NewTempest/FX 6th Gen

Author
Discussion

Boom78

Original Poster:

1,325 posts

55 months

Friday 9th December 2022
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I’m guessing you’ve seen the news on the merger of the Tempest and Japanese FX programmes. This has got to be very positive news hasn’t it? Real appetite and decent funding. The renderings look a bit generic at the moment but it will be very interesting to see it develop.


Tony1963

5,321 posts

169 months

Friday 9th December 2022
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Italy involved too.

IanH755

1,998 posts

127 months

Friday 9th December 2022
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This is effectively going to be a "non-ITAR" F-35 i.e. every end user loves what the F-35 can do when its in the air, but hates the lack of support/parts due to Lockheed & US Government hassle, so people are clubbing together to make a "non-ITAR" version of the aircraft and add a whole bunch of improvements at the same time.

From practical use, the electronic software which controls everything related to the F-35 when its on the ground (maintenance, mission planning, spare parts, support equipment, digital records for all of the previous etc) called ALIS is just awful for the end user (groundcrew/maintainer etc) so just having Tempest using something different for all that software (the Typhoon version is very well regarded) would be a huge bonus. Then you add in all the bonuses that a lack of US "interference" comes with when selecting parts, build locations etc.

However, whilst the engine/airframe and avionics are all really well covered by the partner nations, one area the Tempest may struggle is that, despite BAES etc building a large part of the F-35, the specialised "Low Observability" paints, coatings & material science were all proprietary to Lockheed with no-one so far named as partners having any LO experience.

Mave

8,209 posts

222 months

Friday 9th December 2022
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IanH755 said:
This is effectively going to be a "non-ITAR" F-35 i.e. every end user loves what the F-35 can do when its in the air, but hates the lack of support/parts due to Lockheed & US Government hassle, so people are clubbing together to make a "non-ITAR" version of the aircraft and add a whole bunch of improvements at the same time.

From practical use, the electronic software which controls everything related to the F-35 when its on the ground (maintenance, mission planning, spare parts, support equipment, digital records for all of the previous etc) called ALIS is just awful for the end user (groundcrew/maintainer etc) so just having Tempest using something different for all that software (the Typhoon version is very well regarded) would be a huge bonus. Then you add in all the bonuses that a lack of US "interference" comes with when selecting parts, build locations etc.

However, whilst the engine/airframe and avionics are all really well covered by the partner nations, one area the Tempest may struggle is that, despite BAES etc building a large part of the F-35, the specialised "Low Observability" paints, coatings & material science were all proprietary to Lockheed with no-one so far named as partners having any LO experience.
Wasnt taranis LO?

Tony1963

5,321 posts

169 months

Friday 9th December 2022
quotequote all
From my slightly different angle, if they can make this aircraft a joy to work on, and if it changes the culture of the RAF into something that’ll greatly improve the recruitment and retention for the RAF, that’ll be a good thing. I’ve heard a few reports that say Marham has had what little joy existed there has got up and gone. No humour, no just having a laugh. Just nose to the grindstone and get on with it. And don’t you dare smile or crack a joke.

IanH755

1,998 posts

127 months

Friday 9th December 2022
quotequote all
Mave said:
Wasnt taranis LO?
Yes, although it has been BAES first and, so far, only attempt at a limited LO but that was nearly 10 years ago as a first attempt for low speed (subsonic) materials and LO material science has jumped at least 2 generations since then, as seen first by the new F-35 paint which replaced the original F-35 paint/coatings in '19-ish and now next generation with the B-21.

Once the BAE Taranis and the Dassault nEUROn projects merged, nothing more has been really shown publicly on any advancement of the project since '14 which doesn't mean that nothing has happened in private, just not publicly.

My guess would be that, if Taranis were to continue development in "secret", we might see both Tempest and Taranis in late 2030's as a rough guess.