanair 737, good money but would be soul crushing for me!
Edit: Oh and you definitely need to have him speak to someone about the negatives and downsides, there are quite a lot of those!
Edited by Crumpet on Monday 3rd July 15:31
Intresting topic as my 12 yr old is set on becoming a pilot. he si great academically, ive been pushing mats and physics to him. He is joining air cadets and once he is 16 im going to pay for his class 1 medical and setting him with monthly flight lessons just so that he has hours in the air. I'm hoping he will go the RAF route so going university and studying an aerospace course of some sort and going the uni UTOC. Is there anything else you think will help?
phil-sti said:
Intresting topic as my 12 yr old is set on becoming a pilot. he si great academically, ive been pushing mats and physics to him. He is joining air cadets and once he is 16 im going to pay for his class 1 medical and setting him with monthly flight lessons just so that he has hours in the air. I'm hoping he will go the RAF route so going university and studying an aerospace course of some sort and going the uni UTOC. Is there anything else you think will help?
Mine is doing Maths and Physics A Level - get him on MS Flight along with an Airbus / Thrustmaster setup, its phenominal (and addictive for us dads).You can set it to live weather and he can experience any airport in the world - the graphics and sound are mesmerising.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3xp-SnZDoY
I also got him this for his X Box series X
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Thrustmaster-TCA-Captain-...
He needs to have passion for it....its quite easy to do if you have the funds (and a bit of spatial awareness)
Cost me £80k back in the day then 2008 came along and bit me on the bum, the guys in my ATPL class that are still doing it now is down to their ambition, its not just a job at the end of the day....
Cost me £80k back in the day then 2008 came along and bit me on the bum, the guys in my ATPL class that are still doing it now is down to their ambition, its not just a job at the end of the day....
rallye101 said:
He needs to have passion for it....its quite easy to do if you have the funds (and a bit of spatial awareness)
Cost me £80k back in the day then 2008 came along and bit me on the bum, the guys in my ATPL class that are still doing it now is down to their ambition, its not just a job at the end of the day....
What do you mean "bit you on the bum" fella?Cost me £80k back in the day then 2008 came along and bit me on the bum, the guys in my ATPL class that are still doing it now is down to their ambition, its not just a job at the end of the day....
Hi
I’ve been an airline pilot for over 35 years, it has been a fantastic career. However, things are not as good as they were.
Getting a class 1 medical is a great suggestion. The subjects he is studying are great, the thing about pilots are they have to have an aptitude for flying. Very few pilots have first class degrees!
I was very impressed with a young lad I was in the simulator with recently. He knew a lot about the systems and was very good at following the flight director. In the cruise with the autopilot engaged I asked him what our ground speed was, 300 kts he said, so how many miles per minute are we doing I asked, I didn’t get a correct reply!
I believe TUI recently had 8500 applications for 12 places on a cadet program.
I would also suggest getting him to a local flying school for a few lessons, flying an aeroplane is very different to flying a home simulator. Also a lot of ex airline pilots are teaching PPLs, ask them about lifestyle, home life and redundancy!
All the best.
I’ve been an airline pilot for over 35 years, it has been a fantastic career. However, things are not as good as they were.
Getting a class 1 medical is a great suggestion. The subjects he is studying are great, the thing about pilots are they have to have an aptitude for flying. Very few pilots have first class degrees!
I was very impressed with a young lad I was in the simulator with recently. He knew a lot about the systems and was very good at following the flight director. In the cruise with the autopilot engaged I asked him what our ground speed was, 300 kts he said, so how many miles per minute are we doing I asked, I didn’t get a correct reply!
I believe TUI recently had 8500 applications for 12 places on a cadet program.
I would also suggest getting him to a local flying school for a few lessons, flying an aeroplane is very different to flying a home simulator. Also a lot of ex airline pilots are teaching PPLs, ask them about lifestyle, home life and redundancy!
All the best.
Some of the airlines run "tagged" schemes - you pay for the training but you have a very high probability of being employed by them at the end. Easyjet do this, Ryanair have something similar.
I'm not sure what BA do these days but for quite some time it has involved the candidate paying for training.
There are two primary routes - intergrated (>£100k) which is typically an 18-month or so full-time course or modular (many fewer ££ than intergrated) where you train at your own pace and do each component (PPL, ground school, then CPL then IR) separately. Modular is generally less expensive than integrated, some airlines only recruit form the big integrated schools. Once you have got your first job and 500hrs then no-one cares where you trained.
The big employers in the UK are Easyjet and Ryanair - Ryanair don't care so much about where you trained.
Brexit has complicated things - you used to be able to get an EASA licence anywhere in Europe and then try to get a job anywhere in Europe. I got a UK-issued EASA licence from a school in Poland (Bartolini Air) for much les money and in much less time than would have been possible in the UK. Now you would need a UK licence and would only be able to fly for UK operators.
COVID really messed up the industry and the training pipeline - you will need to do your research to understand what the opportunities are. Remember that the schools are there to sell training, not to find you a job.
Don't forget all the add-ons at the end - after getting the licences he will need a CRM course, UPRT, probably some additional training / coaching for the interview and sim-check, and maybe pay for his first type-rating too.
I'm not sure what BA do these days but for quite some time it has involved the candidate paying for training.
There are two primary routes - intergrated (>£100k) which is typically an 18-month or so full-time course or modular (many fewer ££ than intergrated) where you train at your own pace and do each component (PPL, ground school, then CPL then IR) separately. Modular is generally less expensive than integrated, some airlines only recruit form the big integrated schools. Once you have got your first job and 500hrs then no-one cares where you trained.
The big employers in the UK are Easyjet and Ryanair - Ryanair don't care so much about where you trained.
Brexit has complicated things - you used to be able to get an EASA licence anywhere in Europe and then try to get a job anywhere in Europe. I got a UK-issued EASA licence from a school in Poland (Bartolini Air) for much les money and in much less time than would have been possible in the UK. Now you would need a UK licence and would only be able to fly for UK operators.
COVID really messed up the industry and the training pipeline - you will need to do your research to understand what the opportunities are. Remember that the schools are there to sell training, not to find you a job.
Don't forget all the add-ons at the end - after getting the licences he will need a CRM course, UPRT, probably some additional training / coaching for the interview and sim-check, and maybe pay for his first type-rating too.
Edited by this is my username on Monday 3rd July 19:11
my 20-year-old son is over halfway through his training. He's got his PPL and has done his second set of ATPL exams with a 91% average. It's hard going but he's really enjoying it. Beware of any company offering a deal to pay upfront. Tayside aviation went down the tubes a few months ago leaving a lot of people out of pocket.
The thread I started last year:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The thread I started last year:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I'm ex-RAF now flying commercially (helicopters, offshore oil rigs etc). Absolutely love it. There have been quite a few threads on here about becoming a pilot so without sounding like a kn*b it's worth digging through those first as there is some really useful info in it from current airline pilots.
If he is interested in helicopters there are sponsored schemes with Bristow as another poster mentioned. Lots of info about helicopters if he is interested in a thread I made in here a while back (ask a helicopter pilot anything).
All the best - he'll make it if he really really wants to.
If he is interested in helicopters there are sponsored schemes with Bristow as another poster mentioned. Lots of info about helicopters if he is interested in a thread I made in here a while back (ask a helicopter pilot anything).
All the best - he'll make it if he really really wants to.
Sim75 said:
rallye101 said:
He needs to have passion for it....its quite easy to do if you have the funds (and a bit of spatial awareness)
Cost me £80k back in the day then 2008 came along and bit me on the bum, the guys in my ATPL class that are still doing it now is down to their ambition, its not just a job at the end of the day....
What do you mean "bit you on the bum" fella?Cost me £80k back in the day then 2008 came along and bit me on the bum, the guys in my ATPL class that are still doing it now is down to their ambition, its not just a job at the end of the day....
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